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billymg: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1949939 << nothing major, a minor bug was discovered by several mp-wp users. once it was determined that it was the result of the latest patch i was able to zero in on the offending change and issue a fix plus a test http://billymg.com/2019/11/bug-fix-to-preserve-encoded-html-characters-in-post-body-between-edits/
ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-06 12:39:33 mircea_popescu: billymg, what's the mp-wp story, did i miss some updates ?
billymg: i'm very much liking the testing framework and am glad i was encouraged to set that up. i now definitely want to finish writing the tests before working on any additional features/trimming
billymg: i'm also optimistic about the additional attention mp-wp seems to be getting over at #ossasepia - jfw has several patches in his queue already http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/manifest
billymg: at the moment i don't have the necessary time to be fully involved so for now i'm just happy to see diana_coman and her pages chipping away at it. but i'm very much looking forward to getting back into it once i've successfully jumped the fence
trinque: mod6: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-31#1949000 << wallet has been up, and there are uses of it in the logs even...
ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-31 23:46:29 mod6: trinque: not yet. is your wallet stuff back up?
trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1949758 << somebody's going to have to tell me what they think is not "done" about the current item
ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-06 11:37:43 mircea_popescu: and you verified you can actually deploy this proto cuntoo on various hw, so we're good here : as to 1, smg will use proto-cutnoo until can switch to cuntoo ; and meanwhile ima see what trinque has to say re cuntoo and try to get bvt to patch against it and so on
trinque: point-in-time gentoo snapshot is shot.
trinque: I don't think it should be considered anything more than a liferaft
trinque: meanwhile I've been working on a smaller item based on busybox.
trinque: I don't think it'd be wise at all to try to own something with 900mb of dependency source.
trinque: and if anyone considers the current cuntoo too low-level to be useful, they're not going to feel much differently about classical gentoo. the barriers to entry are the same in both cases.
feedbot: http://bingology.net/2019/bingoboingo-after-pizarro-plans-through-end-2019/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- BingoBoingo After Pizarro - Plans Through End 2019
BingoBoingo: trinque: Are you still inclined to completely write of your server and FUCKGOATS, or do you want me to try to recover some value from it for you and get you a pair of FUCKGOATS. I don't need an answer immediately, but would prefer one by Monday.
trinque: do you recall if I ever bought a FG from you gents? iirc one wouldn't fit in my chassis, and I forget where we landed.
trinque: BingoBoingo: as for liquidating my stuff, I wouldn't mind getting a FG or two out of the deal if it can be swung
trinque would pay shipping
BingoBoingo: trinque: When alf was here we put one in each hemisphere. It seems you did buy two, but the notes from the period the transaction happened are a clusterfuck.
BingoBoingo: trinque: Shipping FUCKGOATS won't be anywhere near as awful in pricing as 1U servers.
BingoBoingo: If you would like, I can auction your chassis on the same basis I'm auctioning the Pizarro servers.
trinque: cool, if I own those just lmk what shipping costs. I'll gpg a destination
trinque: BingoBoingo: works for me
BingoBoingo: Your chassis is a bit heavier and deeper than the dulap machines, but it also has the guts of two machines inside.
BingoBoingo: When I walk later I'll weigh what I'll stake of my own coin as the buyer of last resort on it.
trinque: nah man, I don't want you to do that.
trinque: unless you actually want the thing. I don't need the coin.
BingoBoingo: trinque: I can go really low, see how little I'm valuing the switches at http://bingology.net/2019/pizarro-liquidation-auctions-proposal/
trinque: k
BingoBoingo: The reason to place myself as buyer of last resort is to pre-empt later objections that X item located at the ass end of the world has a concrete value. If it did the objector had the chance to bid.
BingoBoingo: For the value of the dell badge, I will however make an earnest effort o sell the mod6/TBF server in the local market as a sorta prop that can go into a sufficiently deep wifi rack.
