log☇︎
20100+ entries in 0.078s
phf: http://btcbase.org/log-first-post?nick=mircea_popescu (that feature was requested by trinque)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the thing is a flame, and it was not obvious to me either on 1st pass.
mod6: mircea_popescu: this is a solid point for testing, let me give this a test and see how it goes. will report.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: can easily simulate this by deleting a seal
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: randos throw in pgp keys still, half dozen or so in a month typically
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: crazily enough, pingbacks work when issued from my own wp instance
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 18:49 mircea_popescu: you ~can~ after all rebase a patch ; not just because of the patch, but also because of the sig.
asciilifeform: yes but let's suppose that mircea_popescu mistyped, deliberately or otherwise, a character(s) in the string, and wrote 'kye x is ym key'
asciilifeform: gedankenexperiment. say i have a billion signed texts, from all over the galaxy, and also a number of keys, can i mechanically query 'documents signed by all of mircea_popescu's known subserviant keys' ? is the notion that anyone trying to do this is by definition up to no good ?
asciilifeform: actually the relevant mircea_popescu article was another, where he had example of a man who is about to be hanged, but argues that the man who did the crime, is not the one who is bound and led to the gallows
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu has a pretty good exposition of this, not long ago, in the 'opposed' thread
asciilifeform: well iirc in mircea_popescu's original sketch, the sole linkage between mircea_popescu-royalkey and mircea_popescu-apocryphakey is a wot rating. and wot as we have it is an ephemeral thing, which relies on ability to interrogate living people, and not only living but near to the interlocutor in wot.
asciilifeform: but what is the best way to make permanent record that ' mircea_popescu's i-found-this-in-back-of-desk-drawer ' key is subservient strictly to ' mircea_popescu royal key ' ?
asciilifeform: phf: mircea_popescu's method , to be used in the battlefield, still needs some means of tying the keys together formally -- and something that doesn't reduce to the horror of gpg's 'subkeys'
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what does the cafe key provide ?
phf: mircea_popescu: correction in this case can come in a form of another vpatch either by original author after the discussion or by anyone who wants to make annotations, etc. in which case the dialog becomes valuable on its own, because it preserves the differences that have didactic value
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: signed-but-non-vtronic snippets are vulnerable to context misplacement.
asciilifeform: phf: recently mircea_popescu suggested a cleaner scheme where everybody has multiple signing keys, and they rate one another, as if they were people. which is probably as mechanized as this will ever get.
a111: Logged on 2016-02-20 22:45 phf: "i, ordained computron mircea lifeform, in the year of our republic 1932, having devoted three months to the verification of checksums, with my heart pure and my press clean, sit down to transcribe vee patch ascii_limits_hack, signed by the illustrious asciilifeform, mircea_popescu, ben_vulpes and all saints."
a111: Logged on 2016-01-19 14:46 mircea_popescu: you could technically run a chan off v.
phf: mircea_popescu: i misremembered, because later V in my mind merged with gossipd (http://btcbase.org/log/2016-01-19#1376781) ☝︎
asciilifeform: and also from a comment by mircea_popescu that went something like 'i must be able to put finger on a line of code and get names'
a111: Logged on 2015-09-12 20:28 mircea_popescu: which... you know, i slept on this, and it occurs to me that ACTUAL MATHEMATICS might be the perfect thing to implement over V.
a111: Logged on 2015-08-08 04:11 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in somewhat related nyooz, i've been experimenting with what for now i call 'v' - a very dumb 'versioner' that i've been writing, which eats solely 0) pgp keys 1) patches 2) signatures for same, many-to-many mapping of (2) to (1)
a111: Logged on 2015-08-05 14:11 mircea_popescu: how would this b-a versioning system work ?
a111: Logged on 2015-08-05 14:00 mircea_popescu: there's no reason for this to take a week to do.
a111: Logged on 2015-08-05 13:38 mircea_popescu: one is USE. specifically - hanbot must be able to put into work the theoretical advances b-a produces. and ima use her as a stand-in for "intelligent and willing to work, but not able to grow a beard".
