log☇︎
181400+ entries in 1.538s
Adlai: and how does what I just said miss that?
undata: Adlai: so I sign the hash of the commit with my gpg key
asciilifeform: but i will not be signing any patch that i can't apply with my mind, in my mental model of the code. ☟︎
asciilifeform: software is helping to the extent it is reasonable. for instance, i am trusting my text editor to display the actual source and not some diddled version.
undata: I'd like to slash out the db bits and try something else, but I'm not going to bother with trying to manually merge other people's patches as they come along in process
asciilifeform: but i will only sign deltas which consist of information which i can fully view.
asciilifeform: let's put it another way. i will not sign anything that i cannot read.
asciilifeform: but it is that output, and only that, which i am willing to sign.
Adlai: i'm going to stop talking before i sound like a broken record, but this topic is likely to come up again once i've got something more substantial to say in defense of some tool for easing (ie, partially automating, up to the point of confirming signature verification) this process... no guarantee on how soon that could be, or which tool.
undata: I'll argue that git is doing precisely what you're doing by hand.
Adlai: at least, not to a great degree... but i get the idea
asciilifeform: undata: i want it to get harder.
Adlai: of course i understand, although i still think darcs could actually work for this
Adlai: i only set up the repo. doing so required going through all the manual steps (and i did verify gpg signatures with identities fetched from public keyservers)
asciilifeform: aha i think ben_vulpes has one of his own
Adlai: https://pgp.mit.edu/pks/lookup?search=Adlai << so, while the current contributors' reasons for not using git[hub] are understandable, i'll leave this up and perhaps update it at my leisure, in case it'll be useful to anybody inhabiting a separate region on the paranoia/lazyness continuum
Adlai: https://pgp.mit.edu/pks/lookup?search=Adlai << /nick accidentally got squatted by ashley while i was in the army. never heard of waksman though.
asciilifeform: i know i like to.
asciilifeform: i guess there's something pleasurable in seeing the moduli
Adlai: don't worry, i'm just phucting with you
Adlai: hah, i'd forgotten this already: http://nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/29F24169A59A5BE1ACC8FCE0E852F4AE1C2A83C2F6B6902D6FA363BFC983ACBA
Adlai: i only set up gpg auth a few weeks ago
Adlai: i've had btc auth set up for around two years
Adlai: how charming, i'm only btc authed, but gribble presents it as though i'm gpg authed too
Adlai: my reason/excuse has mainly been convenience, i had the btc auth set up years ago before i'd ever used gpg
Adlai: although i guess it's less convenient to keep using in the face of existing automation of gpg auth
Adlai: it's not any better than gpg auth, but i don't see why it's any worse either
asciilifeform: the book? can't say that i have
mircea_popescu: Adlai i linked it neh ?
asciilifeform: i not infrequently read esr
mircea_popescu: i am an ant!
assbot: I don’t know what the hell I said. I gave her an ultimatum and there’s nothing I can do. It’s a machine. The little light is blinking right now: ‘Come and listen to the idiot. Hey everybody, the idiot’s on!’ pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/i-dont-know-what-the-hell-i-said-i-gave-her-an-ultimatum-and-theres-nothing-i-can-do-its-a-machine-the-little-light-is-blinking-right-now-come-and-listen-to-the-idiot-hey-everybody-the-i/
asciilifeform: not that i personally give a damn whether a particular honeypot is artificial or 'wild.'
cazalla: ignoring the paedos, i thought this was a good model for a porn site http://www.deepdotweb.com/2014/11/09/as-drug-markets-are-seized-pedophiles-launch-a-crowdfunding-site/
mircea_popescu: all these important things i don't know about!
mircea_popescu: well me either, what am i. mafalda.
mircea_popescu: i suspect also moscow
asciilifeform: mechanism exists, but i have no idea what it looks like in application to modern usa.
mircea_popescu: what i am saying is that the mechanism clearly exists.
asciilifeform: quite a few folks say 'ferguson' when discussion hypothetical phase transition, but i must disagree.
mircea_popescu: i guess.
mircea_popescu: well, actually, i suspect old gals is more of a burden, but who knows.
