tmsr - Log 2019-10-18

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: can't fathom wai you'd want it instead of rk, tho, unless want gigantic sata disk

ericbot: Logged on 2019-10-17 05:09:47 lobbes: I will apply said patch tomorrow and see if that fixes things

asciilifeform: meanwhile, in heathendom lint traps, new lolz from a very old lolcow .

asciilifeform meanwhile making new attempt at the auto-installer for asciilifeform-gentoo, this time using trinque's method .

asciilifeform needs fully mechanized process for these, or bringing up rack fulla'em will be 1st class bitch.

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo plox to ping when diana_coman's contents are ready for dload ; the box to receive'em is prepared (on desk) .

asciilifeform: aite.

asciilifeform: ty BingoBoingo . i'ma to meat soon, so may have to wait until wakeup.

asciilifeform: hopefully it aint a multi-day download, lol

BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Just multi hour from Uruguay to get the tar.gz.gpg on the server

asciilifeform: wait why's it a tar.gz ? oughta be straight gz of the stick image

asciilifeform: per the recipe .

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-16 14:15:42 asciilifeform: aite, let's ask BingoBoingo to dd if=/dev/thatstick | gzip > diana_coman.img.gz and then gpg to asciilifeform . i'ma modify it strictly as required to sit down on new ip and naught else.

BingoBoingo: I've been paying more attention this week to checking the last extension triplet than the preceeding file name parts.

asciilifeform also to meat.

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: lol you fughot sumthing important in there

asciilifeform: plox to resend.

asciilifeform back to bed for nao.

diana_coman: fwiw on irc-project, thimbronion contacted at least oftc, undernet, dalnet and espernet but because 1. he has to improve there 2. they are all into this wank of "us big networkz, no need serverz" , I'll have him get some proper data and write it up to have it in clear: set up some bouncers and log for a while all chans,

diana_coman: I rather expect it will be quite lulzy too to see the actual output of thousands of userz but at any rate, if by some mysterious working there is something alive in there, it should be found too.

mp_en_viaje: wtf are they thinking it's anyone's guess (besides, of course, the fact that they've all been pizarro-ing the bed, the usercount has been dropping for 2 decades now, while the internet has been growing)

mp_en_viaje: this is the fucking problem with the "progressive" claptrap : it is the only cure democracy/retardation has yet come up with to deal with these other morons.

mp_en_viaje: if you don't change for change's sake then you're happy with everything as it is, if hilary didn't give you your rights then pangloss gave you the best possible world, god fucking love 'em with a sharpened stick already.

mp_en_viaje: http://jswin.github.io/javascript-window/jquery-thickbox-fullscreen-iframe.html http://jquerythickbox.com/thickbox-not-working-with-firefox.html check out these fucking idiots, 1990s era url keyword stuffing, works a-ok in 2019 google (just as long as what it's pushing is its shitty jquery infection vector)

mp_en_viaje: http://jswin.github.io/ meanwhile 404s ; i'm sure this is totally how github works yes.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 12:10:30 asciilifeform: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946045 << i entirely buy the argument. and will also buy ip -- when either asciilifeform figures out how to do it for 'toyota' rather than 'boeing' budget, or -- larger budget ;

mp_en_viaje: to be perfectly clear, nfi why this keeps gettting forgotten, and thereby needs to be reiterated : the problem of pizarro was NOT!!!! anything even vaguely or remotely similar to "general staff in same trench". in part because eg, i resisted moving trilema whenever you asked, in part because trinque similarily, and so on. we had EXCELLENT partition of services, and principally because you weren't involved with doing it.

mp_en_viaje: the problem of pizarro was, 100%, your joint an' several failure to build it a customer base.

mp_en_viaje: stop tryna fix imaginary problems as a transparent cover-up for not fixing existing problems. it's transparent and it'll stay transparent, disavowing it'll NEVER work

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 14:53:27 asciilifeform: presently puzzling over where to get exchange rate for pricing; prolly will have to lift from BingoBoingo's auctions, for so long as they're happening with reasonable regularity .

mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946136 << yup, and once he chases a different skirt in a week or two again, "problems" again and so on.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 15:44:00 diana_coman: asciilifeform: ha, congrats! honestly, by the sound of it, once you got moving, you found everything needed!

lobbesbot: nicoleci: Sent 3 days, 10 hours, and 5 minutes ago: <BingoBoingo> http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=rrJN

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 16:50:42 asciilifeform: additionally , if smg would like to operate 1 or moar boxen here in asciilifeform's cage, i'ma happily service, either on transported iron, or on own stock, either worx .

mp_en_viaje: in the end i suppose whether build new or buy pizarro's comes down to what it costs. what does pizarry want for the two boxes used to run smg servers before ?

mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946179 << definitely, i'd buy in all republican dcs. which so far has been one.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 16:52:03 asciilifeform: does not know whether smg has the provisions to operate ~simultaneous~ mirrors , but if does, may be good idea to sit in 2+ racks

mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946199 << the spirit of service-eagerness is fine, but you're going overboard with the options. no, he doesn't want a pogo, simmer down.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 19:38:00 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i actually have a pogo in stock, if you like just-for-you it can be plugged in.

mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946210 << that ignoble schmuck's just never gonna quit following around what we do, monkeying it in his retarded style, is he.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 22:13:06 asciilifeform: meanwhile, in heathendom lint traps, new lolz from a very old lolcow .

mp_en_viaje foresees a whole fucking ocean of these before we're done, much like the few good rockbands of the 70s had an entire fucking ocean of morons with guitars trying their best to choke them out

mp_en_viaje: nicoleci, that shit dun work, "curl: (35) error:1407742E:SSL routines:SSL23_GET_SERVER_HELLO:tlsv1 alert protocol version"

nicoleci: mp_en_viaje, well i don't atm know what to do. basically there's 6.6mb i'm trying to send you. i tried split -n5 and deedbot's paste still spits (1.3mb chunks, so the limit is only 1mb ???)

mp_en_viaje: [10:24:32] Hey Ahnberg I'm coming from TMSR (http://logs.ossasepia.net). << wtf is wrong with this guy ?

mp_en_viaje: no more timbrion-style "diplomacy" plox ; not from him nor from anyone else, it's too much like three stoges religious service.

mp_en_viaje: it's llike watching silviu gherman pick up chicks. "hi i am from the dick people"

diana_coman: mp_en_viaje: and yes re painful + it was worse; no idea why is it so hard apparently to actually talk to people on the internets.

asciilifeform waves to mp_en_viaje & diana_coman

mp_en_viaje: but he's certainly made it more difficult for anyone coming after him. which is the exact fucking opposite of helping.

diana_coman: mp_en_viaje: well, there was the naive assumption on my part that "how hard can it be"; fwiw though I rather doubt it really makes a difference simply because there is no real interaction from the other side either.

asciilifeform: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-18#1946268 << BingoBoingo is working on a detailed quote ( transportation cost is the unknown; and appears that meat-powered transport may actually be cheapest. )

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 09:50:40 mp_en_viaje: in the end i suppose whether build new or buy pizarro's comes down to what it costs. what does pizarry want for the two boxes used to run smg servers before ?

asciilifeform: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-18#1946274 << seems that they have a new schmuck. ( old one -- retired )

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 09:57:03 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946210 << that ignoble schmuck's just never gonna quit following around what we do, monkeying it in his retarded style, is he.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-01-15 13:04:09 asciilifeform: meanwhile, in a quite hilarious conclusion to the http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-15#1887012 saga : http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1390&cpage=1#comment-19775 << yarvin throws in the towel.

asciilifeform: lolyes

diana_coman: asciilifeform: I'm really in no hurry re pizarro but since there's the talk re how much for the s.mg servers and so on - is there some concrete plan on how will this and all the rest be determined to tidy it all up?