a111: Logged on 2015-08-05 03:55 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform he still has a point. a) we're careening dangerously towards -dev levels and b) people can't fucking follow wtf is on that list.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it was how asciilifeform never learned to properly hand-write
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: sorta why i was specifically curious re what it was that the esperantist ~children~ spoke. the resultant creole, not the original 'megalomaniacal engineer' item.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-11 19:54 mircea_popescu: phf suppose you make an ai expert system to beat us at go. this gives you two practical options : either include 10gb worth of binary flags preset ; or else have us beat it at go for 10 centuries before it gets to where it plays like a freshly fucked 19yo.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha, urk 'ebonics' is perfectly speakable, just like the american variant, but (until recently) 0 written word.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: iirc most conlangists were not trying to beat french, romanian, russian, etc; but to beat commercial pidgins like english, which suffer from severely limited vocabulary and many nonsensical sharp edges
asciilifeform: i hate to distract mircea_popescu from a good gloat re the impotence of engineer, but i'd like to see where he cuts the subj : viable conlang is impossible because no one remotely understands meat well enough? or, useless, even if it were made ? ... or both ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: worx
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/D6w9h/?raw=true
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: seems like you would need a nonstandard/modified-for-extra-bitness ext2/3
trinque: mircea_popescu: looks like just a mount flag in fstab
ben_vulpes: mod6, asciilifeform, trinque, phf, mircea_popescu, and anyone else tracking vtronic gnashing: i dusted off and rewrote my cl V implementation. i'll follow up sometime tomorrow with more demo usage, and a more robust demonstration of wot-variant pressing. http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/juTpM/?raw=true
jurov: mircea_popescu: ext4 has 256Binodes, and "The target of a symbolic link will be stored in inode if the target string is less than 60 bytes long."
a111: Logged on 2016-12-16 12:09 mircea_popescu: but i can see why this is practically obnoxious.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 01:59 phf: well, since collective reaction is "tis but a scratch" i have nothing else to say, and will happily await mircea_popescu's unrate
a111: Logged on 2016-06-13 23:48 mircea_popescu: and there's symlinks if anyone wants to alias.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-20 13:18 mircea_popescu: btw mod6 ben_vulpes trinque re the whole db/fs etc discussion, anyone recall the symlinks method / proposed tests ?
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: yeah i figured, it's why he has it now
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Of course it can't compete, but it can Pretend!
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha, see also http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-22#1587963 . ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 01:22 ben_vulpes: just because mircea_popescu didn't complain about the failure at the time doesn't make it right.
deedbot: mircea_popescu rated phf 4 at 2016/05/17 03:19:21 << his lordship the lord chancellor
phf: well, since collective reaction is "tis but a scratch" i have nothing else to say, and will happily await mircea_popescu's unrate ☟︎
mod6: phf: naw. even mircea_popescu has encouraged me to release it, even if it has warts.
a111: Logged on 2016-01-24 03:21 mircea_popescu: to put it in you'll have to sign it. if it turns out later to have a hole, people will negrate you.
mod6: im <+ben_vulpes> just because mircea_popescu didn't complain about the failure at the time doesn't make it right. << maybe.
asciilifeform: ( the bug, as mircea_popescu iirc also pointed out, was in the direction of making his vtron ~stricter~, of forbidding entirely legit ops, so not catastrophic)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu immediately realized what can be done with this knob and wrote, iirc , entire article re same
ben_vulpes: just because mircea_popescu didn't complain about the failure at the time doesn't make it right. ☟︎
a111: Logged on 2015-12-21 22:15 mircea_popescu: so /me gives new girl task to press v, half hour ago. other than the url issue above, "hey what sigs should i put in here ?"
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: yes
mod6: mircea_popescu: aha. ok.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 00:52 mircea_popescu: the key being, that if you allow pressing without signatures, then git qualifies as a v implementation.
ben_vulpes: if by "mircea_popescu" you mean "only mircea_popescu's key in .wot"
mod6: so what you're saying... is that i should be able to say "v press output_press_dir SOME_HEAD mircea_popescu"
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: incidentally a vtron that has my 'origin' op, can check any tree for consistency simply by iterating over the files and running origin(hash_of_file)
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> there shouldn't be any flag - nor should it press unsigned things. && <+mircea_popescu> with the test key ? why not ? fucks with your workflow ?
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> im not sure it has to die when it encounters malformed patch (be it not signed or whatever), but anyway. << i was thinking this was simple because of this:
mod6: <+asciilifeform> http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-22#1587685 << the simplest way to implement this is to iterate over the ~seals~, finding corresponding patches << <+mircea_popescu> not particularily correct ; should iterate over patches, check sealness ; act accordingly. << 'validate_seals' does this; iterates over patches, finds seals for patch, verifies or fails if bad ;; now dies if there are none. ☝︎
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu has it, it is O(NM)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the current setup (with the patch.nickname.sig) is an artifact of the idiocy of pgp, where one cannot take the signature and extract a hash from it with which you can look up the patch from a manifest of patch hashes in O(NlogN)
asciilifeform: because eventually mircea_popescu et al will gripe about 'this is dog slow'
a111: Logged on 2015-08-15 17:46 mircea_popescu: why ?