BingoBoingo: The local market to buy that one is deeper for the branding than the market is for the supermicros despite the supermicros being better servers
BingoBoingo back later
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1949982
ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-06 21:00:07 billymg: at the moment i don't have the necessary time to be fully involved so for now i'm just happy to see diana_coman and her pages chipping away at it. but i'm very much looking forward to getting back into it once i've successfully jumped the fence
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1949982 << any times for this ?
ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-06 21:00:07 billymg: at the moment i don't have the necessary time to be fully involved so for now i'm just happy to see diana_coman and her pages chipping away at it. but i'm very much looking forward to getting back into it once i've successfully jumped the fence
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1949990 << the thing here is, minigame will need to use a os. this means a very simple binary choice : either it uses something made by us, or not. the criteria for the former is that someone's in charge ; the criteria for the latter is that it's convenient.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-06 21:18:49 trinque: I don't think it'd be wise at all to try to own something with 900mb of dependency source.
mircea_popescu: since you're the ~only one here in a position to claim ownership of something like an os, i want to know if you want to do so.
mircea_popescu: if you don't want to do so, my options are either to try and promote someone else, or else drop the whole pretense and simply use the latest whatever the fuck it is.
mircea_popescu: which is actually what i'll do, i don't perceive the value of waiting on products while people get their shit in order.
mircea_popescu: there's still zero interest in whatever flavour of the day bullshit, "liferaft" or w/e halfassery is to be called this week, "software as is" whatevers.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-23 13:40:36 mp_en_viaje: for as long as your mentality stays "amateur dabbler in tmsr", i stay uninterested.
billymg: mircea_popescu: yup, the plan remains, january will be the time
mircea_popescu: cool.
BingoBoingo: This weekend I plan to set aside a solid block of time to give Cuntoo a fair try, but I am not in any position to claim ownership over anything like an OS. I suspect I'll be more successful than the last time I tried for having unloaded a huge ball of insanity outta my head in the interim.
mircea_popescu: i don't think you are, no.
mircea_popescu: nevertheless, the os portion remains a major hole in the whole architecture, because w/o os ownership pretty much all our efforts are unsustainable.
mircea_popescu: then again, without an isp our efforts are just as unsustainable on the other end of the scale, i'm not discovering some sorta novelty here.
mircea_popescu: paying for the sins of historical tolerance-driven complacency, without a foundation to foment the environment there's no people to fill the gaps, etcetera.
trinque: and you have fewer men than you'd like, and I'm not going to pretend to be 20, and then cry when I fail at it. that's why I said I'm looking at kernel + busybox for my own stack. even it isn't human-sized, but it's about two orders of magnitude less twine and shit than "standard linux distro"
mircea_popescu: trinque, i absolutely don't want you to pretend to be 20.
mircea_popescu: dun get me the wrong way, i'm not twelve.
trinque: then I apologize for that part.
trinque: at any rate, you run statically compiled gnat items and a database?
trinque: these, I'd think, would run in a very simple userland
mircea_popescu: as a factual matter, stock'll have to be taken, we can't just pretend lalala and keep sending people to do impossible things.
mircea_popescu: trinque, userland, as for client ? or as for server ? these are distinct concerns for s.mg
trinque: for server, I was contemplating
trinque: but I'm sure you mean to standardize the client too
trinque: comes with whole raft of drivers, graphics stack, etc
mircea_popescu: the server i'm not so desperately concerned about, because that gets baked once and is good for half a decade or more. diana_coman reported she has a running item, so that's... okay.
mircea_popescu: i can see baking it on protocuntoo ; with a view to moving it to cuntoo, ~if cuntoo is a thing~. if it isn't... no view.
mircea_popescu: now as to the client, that's a larger ball of yarn. if i have no serious static goal to contemplate, ima nix decrufting effort, because why bother make it static.
mircea_popescu: indeed why bother make it anything in particular, the market standards are so low... runescape runs in a java environment that crashes 3 times an hour. steam is fucked beyond your wildest dreams. nothing works in gaming, it's a joke, there's no competition in any sense.
