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mircea_popescu: but i will not stand for this "can't kill my baby" nonsense.

mircea_popescu: i'm not against a kernel that a) never itself crashes and b) always kills anything i want FOR me, and elegantly.

asciilifeform: ( to the point that the sov pc clone 'iskra', 1st comp i ever laid hands on, actually had a cpu reset key ~on kbd~ , nice big red thing )

asciilifeform: aha, erry dos box i ever owned, i truly 'programmed with the mains switch'

a111: Logged on 2019-02-08 17:05 mircea_popescu: fucking reason i even moved off windows was when i discovered that unlike dos, it does not support this.

mircea_popescu: and ftr, it's not "coupla decades with broken soft". it's coupla decades interacting socially with the women and children "of" inept http://bimbo.club/2019/02/the-travel-guide/ dorks, so that i'm stuck lowering my backseat window and screaming "does she ever get laid ?!" to mother-daughter couple sutured at the palm-elbow joint.

mircea_popescu: i can buy that.

mircea_popescu: all things rest on the fundamental "do what i say or i'll fucking kill you".

asciilifeform actually grasps mircea_popescu's pov quite well, after coupla decades with broken soft that does 'whatever it feels like', one starts thinking of 'i want control' in the sense of 'all i want is a big enuff spiked club to smash it all with'. but if you ~actually have~ proper control, cuz you wrote a correct proggy, then what you really want is 'feldmarschall's baton', not club.

mircea_popescu: i can buy that.

mircea_popescu: so then i'm guessing if indeed this problem is encountered thing should just die altogether. ☟︎

mircea_popescu: fucking reason i even moved off windows was when i discovered that unlike dos, it does not support this. ☟︎

mircea_popescu: if ada does not manage to provide me with all the tools i need to the exclusion of the power switch, i will ditch ada and move on to programming in power switches.

mircea_popescu: i will kill ANY THING at ANY TIME.

mircea_popescu: if i can't kill threads any time i want, I WILL NEVER SPAWN ANY.

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no, that's not the fucking question. the question is i don't have a wedgeable, and "somehow" the shit dun die when i say.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the q is why you even ~have~ a wedgedeable -- i.e. having to be async-killed -- subprocess in yer proggy.

mircea_popescu: if someone shuts down some procedure i didn't want shut down, i'll find them and kill them. and meanwhile, i can't have gord eating my sandwiches as a 28 yo "man".

mircea_popescu: yes, and if i have a gun in the house "anyone could in principle end up pointed at with it". wtf is this, pantsuit hour ?

asciilifeform: so it's same 'so' as 'hey i'll follow a dangling pointer if i damn well please, so'

mircea_popescu: no dude, the appeal of "do what i tell you to do" is an artefact of the republic even existing in the first place.

mircea_popescu: it's not in my proggy anymore, i stopped it.

mircea_popescu: yeah, say, i was watching some oliver stone flicks (as part of an aborted integral, jesus that guy sucks, and the 70s suck with him) and in one of them lester (of cucking de niro in casino fame) was a very poor reporter going to san salvador to report on the 1970s maduro thing there (which btw -- last i heard still ongoing).

mircea_popescu: how can anyone be "down a young male" ? that's what the fuck they're for, i'm not "down six boxes" because i got six boxes on atm.

BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'll shoot em an email today. Their office is out in the sticks near the Palacio Legislativo. Long walk for a below the fold story.

diana_coman: but I can't kill them if they are looping!!

diana_coman: hm, in possibly interesting ada-bits: apparently "abort" for tasks does not really kill them if /when they are in an infinite loop; according to ada docs I got the idea of "abort-deferred" i.e. in some states it won't abort but "infinite loop or waiting for a procedure call to return" did not seem to figure there; in practical terms this means that my workers will have to attempt any Job in a guarded manner i.e. give up on it after some ma

BingoBoingo: I may have to. May also have to stop by the Bomberos, but that probably involves a lot of union wank.

a111: Logged on 2019-02-08 07:45 diana_coman: I'll probably need to find out exactly what the overhead for their creation is anyway

asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-08#1893662 << as i currently understand, it will be whatever the pthread overhead is on the given linux ☝︎

asciilifeform: i.e. http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-08#1893671 specifically aint so. ( tho you ~still~ may want to specialize'em for ~different~ reason, if , say, it makes the proggy moar clear ) ☝︎

asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-08#1893667 << this is mistake, and imho subtle and worth addressing , i wrote an illustration for mircea_popescu : http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/TXKlj/?raw=true ☝︎

diana_coman: if /when desired (i.e. at shutdown time, the sequence might be something along the lines send stop signal to sjm and then /after a while, if there is anything still running, call the abort)

diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-07#1893544 -> adding to this, on (re)^n -read of docs I doubt there's any benefit in having a controlled type in there; essentially the main thread will *wait* for all tasks spawned by the SJM to finish from what I understand; so then aborting them in a Finalize makes precisely 0 sense and instead I should probably make it a plain array and offer users of the package a non-synchronised procedure to abort them ☝︎

mircea_popescu: i suspect you'll end up with them specialized, rather than case-switched, on acct of the overhead involved. however, time wil ltell

diana_coman: I'll probably need to find out exactly what the overhead for their creation is anyway ☟︎

diana_coman: if there's nothing for them to do, they get killed; but not sure what's the point in keeping them idling anyway; i.e. if it's busy then no, they don't get killed

mircea_popescu: apache workers ain't jobs ; and i took alf's comments to mean "why are you killing them 9k times/s", which is in his usual style of random assumptive approach, nobody said they'd be killed often.

diana_coman: I suspect asciilifeform's point was more along the lines: why kill them at all instead of letting them idle in there until something to do; not really "why do you bother having a way to create them?"

diana_coman: that being said, I'm not sure in fact that there is a need for the Initialize procedure itself if I'm to cut something out (it's enough to initialize the array when declaring it - although technically it will happen later than within initialize,it's still before anyone gets to use it so perfectly adequate)

diana_coman: re workers aborting unexpectedly: it shouldn't happen, no; but I can't rely on it not happening

diana_coman: asciilifeform, one could certainly keep at all times 64 worker threads idling and waiting for jobs; initially I had implemented it precisely as such: all it takes is to accept a Get_Job request only when there IS a job to hand out; it adds a bit of complexity in there though because there has to be a flag for "available job" and then it has to be kept up to date correctly (which can be a bit tricky as it's not only when a job is added, it'

BingoBoingo: Apparently I beat the local news to this too

BingoBoingo: I did not see fat powered fire bikes

BingoBoingo: 1 fire truck and 4 bombaderos on their motocicletas were on their way down the street when I finished my rubbernecking

a111: Logged on 2019-02-07 18:20 mircea_popescu: meanwhile in the everlulz, Cisza 21F sub 3h "Don't you know what lesbian means? fuck you" LordMPofTMSR "Lmao. I should know, I'm sure I fucked more than you."

a111: Logged on 2019-02-02 02:40 asciilifeform: asciilifeform's pet , ~erry day at breakfast : 'when can i eat apple that tastes like apple again'

mircea_popescu: already in full swing. the one response when getting $item for enslaved usgistani girly is "o wow this is the best $item i ever had".

asciilifeform: i expect there will be plenty of attempted-'substitute' lulz, a la the wooden spokes in wheels of late imperial jp trucks.

asciilifeform: ( large motors include 0 magnet, i suspect mircea_popescu knew this )

asciilifeform: i suppose in 1 sense 'succeeded', iirc principal eater of nd magnet was ye olde mech hdd. tho i dunthink the rise of ssd had any to do with usg idjicy, only w/ korean coolies slaving in 4 shifts

mircea_popescu: in fact, pressed shitboard supermagnet just as likely as 3d-printed quantum computer or whatever the fuck else. they get all the amateur twerps to pretend like pressed shitboard made houses are 100% true and real houses, what's keeping the imaginary magnets and imaginary computers i wish to know ?

mircea_popescu: the sheer unmitigated gall to announce "they identified and sponsored". what the fuck's it supposed to do, i identified a need for more sluts and sponsored the creation thereof at two bits a titpair. what, usg,dea is better than me or something, is the hallucination here ?

mircea_popescu: i suspect might've been cobalt-nickel or w/e.

asciilifeform: i mean at all. i dun think even in actual rocket su had'em.

mircea_popescu: was the only way -- they had to be better, i wouldn't lower myself to mine inferior stuff.

asciilifeform: i dun think we had neodymium magnet in my orcistan

asciilifeform: i recall pulling the magnets from the motors ( 2!111 of'em ) of that thing.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i misremembered, item was a 'moon buggy'

mircea_popescu: this might be the first tracked spaceship i ever saw.

asciilifeform: oddly enuff i did not have this reaction to e.g. tin soldier molded in permanent pose with rifle, or similar .

asciilifeform: i dun think i had a woman-spider single-mold tentaclerape scene as toy. ( maybe in jp they do ? )

a111: Logged on 2019-02-08 00:10 mircea_popescu: "i was nitpicking re strength, not the model per se". wth, it's not necessary the model airplane used to test out the worker hive's going to contain the sort of seating inside you can ~rely on~ to see in the finished item.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i have similar pieces , in http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-05#1892778 . ☝︎

asciilifeform: ( as i understand, it could only happen if there is catastrophic error in the logic ? )

asciilifeform: http://ossasepia.com/2019/02/07/seppuku-job-market-minimal-dynamic-tasking-in-ada/#selection-185.130-185.193 << (again given that i haven't used the threadtron) interested to learn the answr to 'what do they weigh'

mircea_popescu: "i was nitpicking re strength, not the model per se". wth, it's not necessary the model airplane used to test out the worker hive's going to contain the sort of seating inside you can ~rely on~ to see in the finished item. ☟︎

