200800+ entries in 0.123s
Framedragger quite certain he would get erection from
that small c program in phuctor, and
that is great
☟︎ Framedragger: it was retarded of me
to just
throw keywords at you saying "that would do it".
Framedragger: people are
telling you
that
there is a setup which is better but not multi-mil. it does require planning, etc.
Framedragger: you are presenting a false dichotomy consisting of {current phuctor; $multi-mil db setup}. you propose
to escape it by writing new db as
the only way
to escape it.
Framedragger: (again, i did realise
that
the "oh very simple" angle isn't strong here)
a111: Logged on 2017-02-19 03:54 asciilifeform: (iirc we had a
thread where i described how corporate ameritards, if given a problem like phuctor, would happily soak up a few $mil and megawatt of iron)
Framedragger: can you not picture
this setup with a read-only slave, with a *separate* "give new key
to master" interface (separate so
that
the replication doesn't become write-write but stays write-read)
Framedragger: and you get your 5 seconds. if
the db is loaded, it gets inserted "fast", and user is able
to see results upon refresh (because when it gets inserted, update gets immediately sent
to slave via
trigger rule.)
Framedragger: alright. i will grant you
that
the end system wouldn't be "oh so elegantly simple", because you would have
to have a submission queue (maybe something
that
trinque had in mind). user submits key; gets permalink (immediately); meanwhile key gets sent
to master (immediately), and master puts it into "to be inserted" queue. under normal loads,
the insertion happens ~immediately,
☟︎ Framedragger: however, you won't agree
to drop it, i
take it.
Framedragger: yes
that's
the
tricky part. my natural answer
to
that would be
to "drop it, have user be able
to come back right away -
to a permalink - but results only displayed when
the upstream db actually processes and inserts
the new entry. (this entry would
then get fed into
the slave via streaming replication)"
Framedragger: you can give permalink
to user on
the www read-only box.
Framedragger: hold on, hold on. first of all, regarding
the permalink: you can have
this anyway, because
the hash is computed in python anyway (i ~recall
the procedure
that you once gave me). so,
Framedragger: because gotta serve all
the our democracy right here and now?
Framedragger: are you absolutely unwilling
to have a delay
there?
Framedragger: asciilifeform: aha, right,
that. i literally forgot about
that lol. but wait, first we need
to clear up
the question about whether you want an immediate result
to be shown
to user upon gpg key submission.
Framedragger: (again
tho, it's very easy
to just point finger at features, so i'll gladly shut up)
Framedragger: well, i'm not
that certain, but i am assuming you have more experience
there with me. i will only remark
that you merely need a *read slave*, not an actual mirror db which can handle writes and sync state.
the syncing would go one way only. (hence
the multiple references
to pg streaming replication.)
Framedragger: now, complexity management-wise.. maybe; having same person manage both boxes may not be best idea (and
the alternative has its own advantages). but
the current "phuctor is down, i don't know why, it's a black box" isn't
the greatest example of current setup, either. (this may be a red herring, i'm not sure)
Framedragger: bandwidth required for
the www box would be ~same as what's currently needed from phuctor.
Framedragger: bandwidth? bandwidth required for phuctor box would be "what's needed
to send new rows
to
this other box".
Framedragger: of course being able
to point
to a working prototype would do so much more
than arguments. unfortunately
that would most likely require
the needed modifications on
the phuctor box, so a bit of chicken-and-egg.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: hold on.
the idea was
to separate reads from writes. having a separate box for www which gets updates from phuctor box, and having pg indices on it for quick search is *not* resource-intensive. i can cite examples but basically i'm quite certain
that a <= 16gb memory box would suffice. phuctor box is 256 gigs yes, but it does *so much more*.
shinohai: Also, strikes were designed
to create moar refugees which
Trump could laugh at and
turn away.
shinohai: Naturally,
this was
to appease Russia.
Framedragger: (granted,
these are just nice abstract words.)
Framedragger: asciilifeform:
the parallel
to "this is how winblowz blew up" breaks, imho, if you consider
the splitting-off of www not as an addition, but as actual splitting-off, i.e.,
the box with phuctor on it may no longer have a www interface (just an option, i know you may be against it). if you picture it
that way, it's more about modularisation vs. fixing and inflating a single monolithic
thing.
a111: Logged on 2017-04-07 14:48 Framedragger:
the 'www side can live on another server, even' degree of separation may be most easily achievable (given lack of resources
to rewrite everything as of now) via pg notify / streaming replication. but maybe asciilifeform would insist
that
this is 'marrying
the db'
a111: Logged on 2017-04-07 14:45
trinque: without
this separation
the idiocies of www will creep in, such as "must respond
to user accurately and *now*"
a111: Logged on 2017-04-07 14:44
trinque: mircea_popescu: more clearly stated, I do not see a www as part of
the algorithm of phuctor. it is one source of input where
there could be many, and one output idem. with a clearly defined line between www and phuctor (even allowing for
that www may require cached copies of phuctor data
to operate properly),
this gives you something you can nuke later and replace.
a111: Logged on 2017-04-07 14:02 asciilifeform: so why
then is
this not standard? why locks exist at all ?!
mircea_popescu: no i don't mean
that. i just mean, yes in principl;e doing something with
the plebs is not a bad idea ; but
the exact what and wherefore coulo use more conteplation.
Framedragger: the 'www side can live on another server, even' degree of separation may be most easily achievable (given lack of resources
to rewrite everything as of now) via pg notify / streaming replication. but maybe asciilifeform would insist
that
this is 'marrying
the db'
☟︎ trinque: thus
the notion of sticking someone in
the www
toilet, who manages commands of specific outputs and inputs, and above all keeps
the shit in
the shithouse
trinque: meanwhile asciilifeform has no business adopting sql perversions as
tools of
thought; it would be demeaning
trinque: without
this separation
the idiocies of www will creep in, such as "must respond
to user accurately and *now*"
☟︎ trinque: mircea_popescu: more clearly stated, I do not see a www as part of
the algorithm of phuctor. it is one source of input where
there could be many, and one output idem. with a clearly defined line between www and phuctor (even allowing for
that www may require cached copies of phuctor data
to operate properly),
this gives you something you can nuke later and replace.
☟︎ a111: Logged on 2017-04-07 11:52 mircea_popescu:
tits for btc -> redemption.
shinohai:
http://btcbase.org/log/2017-04-07#1639637 <<<
This is what I said
to Steemit evangelist R. Hilarski a few days ago when he accused me of just hating on altcoins. "When you lose all your BTC in scams, at least your wife is kinda hot so she can come by
trilema and bare her
tits for bits."
☝︎ trinque: I'll close with
the observation
that asciilifeform's "fits in head" serves "build
to iterate and
throw away" very well.
trinque: nor
the www part of your
thing
trinque: asciilifeform: I
threw away first bot, and second bot, and we sit here with
the 3rd
trinque: otherwise yes, compromises overrun
the
thing
a111: Logged on 2017-02-19 03:54 asciilifeform: (iirc we had a
thread where i described how corporate ameritards, if given a problem like phuctor, would happily soak up a few $mil and megawatt of iron)
trinque expects
to
throw away any www he builds by weight 5x over
the lifetime
trinque: while more expensive people continue
to
think long-term
trinque: things
that are cheap
that can later be
thrown away
trinque: really
the right
thing
to do here is sell a buncha fuckgoats, get asciilifeform rich, hire stable boy
trinque: I could
tune my
truck's engine all day and hauling 7000lbs vs 2000lbs will have greater effect