asciilifeform: diana_coman: atm plan is to properly handle all evacuations ( data, afaik, evacuated, BingoBoingo uploaded gpg'd backups, yours is afaik done but BingoBoingo forgot to send me login to fetch it before went to sleep ) ; after this, publication of cost for evacuations of irons ; after this , auctions of jettisoned irons, liquidation ; then to pay mp_en_viaje , he is owed ; then BingoBoingo returns output re cost of action vs latech ; t

asciilifeform: hen mod6 (maj holder) + asciilifeform (min holder) to decide re remaining piggy , how much, if any , to spend on suit (supposing latech not surrenders) ; then potentially evacuate BingoBoingo , unless he actually finds ecological niche in uy

asciilifeform: in that order.

asciilifeform: ( which is why i suspect there will be at least 1 new (if smaller) auction . or >1, if, pessimistically, BingoBoingo runs for a spell on personal battery while searching for work )

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 09:31:54 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946126 << wait, how are those to continue ?!

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: concretely re irons -- BingoBoingo is getting quotes from carriers.

asciilifeform: err, diana_coman ^

asciilifeform: diana_coman: there's apparently customs nonsense threatening to get in the way. however ~absolute~ ceiling for removal cost is 500 per 1u (u.s. $) , asciilifeform can physically extract 100kg of iron for a ~2000 cost. ( this however would require 4 u worth of iron evacuation request, to be practical. ) BingoBoingo will say moar when wakes up.

diana_coman: asciilifeform: by the sounds of it though it would anyway be cheaper for s.mg if putting them in your rack to just buy the servers in the us and ship to your door, no?

asciilifeform: ^ above 500 also is only, obv, correct for irons going strictly to usa ; to send elsewhere, would cost moar , potentially -ev. main appeal of 'meat transport' is that could also cleanly move the FG crate.

asciilifeform: diana_coman: i've purchased new boxen, because 'time is money' and not yet even known what costs removal. but potentially +ev to remove, req's data from BingoBoingo re carriers, customs shamanics.

mp_en_viaje: honestly, we prolly dun wanna wait, better to re-make the servers starting this weekend than to wait for w/e

asciilifeform: diana_coman: quickest way to put a smg box in asciilifeform's rack is to put to use the new 'dulaps' (due in at end of next wk). however you may find it +ev to get the piz boxen sent to england, this depends on exact outputs of BingoBoingo .

asciilifeform: ( given http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-18#1946269 )

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 09:51:05 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946179 << definitely, i'd buy in all republican dcs. which so far has been one.

asciilifeform: there is a stockpile of emergency spare FG here. will install on request of mp_en_viaje , there is enuff for 3 boxen w/ paired sets.

diana_coman: asciilifeform: the part I can't see is how can they end up better shipped from Uruguay than just bought in the US and shipped to you; re the rest I got it and it can wait; onth s.mg servers better online asap since uhm, so far had to even tell new players that no server

ossabot: (eulora) 2019-10-18 mp_en_viaje: chickachew, atm the server's offline ; long story, our uruguay dc died an unseemly death and in the process of moving atm

asciilifeform: diana_coman: right, i see it as unlikely (but afaik still possible) that the old boxen are worth picking up. which is wai i did not wait for output of 'what costs pick up' ; loading up on habitable irons already .

asciilifeform: diana_coman: the 1 irons that absolutely must be retrieved, imho, is fg.

asciilifeform: diana_coman: if you already set up mirror on leased heathen box, i expect you'll keep it, will bridge interval b/w nao and when proper fgistic, human-built irons are operational.

asciilifeform: diana_coman: if diana_coman & mp_en_viaje would like to set up smgtron on 1 of the new boxen, plox to let asciilifeform know asap, so can purchase the desired type and qty of disks. there are 4, as before , disk rails in ea. 'dulap'.

asciilifeform: also available for purchase is the actual, entire box, which i'ma value at 1k usd (not incl. of disks) . then will live at colo rate.

asciilifeform: (however if new owner, then responsible for transportation cost, should new owner wish to move it later out of usa. and also for cost of any disk swaps.)

asciilifeform: diana_coman & co can make this decision at leisure, after e.g. properly evaluating performance of rack ( and asciilifeform as rack gardener ) for the prev.-announced phree month of service.

asciilifeform: until satisfied -- no cost.

asciilifeform: it is my current understanding, tho, that smg mandates cremation for all disks that it has used ; therefore disks must be owned by smg, and i'ma buy the exact type requested & invoice immediately.

