244000+ entries in 0.15s
mats: no shortage of
trolls in here
ben_vulpes: good lols, yes, but
the identity attached
to
the registration action is going
to have some splainin
to do
ben_vulpes: Framedragger: re:
the "ownership" of
trilema, i'd like
to know who you suspect would even
try
to register
trilema.com
BingoBoingo: In every case of multiple submissions attached
to
the same btc address
there was a joke
that was great and a lesser joke.
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski:
The one
that didn't suck got
the prize so no saxes.
a111: Logged on 2016-10-21 00:48 mircea_popescu: experience shows it's perfectly fine
to have a philosopher king, however utterly suicidal
to have a philosopher king's
throne. bolt is fine, nut will kill you.
a111: Logged on 2016-11-15 19:30 Framedragger: unless
the latter kind of situation is
to be covered by your clarification,
to quote, "I imagine like any serious country, we first handle
the claims of
the elite privately. "
pete_dushenski: mod6: cheers :D pretty stoked
to be one of
the contest winrars,
though /me also wonders whether saxes or yugos caught BingoBoing's fancy.
scriba: Logged on 2016-11-15: [19:26:43] <mircea_popescu> no dude, when apple.com was registgered it was registered
to a key.
a111: Logged on 2016-11-13 17:38 mircea_popescu: Framedragger note
that i don't particularly see
the value in restrictioning anything. in principle anyone should be able
to register a domain for his bitcent - even if he puts no gpg key in
there. he just won't be able
to admin it, big whoop./
Framedragger: but
then already it is not as simplistic as "whoever owns
the key", no?
Framedragger: unless
the latter kind of situation is
to be covered by your clarification,
to quote, "I imagine like any serious country, we first handle
the claims of
the elite privately. "
☟︎☟︎ Framedragger: mircea_popescu: i (or someone more credible, or whoever) registers "trilema.com" under
their own leigt key. what nao?
mircea_popescu: anyway, ima go
to buy chocolate and do
things, so bbl we can continue.,
mircea_popescu: no dude, when apple.com was registgered it was registered
to a key.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: i guess in your view, perhaps no viable conflicts would arise in gns? say,
two owners of
two distinct pgp keys claiming ownership of "apple.com". some kind of due process is
to
take place, presumably
mircea_popescu: what postel
thinks'd be chaos, much like what jwz
thinks'd be chaos, much like clinton or whoever other of
these niggers and jews
thinks
to be "chnaos" is actually human life.
mircea_popescu: and from
thence it all progresses - no,
the place
to look up needn't be "one across all
the internet", because "otherwise postel
thinks it'd be chaos".
Framedragger: right. how would
the process of resolving conflicts in gns look like,
though? (i'm just curious, i.e. question is well-intentioned, not
troll-y)
mircea_popescu: the imperial idiots implemented
this as dns, which is stupid and braindamaged, but
the implementation being flawed doesn't remove
the fundamental reasons, which is why i say - read
that damned rfc,
the
things i didn't mock are actually correct.
mircea_popescu: everyone-who-participates-in-this-conversation is
the reference point. evidently, if we are
talking about uh i dunno, star
trek,
the names have
to be known and shared. spock can't be
the woman with
the nice ass. how does one join
this conversation ?
there's
two options - either
the usian school of "don't loo kit up - guess, fropm "context", what "it could be" or else - look it up damned it.
to look it up, it has
to be looked
Framedragger: however, an agreed-by-everyone-who-matters symbol context would still be needed. (sorry if interrupting,
trying
to clarify for my own education.)
Framedragger: so
the notion of a local symbol frame/context will be retained inevitably, is
that what you're saying mircea_popescu? (in which case i'd add
that gns-the-implementation could even probably be used - on each interested user's machine - as a local name system. etc.)
mircea_popescu: and who said
they get
to be margraves in
the first place ?
mircea_popescu: (yes you can rape
the woman instead, which is in
this sense deliberate, but i daresay not
the same
thing)
mircea_popescu: for
the same reason "pua" is a horrible dating strategy.
mircea_popescu: life hasn't ended,
the sun still rises,
trilema clearly benefits.
mircea_popescu: i for instance don't credit
the english-online-dictionaries opinions as
to
the meaning of english words.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform alternatively
they could you know, just not credit
THAT root and be done with it.
mircea_popescu: if
tomorrow i wanna call barack obama hussein bahamas, i'll call him
that and he can cry me a river over it.
mircea_popescu: there's exactly nothing wrong for pepsicola and his friends
to discuss pepsicola by "coke.com" in
their own context, and CERTAINLY coca-cola doesn't have nor can aquire some mechanism
to prevent his.
mircea_popescu: (note
that for
the needs of
this discussion - i know because grandfather
told me is a nec plus ultram of buluceala. it's how people know
the earth is flat.)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i would say
the gns as discussed on
trilema drastically reduces it.