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i was nitpicking re the algo, rather than the draft coad per se

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: http://ossasepia.com/2019/02/07/seppuku-job-market-minimal-dynamic-tasking-in-ada/#selection-139.9098-139.9968 << dun seem like diana_coman's mechanism specialized by creating different 'species' of 'worker' -- but by using case selector, as i expected it would. therefore it remains a puzzle to me why to terminate an' rebirth'em ( to save a few kB of ram when machine load is light ?? )

asciilifeform: i'm betting that it will work , cuz the type aint exported.

a111: Logged on 2019-01-22 22:35 asciilifeform: this is done with a standard ada feature called 'controlled limited type'. which i found that, for no documented reason, dunwork in gnat's static lib.

asciilifeform: http://ossasepia.com/2019/02/07/seppuku-job-market-minimal-dynamic-tasking-in-ada/#selection-101.42-101.207 << possibly i mentioned this prev., but asciilifeform avoids secondarystack not because it doesn't work reliably , but because it makes audit of binary moar difficult. i dunno if this concern is really applicable to items other than ffa.

mircea_popescu: i actually quite like the encapsulation she calls "sjm"

mircea_popescu: i find apache an excellent model for the problem here. the concept of "worker" as used there specifically.

asciilifeform: anyways i'ma only say moar after read proggy.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the 'workers' are specialized for particular type of job ? ( i haven't read the proggy yet -- but seems to me that if that's the case, oughta specialize'em by case selector inside 'worker', rather than eating the overhead of rebirthing thread 9000/sec )

diana_coman: daca-i cu tovarasi e cu margarina, nu cu unt!!

diana_coman: sometimes I wonder if practical-minded is not the polite way of saying unimaginative but anyways

mircea_popescu: a more practical-minded culture, aka "numa' la foale ti-i gindu', sa le-ndopi!"

diana_coman: I'll add to gargauni, goange and barzauni the "fluturi" as one might have those too!

asciilifeform: ( incidentally afaik hedgehog is not found in the americas. and i do not know specifically why, gotta presume that ~someone~ must've set some loose at some point -- but they cannot live here )

mircea_popescu: i wouldn't want to play any computer games hedgehogs made.

mircea_popescu: goange more generic name, and i fear the implication is that female headspace not worthy of such distinctions, to be described generically.

mircea_popescu: so in this sense, inept shit like "o guys, i'm bitcoin jizzus" very much barzaun, whereas inept idiocy like "oh, why should i read log, i am busyman", gargaun.

asciilifeform: ( on asciilifeform's home planet typically folx say simply тараканы , i.e. cockroaches , in skull )

asciilifeform: hm i thought it was 'gargauni & barzauni'

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i dun find the [] irritating at all

asciilifeform: i expect will soon write megab00k, 'how to lose friends and infuriate people'

a111: Logged on 2019-02-07 19:18 mircea_popescu: the high level i suppose is disputable ; but when getting down to practicals, i was still reading the bottom line on the eye chart at time-and-a-half the distance when we fitted bimbo for glasses.

asciilifeform: the idea , i think, is to stop before the fungus sets in an' you start producing those.

asciilifeform: diana_coman: the moar loc, the less i see wrong w/bark, lol

mircea_popescu: now you see why i save.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: a greybeard once told asciilifeform , 'you dun know it, but you got finite # loc in you, once you've written them will stand the machine no moar and have to move to forest and eat bark'. i'm not even convinced that it was joke.

diana_coman: hm, I'm not even sure he doesn't disagree on that already given that he was at his happiest when among 3 sisters

diana_coman: mircea_popescu, I never had screen restriction either but for one thing, I did not start at 4 and for the other there is plenty other stuff (including sleep!) that needs to fit it so...

mircea_popescu: the high level i suppose is disputable ; but when getting down to practicals, i was still reading the bottom line on the eye chart at time-and-a-half the distance when we fitted bimbo for glasses. ☟︎

mircea_popescu: btw, if anyone cares -- i never had "screentime restrictions" besides a purely oral "would you be reasonable!!!" ; doesn't seem to have done me any harm.

mircea_popescu: i think i was more like 7 than 5

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i can't picture one'd get far in supa w/out knowing that, yea

mircea_popescu: (i am right in thinking the "move just as it approaches so it turns around" trick is common knowledge yes ?)