asciilifeform: ( asciilifeform cremations are carried out with thermite. )

asciilifeform: diana_coman: to return to subj of boxen trapped in uy -- these can be transported for 500/ea ( asciilifeform goes with own hands ) and is +ev for so long as there are exactly 4 to be carried, and that they then to go in asciilifeform's rails. ( and at same time can retrieve all FG, incl. customer-owned, they can be mailed anywhere in world, but apparently uy has customs idjicy if mailed ~from~ uy.) this may be worth considering. all

asciilifeform: such boxes would be housed at colo rate.

asciilifeform: however -- slow.

asciilifeform: if no one can stomach such delay, what will happen is that asciilifeform bids on the iron auctions, and may go anyway at own expense to retrieve irons if wins .

asciilifeform: to continue in the spirit of 'fucking document the how-why' -- to asciilifeform , thoroughly battle-tested 'dulaps' are actually worth 1.5x of 'fresh' . the type of defects that occur in these, follow 'bathtub curve.'

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 16:03:19 asciilifeform: mp's 'make it an engineered, not shamanic, product' crit is valid.

asciilifeform: wb mp_en_viaje

mp_en_viaje: <mp_en_viaje> no, i'm not interested in sending you a harddrive so maybe you'll do something whatever in your garage.

mp_en_viaje: <mp_en_viaje> this sorta-kinda-and-i-do-what-i-please thingee is of no value and no interest. if you're seruous about committibng the rest of your life to running an isp, we can talk about some business.

mp_en_viaje: <mp_en_viaje> if you're just looking for a coupla week's amateur entertainment, i got a whole line of hookers looking for same pounding down my door.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i intend to run the cage indefinitely (will house own www also.) and properly.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: plox to point to missing pieces, lately have been occupied with the actual bringup of the physical plant.

asciilifeform: ( already diana_coman requested rk. so must fill. )

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: asciilifeform arrived already at conclusion 'must run isp for rest of life', apparently is the only way to get proper isp is to physically build.

asciilifeform: ty BingoBoingo

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: 'properly' == 'delivers what's printed on the box' and +ev so can be carried on in fact indefinitely.

mp_en_viaje: well, so therein lies the problem : your margin must >= your living expenses, else the "dedicate life" is a sorta joke. a coupla boxes from me won't ever support such a margin, so what's missing is what you intend to do about this.

mp_en_viaje: what sorta margin do you need, what sorta margin do you intend to charge per box, how many boxes that comes to and how do you intend to scare up.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: actually 6 users at ~40usd ea. already put asciilifeform into profit. asciilifeform was paying >100 for sadhostings, and can finally stop.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: what, exactly, do you want ?

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 12:02:14 mp_en_viaje: <mp_en_viaje> this sorta-kinda-and-i-do-what-i-please thingee is of no value and no interest. if you're seruous about committibng the rest of your life to running an isp, we can talk about some business.

mp_en_viaje: it's not "im going to do this for rest of life." it's "this is what i'm gonna do with myself, for rest of life".

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: can haz concretely ? 'i won't subscribe until this idjit shows how can actually afford to run working isp' is faircop. but am i even parsing mp_en_viaje's objection correctly ?

BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: It's going to need the mechanized contact churner Pizarro never got. Even doing this in the reich with cheaper cages and more fiber, the thing has to grow to survive.

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i have no intention of housing heathens. specified right off the bat, l1+l2.

asciilifeform: indeed

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: is this actual q, or simply constructed to give asciilifeform a banana to slip on ?