trinque: yeah, it depends on whether you want the item to be a technical exemplar or an outreach mechanism, or something else
BingoBoingo: trinque: If I do get a Cuntoo running this weekend, you can expect me to submit Cuntoo-ified versions of my desktop work tools at the speed I port them. Everything I depend on seems to have already been ported to musl based linux distributions. I can't promise doing this fast, but it can be something that would help make a noob-cuntoo image down the line.
mircea_popescu: the client ? ideally it'll be everything ; but in practice we'll take what we get.
mircea_popescu: anyway, any kind of cuntoo-base for client is a distant goal anyway, seeing how ... no x
trinque: BingoBoingo: I'd be pretty stoked if somebody found the hole for new ebuilds and cut a vpatch of some useful items
mircea_popescu: ie, contemplated os ownership is a matter of pure committment. what the world is looking for, today as in the days of the venerable bede, and then as the first day, is people. the sort who commit.
mircea_popescu: the sort who save themselves "for later", well... i dunno what they're for.
BingoBoingo: trinque: Provided I get it running this time I'll at a minimum try to get up to XFCE. I'll make and rate a BingoCuntooExperimenal key for the purpose of something.
BingoBoingo: But this also depends on me getting Cuntoo built.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo, you're in absolutely no position to do any of this wtf. aren't you supposed to first find yourself a job ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Aite
trinque: mircea_popescu: nor I, certainly not what I'm doing. these distros are just... quite large
BingoBoingo will stay in lane
trinque: the busybox item is interesting because I have some hope of actually eating the thing.
trinque: i.e. the *source* vpatches will actually be human-sized
mircea_popescu: i guess.
mircea_popescu: anyways, eventually we'll get a troop out of new kids ready and able to actually do useful & meaningful shit in computer science, and whatever, the failure of one particular generation won't look that much more remarkable than the string it's part of.
lobbes is aiming to get the mp-wp bot fix out by tonight. Then needs to get the auctionbot in better shape.
lobbes: However, after that I wouldn't mind the idea of 'apprenticing' under trinque on cuntoo related things. I could use the education to be honest, and I know he needs hands
mircea_popescu: well... he's practical minded enough to perhaps not waste your effort.
mircea_popescu: besides, spyked was iirc by training a systems guy.
mircea_popescu: trinque, suppose spyked's game, and what you have to do is run the two fellows + whatever we can meaningfully accrete through the tmsr-ization of cuntoo.
trinque: yeah, I'd be happy to talk to both fellas about the thing.
mircea_popescu: suppose you talk to both fellas here about the thing, i wanna follow along
trinque: totally fine by me
trinque: and productive
trinque: the main problem with such a project is how large it is. there were several folks on just trb, for a bit anyway.
mircea_popescu: i expect the principal problem of trb attempt was horrid management.
mircea_popescu: not that i blame the pm, there wasn't one. but the fundamental reason why "adding more manpower to a late project only makes it later" is that lots and lots of "manpower" is actually -ev.
mircea_popescu: the original trb work suffered from a massive aglomeration of -ev workforce.
mircea_popescu: at least, that's my takeaway.
lobbes: mircea_popescu: before I commit this fix to a patch, do the excerpts on these comments look saner to you as well? http://blog.ericbenevides.com/2019/11/generic-pingback-target/#comment-134
lobbes: the 'pingback linkback' selector is still suffering from the strip-spaces bug whaack found in the xmlrpc.php, but as that is outside of the scope of the logotron tree I figure that can wait for another day and this bot can be put to bed.
lobbes: (plus whaack iirc has his sights on this for fixing anyways)
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1949915 - preference is for AMD arch as easiest & more familiar to deploy on & work with; that being said, if no AMD available, will go with Intel; for concrete specs, the current server is rather undemanding and it ran fine on fx-8350 eg something like this should work absolutely fine.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-06 12:27:30 mircea_popescu: any preferences re spec ?