Adlai: and i'm wondering what will happen once we have a MUCH wider age range of active individuals
mircea_popescu: the west did too, for... well... "fairness" i guess, same bs.
mircea_popescu: undata i recall reading this east-side of cold war story (rdg it was i think ?), about the drink that bestowed immortality, and how obnoxious old people were, 700+ yo clinging on to life to "see who wins whatever games"
asciilifeform: 'i have seen the ships on fire at the edge of orion...'
undata: and I question the "most"
undata: not much lost when I die
Adlai: although I doubt LA was rainy in june
mircea_popescu: yeah, what is going to happen. i wonder.
nubbins`: i suppose if you want to get cheeky it's (1) wiggle (2) if bumped, wiggle less
undata: nubbins`: who knows; not I
Adlai: of course. i'd say it's less a fear and more an underlying aspiration
mircea_popescu: Adlai i have no idea, but i suspect your conviction is more informed by a faint whiff of a personal desire to survive/fear of death than anything else.
nubbins`: i was going to guess you used differential equations
Adlai: well my initial random was "certain within decades", but then I toned it down a few orders of fartitude
nubbins`: asciilifeform i fell into a black hole halfway through my cs/math joint major on points like these
Adlai: which is why I linked to clinical examples, rather than speculation
mircea_popescu: Adlai maybe, but i'm very wary of recent brainscience.
nubbins`: but i feel like the upper bound is significantly higher than people realize
nubbins`: i know people claim that there's an upper bound on the complexity that can form in a cellular-automaton-type system with simple rules
asciilifeform: undata: in fact, i recall that he had a character who is being marched to a mafia execution, and offered a magic pill before being shot. the pill wakes him up to the idea that his mind is already being simulated on a 'computer' made of space dust, somewhere, if only 'interpreted correctly'
nubbins`: i recall reading a young adult novel about intelligent crystals
asciilifeform: undata: yes i recall that one. 'dust.'
asciilifeform: i have limited patience for it because of the sheer lack of predictive power.
asciilifeform: who am i to say that a repeating cycle of moves is not 'house' for the automaton.
mircea_popescu: fuckall cares what i intend.
mircea_popescu: i superficially suspect this discussion proves there can never be turing ai.,
mircea_popescu: well yeah but if it did violate restatement then either i'm wrong or no ai can be made to run on lisp machine.
asciilifeform: a 'nut' or 'bolt' that i use daily.
mircea_popescu: i don't think that violates my restatement.
asciilifeform: ^ best representation of the concept i know of
mircea_popescu: o for sure, im not even getting into the point of the article. i just went on a tangent for objection reasons, like i do.
mircea_popescu: how would i know ?
undata: nubbins`: I started laughing my ass off and gave up
undata: mircea_popescu: I'm still chewing on "different" how?
asciilifeform: aha i see where this is going.
mircea_popescu: what is the method through which i could write software that distinguishes between actual science and global-warming-science ?
asciilifeform: and i'm not altogether certain that i'd profit from grasping it
asciilifeform: the principle involved, i must confess, escapes me
asciilifeform: well, if i had to give an example of 'understanding', involving 'transformation', i'd offer the transformation of pebbles on a beach (original 'calculation') into well, calculation, and mathematics, and, ..., nukes.
asciilifeform: i'd have to disagree that 'understand' is a null-word.
mircea_popescu: that's exactly what i mean.
mircea_popescu: 'It follows that he cannot know that certain people at certain times do not understand in Parry-or Eliza-like ways. That is to say, he has no way of knowing that we do not ourselves sometimes function by means of "clever tricks".' actually, i will go as far as to say that it is always certainly the case understanding happens through "clever tricks"
asciilifeform: reddit, as i understand, is a world of 'class 3' learners - 'must piss on electric fence himself'
mircea_popescu: and i couldn't get out of bed without 5000 "hey mp, what do you think of this toaster" "is bitcoin going up i must know because of my 0.05 btcent investment!"
mircea_popescu: anyway, this is the best of all worlds, tbh. i'd get really pissy in short order if reddit actually knew what's what
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform something tells me i won't be getting the "mp's blog, first place to announce tor is shit, a year or so ago" all over the "tech" "press". just like i didn't get the "mp forces wikileaks to release unedited cables by publishing the romanian subset" a few years back
mircea_popescu: course, when i said so last year the derps went on derping, but why would the derps count here.
mats_cd03: asciilifeform: i'm surprised it took this long. its been alive. what. 10+ years?
asciilifeform: (or perhaps not. i do know he's corralled a good fraction of the 'russian' confections business)
asciilifeform: incidentally i get these in usa. though no idea for how much longer.
xanthyos: i've seen a video of a duck nursing from a cat because its own mother was gone.
mircea_popescu: i guess we could call it "marketing" for lack of terminology.
mircea_popescu: i mean, it used to be the case for children. but biological adults today are psychologically infantile, and this is by very far the most obvious effect.
mircea_popescu: I don't know.
mircea_popescu: Bill Mazeroski, I hate him. He made Mickey Mantle cry. The papers said the Mick cried.
mircea_popescu: i tell you, the anthropology of this thing has been an endless source of fascination to me
asciilifeform: i predict that when the hunter 'shoots', it will be 'spun' to look like a 'protocol' (or even crypto) break, of one kind or another