BingoBoingo: If this thing grows and you fill cages upon cages, it survives. It it doesn't grow, when shit happens instead of being an ISP you end up with your upstream deciding you are a "problem customer"

asciilifeform: if you as matter of principle dun want to use an asciilifeform isp, plox to say so right off, rather than 'play with food'

mp_en_viaje: it's not merely an actual q, it's a universal, fixed-for-all-time and long long ago standard q.

mp_en_viaje: the whole tree is given there, too : 1. to dedicate life to X, X must cover your living. this is true today as it was always true, monastery provided monk wioth food enough to live, so as to make "dedicate life" possible. because, elementarily, if no food life ends, even if the monk stubborn enough to not move to greener pastrues.

mp_en_viaje: 2. X being a commercial enterprise, will have a very clearly specified margin. "we charge 20%".

mp_en_viaje: 3. you being a fortunately specified thing, will have also clear needs. "i want 50k/year"

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: propaganda/l2 growth is ~the~ project. and req's asciilifeform's 'weak arm' to properly exercise. which is 1 of the reasons i took up 'bake isp again'. but presently weak arm. intent is to use strong arm to build exercise machine for weak, among other.

mp_en_viaje: 2+3 produce 4 : to make 50k / year at 20%, one must generate 20k/month in sales

mp_en_viaje: and from there on, "we aim to sell ~20 or ~200 or whatever item, therefore so many of them, and to get to that we do this" and on and on and on.

mp_en_viaje: the narrative of business was definitively complete cca 1700, it's like any other folk tale, always goes the exact same way.

mp_en_viaje: whereas the narrative of amateurship, also well standardized by now, is rather novel ; completed by about 1880s or so. "this is a thing i do ; but i am not this thing i do".

mp_en_viaje: i for one have entirely no problem with asciilifeform run isp ; but i have major problem with github-isp, like with github anything else.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: there's 2 separate qs.: a) whether it is possible to run a comfortably +ev miniature isp for use of l1/l2. b) is how to run large isp, hosting 1000 heathens, to make 100k's. presently it would be a lie if asciilifeform said that knows how to (b) , and suicidal if tried to (a) + (b) simultaneously right off .

asciilifeform: weak arm -- still weak.

asciilifeform: would like, tho, to train it.

asciilifeform: inexpensive site mirrors ; boxen w/ FG ; l1 maintainer .

mp_en_viaje: but in a coupla years if the dc implodes and you decide you still can't move, i'll ???

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: in fact i'm continuing the dig for spare dc's. cuz this is the obvious, kindergarten problem.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: fill 1, go +ev, get 2nd, get 3rd..

mp_en_viaje: and if in three weeks this "is solved" in the sense of no longer getting a lot of loglines, and you happen to see a teledildonic telescope on sale, and you buy that, i

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: my current understanding is that yer done w/ '1 cage' regardless, asciilifeform's edifice is to house mirrors, spares ?

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i dun anticipate buyin' anyffin but rackables until further notice, lol

asciilifeform: will keep spares around, likewise, ate mp_en_viaje's flame re 'what kinda tard are you, no spare irons?'

mp_en_viaje: can you appreciate the "wtf were these two doing, sat on isp while playing with xray machine" ?

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: can appreciate 9000 things. which is wai show up to mp_en_viaje's whipping post.

asciilifeform: it's where subj is taught, it was not taught at uni, no.

mp_en_viaje: as i was saying earlier in the proceedings, nsa could very well support this effort ; but it has to be fucking serious not penny ante flavour-of-the-week amateur show.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: mp_en_viaje is my sole tutor for 'how to serious'.

mp_en_viaje: well, so do you have some kind of bridge for the gaping void of btc-dubaloo conversions for instance ? i remember that was one of the original wtfs.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i determined that dc knows how to eat wires. when comes the time to expand the tower, will run BingoBoingo-style auction , to fill this.

asciilifeform: presently i wish to 'buy' some coin personally however.

mp_en_viaje: is this adult bank wire ? or the mickey mouse what are they, "send money back to nicaragua" things ?

asciilifeform: proper wire.

asciilifeform: they even eat 'paypal'ism.

asciilifeform: 1 of asciilifeform's longer aims is to teach the proprietor to eat coin. but presently i'd like to eat some meself.

asciilifeform: opened already

mp_en_viaje: i mean financed. eg when i logged into dns thing a few days back at BingoBoingo 's request discovered i have like 1k usd rotting in there. and that place takes bitcoin, too.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: already made arrangements to park arbitrary sums in'ere.

asciilifeform: the proprietor is cooperative, for him it is pure win.

asciilifeform: rack gotten. was promised tonight keys.

asciilifeform: also acquired all of the basic essentials for filling.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: inhabitants !

asciilifeform: diana_coman already requested rk, it will be installed immediately when get key.

mp_en_viaje: i see. ok, so what'd the charge be for the building of two clones of the smg machines + 1 clone of the pizarro shared server and for a year's hosting ?