ossabot: Logged on 2018-02-05 20:57:25 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo phf trinque diana_coman so i'm thinking of basically getting a dozen amd fx-8350s (because just 125w compared to say fx-9590s 220) racked in u2 mbs (say maybe ASRock 970M PRO3 ? i thinkl that fits in 2u neh ?) with 64 gb ram each and a coupla ssds ? any complaints/suggestions ?
diana_coman: re use, the heaviest part is db queries really.
diana_coman: I should mention that we'll possibly need to review this once we do the release (ie dev server goes into production with the smg communications protocol and hopefully decrufted of most shit otherwise)
mircea_popescu: review as in get a new machine ?
mircea_popescu: lobbes, the only problem is that e= is unpopulated. i'm currently using
mircea_popescu: $select_tail = "?b=".substr(strip_tags($excerpt),0,12)."&e=".substr(strip_tags($excerpt),0,4)."#select";
mircea_popescu: on trilema/s xmlrpc.php as a private fix (which still dun work correctly, for some yet undiscovered reason spaces get eaten), but anyways, select should output no empty e.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: review as in finally being able to actually benchmark the server and get some concrete idea as to what it needs ; as a result it might be a new machine, yes.
mircea_popescu: so to be clear here, you specifically want two dc hosted machines, one dev one prod ? or are you happy with home-hosted dev ?
diana_coman: BingoBoingo: I had the "stale page" thing on your blog ~10 times and only now (after letting it be for a while funnily enough) it went through
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: I'm happy with home-hosted dev.
diana_coman: just the prod needs to be on dc
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: we will also need some lightweight place to set up the website
mircea_popescu: in which case, should get a 8+ core amd of some kind, 32+gb and a coupla disks, raidless ok, and then review for upgrade in what, a few months ?
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: sounds good.
mircea_popescu: aite.
mircea_popescu: i intend to put bimboclub, thewhet, eulorawebsite etc on the trilema backup server lobbes is comissioning.
diana_coman: ah, ok.
mircea_popescu: younghands/yourblog etc can also go there if you wish.
diana_coman: I might take you on the offer there for my blog if I don't manage to scare up something locally; I have currently some guys next door that I want to talk to, they seem to be at least talkable-tio
diana_coman: so thank you and I'll get back to you on that.
mircea_popescu: aite.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: re-reading the discussion yesterday it occured to me that the loggers & irc weren't mentioned at all
mircea_popescu: well, they were mentioned in the sense spyked apparently wants to spend the remainder of the year fucking with them.
diana_coman: I am maintaining the logger and I intend to maintain it but any further development can happen only when I get some pages finally up to speed to help as I really don't have currently ~any time left to sink in that.
mircea_popescu: why not just switch to the mp-wp patch ?
mircea_popescu: i don't foresee any future for the current python-powered item.
diana_coman: I still have to figure that out exactly what it does, how it works and so on; I'll have to look into it then.
mircea_popescu: well, lobbes is gonna demo it soonish.
diana_coman: looking forward to the demo.
mircea_popescu: can you ~fucking belive~ that utterly moronic "scientist" NOT ONLY was too fucking special in his shit-for-brains mind to actually use working solutions "over all these years", but actually vomited an entire EXTRA pile of expensive yet worthless dependencies into our process ?
mircea_popescu: the specialisation of expensive yet worthless, bloody hell.
diana_coman: I once said something on idealism and I still stand by it.
ossabot: (ossasepia) 2019-09-10 diana_coman: structure of thought first and foremost; and note that idealism is precisely the inability to see (notice+comprehend) much of the fabric of reality.
mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-22#1947539 and http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/asciilifeform/2019-10-28#1000723 , futu-ti gura ma-tii.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-22 01:58:11 asciilifeform: can persuade mp_en_viaje to xor ?