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 00:01 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-21#1587625 << you gotta appreciate scrutiny is very inelastic. many people used their own implementations ; discussion of others' versions only meaningfully starts after some localized familiarity etc. in any case "being qualified to even use v" is an iffy thing - seeing how it's a novel design, and the novelty is fundamental and conceptual, nobody is technically qualified to use one. you wouldn
asciilifeform: i can see mircea_popescu's 'this is a car with 4 brake pedals, wtf is wrong with you' argument.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is not a pure win. for instance, some folx don't even ~keep~ a nonairgap signtron around. and now -- they would have to.
asciilifeform: anyway, the behaviour of having 'wild' button with red flip cover , that permits (and at all times, clearly marks, 'WILD') unsigned patches, or mircea_popescu's variant, where you gotta have 'test key' in .wot, are equivalent afaik
asciilifeform: mod6: as i understand, trinque and mircea_popescu were taking the position that 'it is dangerous and useless to have an off switch for signature check'
a111: Logged on 2016-12-16 18:21 mircea_popescu: in any case - mental models of logic, as with mental models of anything found in nature -, are approximations. the same mechanism that allows a guy to isolate 0* from null.predicate allows one all sorts of psycho-imunological responses that are rather requisite to maintain the subjective notion of the self ~in a format comprehensible to itself~!
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: lel, gentoo
trinque: mircea_popescu: and wouldn't misapplication of this only further miswire her, and produce worse results ?
asciilifeform: and yes, 'greeks could have made tesla coil.' the same way that gavin can guess the bits in mircea_popescu's privkey
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: afaik this is not specific to woman
asciilifeform: speaking of greek-fu, what does mircea_popescu have to say re the traditional story of hero of alexandria's steam kettle ?
asciilifeform: to revisit upstack -- yes, mircea_popescu's greek-fu is strong, and asciilifeform's -- weak. so, let's ask him, is it a misperception of untutored barbarians, that the greeks picked reasoning over observation , categorically ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if the rabbit cannot be pulled out of the hat, perhaps there is no rabbit in the hat ?
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: Quelli cattivi cattivi che urlano - YouTube: <https://www.youtube.com/playlist%3Flist%3DPL26A9A3F21989DFBD>; Quelli cattivi cattivi che urlano | TravelBook.TV: <http://www.travelbook.tv/playlist/quelli-cattivi-cattivi-che-urlano/PL26A9A3F21989DFBD>; Comincia il gioco, chi c'è c'è, chi non c'è non c'è. Si - Le 17 e 4 minuti: (1 more message)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it is not clear to me that a chumpatron operator has to experience any more 'alienation' than a pig farmer. the latter does not particularly care how pigs remember his work. nor the chumpatronist -- how the chumps remember.
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: thus "natural resource value down 75% yoy"
asciilifeform pictures mircea_popescu admiring bush's glass bookcase doors, with trained eye
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu saw many things, probably also saw home reactor and well-maintained mig.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-21 04:33 BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> cedar ftw. << belongs outside or as an unfinished accent. Bookshelves need to hole WEIGHT!
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> cedar ftw. << belongs outside or as an unfinished accent. Bookshelves need to hole WEIGHT! ☟︎
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: pretty sure the beating stick my old man used was cedar. metal tipped too!
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: 9.85 * 10**6 * 1.9988850174216028E-7 = 1.9689017421602788
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: Land Area / Countries of the World - World by Map: <http://world.bymap.org/LandArea.html>; Geography of Canada - Wikipedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geography_of_Canada>; List of Canadian provinces and territories by area - Wikipedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Canadian_provinces_and_territories_by_area>
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: 71.71 * 800 / 287 / 10**9 = 1.9988850174216028E-7
phf: mircea_popescu: while you're in that french mode you should watch (or rewatch?) fantômas. there's the three 1960s ones, with de funes. i have no idea if they are any good, because i haven't seen them for a very long time, but i suspect that they are sort of comedic 60s take on james bond.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this was in re: your described cut.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu, ben_vulpes, et al : the pill that would be needed to cure the locks retardation once and for all (and enable, e.g., queueing) while preserving semantics, would be to go through each and every function call in trb and determine if it A) Reads state B) Modifies state C) both D) neither
asciilifeform: but yes, mircea_popescu's algo is The Right Thing
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: archive.is is paywalled
a111: Logged on 2016-12-20 19:04 mircea_popescu: we have no definitive answer on this.