Framedragger: i still have a reserved name ('indra', as in reflexive "indra's net" / indrajāla) for my mega decentralized permanent content concept, baked when i was maybe 18 yo lol. in fairness, "indra's net" is a l33t name
that i hope i will use some
time.
mircea_popescu: to get back
to
the fidonet/various attempts
to do independent dns etc -
the very naive "symbol context" = X, be x "an identity" or whatever is a liability. you gotta just let
the context be its own
thing.
mircea_popescu: why
the fuck would any of
this matter ? in a discussion of "that guy" we may either load
the
table where he is written "shithead" or "sir", but in either case we gotta load a
table for crying out loud.
Framedragger: could be a set of particular (and particular only) peers. in any case,
there must be a shared understanding among
the users/elite as
to how
to proceed in face of naming conflicts.
Framedragger: "nexus of hierarchy" connects for me (maybe on some superficial level only)
to kyristor's "The only questions A0 is qualified
to answer are
those for which disputes can be settled entirely
through majority vote of
the entire DHT network" - where
the dht network
mircea_popescu: that's not how it works. i got
this local key-data store ;
the box can't even connect via dns port.
a111: Logged on 2016-11-15 18:37
trinque is not opposed
to doing something with DNS while we still must use it
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform
that's rather
true. real vs conventional hierarchy.
there's
these girls who are slaves ; and
then
there's
these poor but ambitious girls who wish
to be slaves. all
that pretense jazz.
mircea_popescu: the fact
that my definitions of imperial
terminology prevail over
the empire's own definition has nothing
to do with
the fact
that before such a prevailing can
take place,
those definitions must actually exist and be given.
trinque: so
then
the solution must come of "we who matter have connected
to node X for
the
table" and could do otherwise, but don't
mircea_popescu: yes, it works fine in context, yes context frames needn't even map
to identities ; nevertheless - you will have
to have shared symbol
tables.
mircea_popescu: trinque
the words you use must have meanings. even if
they have
the most peculiar of meanings such as nigger = bureaucrat or jew = us agitprop agent ; nevertheless
they must be given. somewhere.
trinque: republican structure of meaning means
there is
this nexus of hierarchy and debate out of which is emitted *the
truth*
trinque: it is not necessarily
that
there cannot be multiple
tables, but perhaps
that one must win
mircea_popescu: really, read
this rfc
thing. it isn't long. where
the fuck is it.
mircea_popescu: you can't standardize "the asking" ebcause
the asking is made out of symbols which have
to be meaningful.
mircea_popescu: we call
this "dns" for historical reasons. but relations
to
the imperial braindamaged implementation are spurious.
mircea_popescu: you will have
to share some portions of
the symbol
tables.
mircea_popescu: even now.
they
try
to pretend otherwise.
that pretense has
to have some light shed on it.
mircea_popescu: "trilema.com is 4.5.6.7 according
to mp. if you believe mp -
then
there you go".
that's a dns record.
trinque: mircea_popescu: no. once I know a key I can interact with deedbot if I can make it
there over gossipd peerings
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "mostly" ie, "until mp requires a definition,
then it all breaks down"
scriba: Logged on 2016-11-15: [18:34:31] <asciilifeform> when you make use of something, successfully, you inevitably come
to rely on it.
this is a cost. i am still paying
the cost for having used a python library in 2013.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: how about: make a proof of concept name system, use it instead of current dns root server set for now, later enable every gossipd user
to run
their own instance of name system if
they prefer
the fully-decentralized-dictionary path;
the initial PoC will still have been useful.
mircea_popescu: you ask your friends what
they
think ; not what
the world is.
mircea_popescu: trinque and if you want
to know what deedbot contains, also ask friends ?
mircea_popescu: if
there's nowhere
to lookup
the "(" how will you have a lisp ? because "we all know" ? and if we don't know how do we find out ?
trinque: I would expect
that if I am on gossipnet and I want loper-os, I ask my friends if
they have a key which
they call loper-os
mircea_popescu: feel free
to query it over gossipd, or over whatever else.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform
the fact
that you can query dns server over current dns protocol and get current response does NOT create an obligation on your
to do so.