ossabot: (asciilifeform) 2019-10-28 asciilifeform: if mp wants to throw out the people who are his hands, like used candy wrappers, it's b/w him and odin, i have no power to persuade him of anyffin. but it remains the case that i'm fully equipped to provide machine service to my l1 folx who want it. and w/ very short turnaround. all service req's are to be gpg'd to asciilifeform, and posted here. will use deedbot for so long as able, then will have to make other ar
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, what's so idealistic about shit nobody uses because it stinks ? i dun get it.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: that's precisely it, the "who or if uses" does not even enter into consideration there; it's built "because it should be so according to the ideals"
diana_coman: and that's all that matters
mircea_popescu: idealism is one thing. the worship of "shit we know an' are used to" is not idealism. nor is it any kind of conservatism, it's crypto-stupidity ; the same sense of crypto contemplated in 1990s "crypto-communism". cryptic, hermetically sealed in the shit in one's head, outside of the reach of thought.
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, what fucking ideals ever demand the breakage of a unusable cvasi-blog ?
diana_coman: well, not able to notice + comprehend reality = in own head, ofc, where else remains.
mircea_popescu: fucking infuriating.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: sigh; you'd be surprised perhaps but I doubt it's worth the time to describe in much more detail.
mircea_popescu: there he sat, the fuckhead, FOR YEARS, "oh, one day will mp-wp, hurr durr". one day, rite. then, when push came to shove, DID NOT KNOW what didn't know. because hadn't done. because etcetera.
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, nah, i'm with you, forget about it. ima go take a shit
mircea_popescu: it'll prolly come out as a much greater addition to the world than the remainder of this discussion.
diana_coman: I'll go and talk to those guys to see if I can get a server with them.
mircea_popescu: lobbes, an unexpected point occurs. do you have a chatlog eater tool ?
mircea_popescu: because i'm thinking... i should probably just import all antique logs, have them in one place finally.
mircea_popescu: and if i do that, i'd better do it before i publish later logs on trilema, so the guids aren't in three waters.
mircea_popescu: incidentally, when i do that, we're looking at a solid eight years aka 3k articles or so. it'll be an insane log day. i intend to publish them 15s apart or something.
hanbot considers what to put on 12.5hr playlist to accompany the article-scroll
mircea_popescu: chansons de paris!
mircea_popescu: ... un coin du vieux Montmartre
mircea_popescu hums "Emportés par la foule qui nous traîne, nous entraîne nous éloigne l'un de l'autre ...Je lutte et je me débats mais le son de ma voix s'étouffe dans les rires des autres....Et je crie de douleur, de fureur et de rage, et je pleure... "
diana_coman: even better: et je m'en fous.
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: piaf period female life & drama is purely circular.
mircea_popescu: ""
mircea_popescu: "Entraînée par la foule qui s'élance et qui danse, une folle farandole, je suis emportée au loin et je crispe mes poings, maudissant la foule qui me vole l'homme qu'elle m'avait donné et que je n'ai jamais retrouvé..."
diana_coman: no, I know, I grew up on French, not on English really; but if it's at that, I'd go at least for jojo se prenait pour voltaire et pierre pour casanova et moi, moi qui etais le plus fier moi, moi je me prenais pour moi
diana_coman: anyways, 6 months in france cured me of francophilie
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: ty, will see if error.log reveals anything at a glance
BingoBoingo: !Qlater tell trinque http://bingology.net/2019/pizarro-liquidation-auctions-proposal/#comment-1505 << Proposal for the auction of your hardware.
lobbesbot: BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: http://trilema.com/2013/why-you-cant-invest-with-cryptostocks/ or http://trilema.com/2013/and-another-one-bites-the-dust-picostocks/ http://trilema.com/2016/fred-wilson-is-an-idiot-and-other-things/ http://trilema.com/2013/the-dork-of-the-month-award/ Candidates that clicked for the article you wanted yesterday
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, well, vieux montmartre, not the current sadness.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo, none of those.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in historical lulz, https://www.coindesk.com/coindesks-influential-people-blockchain-2016
mircea_popescu: meanwile in other lulz, "Sh Dr Haitham al-Haddad summarises his fatwa on Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies."