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: do you wish to purchase the irons or to lease ?

mp_en_viaje: lobbes i'm thinking of cloning the pizarro shared for sitting down your thing on ; but comments welcome.

diana_coman: mp_en_viaje: let me go back through the whole log because honestly, I'm having a problem with asciilifeform's frenzy-spitting in the logs

asciilifeform thinks

mp_en_viaje: well, is your policy to stockpile irons for ye olde bitcoin insurance theory or is it to not ?

asciilifeform: it is

mp_en_viaje: a corp with significant dubaloo-denominated capital goods and bitcoin earnin gpower is like the golden boy of bitcoin finance.

diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-18#1946438 - 2 clones of the smg machines ie dev and prod server works; the website used to be on the shared server but tbh it's both the lightest and the least sensitive part, it can live ~anywhere.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 12:38:42 mp_en_viaje: diana_coman, you happy with that design btw ? would prefer something else ?

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i propose price : equiv of 100 orc$ per mo per such leased machine, inclusive of full service . to be paid either monthly, quarterly, or yearly, as customer so wishes.

asciilifeform: ( piz colo , for comparison , was 141.7 u.s.$ / mo, for empty hole, machines were moar )

mp_en_viaje: this is not how you propose prices dude. it's by bill of parts, with margin at bottom.

mp_en_viaje: a car will take 4 wheels 10 bucks each + 1 chasis 80 bux + 9 windows 2.20 + 1 engine 115 and our margin 20% comes to (4*10+1*80+9 *2.20+1*115)*1.2 = 305.76

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i'ma post the exact breakdown momentarily

ossabot: (eulora) 2018-07-21 mircea_popescu: !Qcalc 1*24+2*25+19*21+120*20+1*12+4936*20+23*12+4*12+25*18+1300*20+9*11+4*3+17*21+69*20+1017*20+1470*23+1962*21+350*22+3*22+72*20+77*23+3*21+75*15

ossabot: (eulora) 2018-07-22 Birdman: !Qcalc (54*.32*10*1000)+(378*.37*10*964)+(180*1.35*1000)

ossabot: (eulora) 2018-06-02 diana_coman: !Qcalc 5411*(18*0.99+13*0.13+200*0.01+277*0.14+13*0.13+327*0.15+9*0.96)

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: 100 is a rounded-off output of complicated arithmetic similar to ^ including cost of cage, % of max amperage eaten by $box at peak load, cost of ip, amortization of iron. i'ma post for criticism after tea.

diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-18#1946300 - meanwhile after reading a translation of some chinese dude's similar attempts to "communicate", I start suspecting that everyone's chinese!! but after this experience, I'll add to #o curriculum documented interactions with unknown people to be done until result is judged acceptable.

mp_en_viaje: diana_coman, i should prolly have that god damned youtube translated, it's just TOO fucking archetypical.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 12:46:23 diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-18#1946438 - 2 clones of the smg machines ie dev and prod server works; the website used to be on the shared server but tbh it's both the lightest and the least sensitive part, it can live ~anywhere.

mp_en_viaje: perhaps should lay into asciilifeform to offer a shared of their own and we move all the stuff off BingoBoingo 's continuity bridge in there within a month or two ?

diana_coman: mp_en_viaje: that makes sense as a direct replication of previous setup; I don't really see anything wrong with it either; alternatively I suppose I can always set it up even on a vps with maxim or whatevers, it's literally "don't care where", all of it is public and fixed and should just be accessible for people to download stuff.

diana_coman: mp_en_viaje: I am all for hosting it with asciilifeform but tbh I would very much want him to publish an actual business plan on his blog.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje, diana_coman : i'ma have to re-do the whole numeric orchestra, and write proper summary, w/ rationally-founded constants and at length. will need , potentially, entire day. ( still guarantee cost less than piz, however, for analogous machines. )

asciilifeform: for today also, grr, are scheduled the physical maneuvers. but indeed i cant expect anyone to subscribe unless it is made known to what they're subscribing.

asciilifeform: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-18#1946473 << this is good idea. i'ma obtain the necessary physical pieces for ~that~ after properly serviced existing queue ( diana_coman's demo rk ; correct and rational price summary )

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 13:03:05 mp_en_viaje: perhaps should lay into asciilifeform to offer a shared of their own and we move all the stuff off BingoBoingo 's continuity bridge in there within a month or two ?