mircea_popescu: (spoiler : just another fat dude talking into the camwhore's instrument, like every other esltarded "comedian" / "content producer" etc)
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2013/of-mice-and-men-revisited/#comment-132178 << BingoBoingo check it out, "braindamage" found it. is it you ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Not me
BingoBoingo: Just returned from getting groceries and a VGA to HDMI cable to get hardware specs outta the servers for prospective buyers
mircea_popescu: just returned from getting groceries also!
mircea_popescu: needed three carts and two bitchez to handle it all, ended up stuffing the car with smoked salmon by the pound &cetera
mircea_popescu: but, i must say, two-girl shopping trips are a delight. i just watch and nod while the people of walmart look from my switch to my bitch an' from my foods to my whores.
mircea_popescu: really the supermarket was invented for men with paris of girls, it's the only way that shit works right.
BingoBoingo: Nice. That does seem like the fix navigating the beast.
mircea_popescu: not even so much a matter of navigation, more like loading / pushing / unloading / reloading carts.
mircea_popescu: between the store-supplied wench running the ding machine and the home-brought wenches putting stuff on / taking it off the conveyorbelt, i daresay i run the world's most efficient supermarket operation.
mircea_popescu: as it turns out, modern economy takes 3 women teams at a minimum.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in poilu france, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/41/Adolphe_Willette_-_Madeleine%2C_Monologue_et_9_dessins.jpg/800px-Adolphe_Willette_-_Madeleine%2C_Monologue_et_9_dessins.jpg
feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/11/trend-micro-staff-sold-customer-information-outside-of-management-direction/ << Qntra -- Trend Micro Staff Sold Customer Information Outside Of Management Direction
mircea_popescu: heh
BingoBoingo: Second time this year I caught one of those. Looking like an emerging trend afflicting large WoTless enterprises
mircea_popescu: really hard to run a 40 thieves' cave where the lesser theives don't steal anything
BingoBoingo: Especially if they can't shoot the lesser theives for Oslo larp reasons.
mircea_popescu: aha
BingoBoingo: The local commie pick for next econ minister if they win is promising "to continue increasing Uruguay's economic stability" as though stability is not the road to death and bad fruit
mircea_popescu: lmao
BingoBoingo: I think I've convinced a few people that "stability" is why they make more than Europeans while being poorer since... WTF can they buy?
mircea_popescu: no fucking way tjhey make more than euros ?!
mircea_popescu: they make the same ~500 a year bulgarians make, half a ro wage.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: At least for the first half of 2019 their very flat wages normalized into dollars were above much of eastern Europe. 20,000 pesos was 600 USD to 700 USD versus the holy European 500 USD
BingoBoingo: This has since changed with the pesofall
mircea_popescu: no dude, nobody in yurp makes 500 lol. it's 1k on the low end (ro, pl, cz, etc) to 4-5k on the high end. france makes like 3k
BingoBoingo: Ah
mircea_popescu: inflation, baby
mircea_popescu: you're working on decade old figures.
BingoBoingo: Ah
mircea_popescu: republic of moldavia, serbia etc are in the 500 zone
BingoBoingo: Serbia, Moldavia, Belarus seem like servicable alt-Uruguays, but I'm not really looking for another Uruguay.
mircea_popescu: belgrade is actually great, budget vienna.
BingoBoingo: ty, In that case I'll move Belgrade up with the first round of Atlantic Rim targets.
mircea_popescu: certainly better fucktoys walking the street than anything on the pacific assrim
BingoBoingo: Pacific coast has Lima, Santiago, and other second and their tier targets. Asian side of Pacific I'm not particularly interested, prioritizing on the level of western european shitholes that don't speak Spanish.
hanbot: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1949944 < this is gonna take me an extra 24-48h; the reading's worthwhile and denser than i imagined. after which i'll publish my accumulating notes. 'til then, diana_coman graciously plonked her logger in #trilema-hanbot, and all are welcome.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-06 12:43:55 hanbot: mircea_popescu i browse, but haven't strictly "kept up". i can spend a day or two getting there tho', what's up?
mircea_popescu: cool