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo : at earliest chance, plox to calculate necessary machine resources for piz-style shared box.

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: and, and, what you want in exchange for your participation. given as this op is not a continuation of piz proper.

asciilifeform off to do queued works, but will answer q's if needed.

BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I'll work on a shared server how-to with hardware resources necessary. I can tell you now such a machine is going to want all the RAM it can get. On 'anyserver' MySQL's RAM consumption has been stable and depended so far on how many blogs it has been fed. Apache however benefits tremendously from spinning up new workers and there isn't another httpd worth messing with for the purpose.

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: ty, seems that we'll want a 'dulap-type' for this. i'ma 1st handle the outstanding reqs tho.

BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I'll bake a blog post architecting what an ideal shared host machine involves based on the lessons of UY1 and anyserver.

BingoBoingo: http://bingology.net/2019/10/16/reasonable-lamp-setup-for-mp-wp-on-centos-6-and-anyserver-terms-of-use/ Leaves out the directory structure figuring someone may want to use the instructions for their own use rather than necessarily bringing up a shared machine.

mp_en_viaje: incidentally, how about you offer l2s, new or otherwise, a year of free hosting ? i'ma throw in a free domain registration with it on my own account, and there you go, novice welcoming package.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: this is very smart imho. it shall be done.

asciilifeform: logical. and anticipated, which is why buying min. of 256GB for ea. 'dulap.

asciilifeform: (they can eat up to half tb)

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i only buy ecc, last thing i need in list of headaches is neutron . have enuff headaches. (ftr asciilifeform detects 2-3 ecc corrections each yr. per box.)

mp_en_viaje: if your machine mostly serves web, it loses an estimated 20-25 ppm to web being made of shit. meanwhile 2-3 per year comes to sub 1 ppq. it just doesn

asciilifeform: ( rk, however, lacks ecc. but also much smaller footprint for particle. )

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: moar concerned with 'box goes down' or 'writes garbage to disk' or 'permits login from rando' than 'garbage www output'.

mp_en_viaje: running a business is all about doing math. "am i willin gto pay 1.5% more for a box to reduce losses by one in five million ?"

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: this is valid but cost differential for 'dulap'-types is negligible .

asciilifeform cannot dispute.

mp_en_viaje: asciilifeform, i'm not hell bent on saving the % either ; just making the general point.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i also like the thermal margin offered by ecc. but the point is made.

mp_en_viaje: for that matter, for all i know $1k worth of ecc now will be worth 50% more than that 1k worth of non-ecc in two years, whatever.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: it would appear that you're correct re 'hold value', at the very least : death of 'moor's law' is palpable.

BingoBoingo: Hardware wise UY1 left little to nothing to nitpick. Dulap type machine lots of ram, lots of fast disk, plenty of cores, hard to have too much of any of these things when shitting pages from public facing port. The room for improvement is in the stack and its management.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i will be speaking in person to proprietor to help fill in all of the constants for numerics ( in particular, the cost of additional amperage, when required ; and the stability of the (suspiciously low) price , in particular re desirability of locking it in through advanced payment . )

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: meanwhile 5min ago i was informed that the leased ips (initially, 6) are prepared.

asciilifeform: and that my key to the grounds is being readied.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: my principal ill feeling is re the price, it is suspiciously small. 'there has to be catch'.

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: presently i suspect there is a glut of supply in this geography.

asciilifeform: apparently moar bound than rube-asciilifeform prev. thought.

asciilifeform: 'coloco' co. made the (so far , i've nuffin to dispute it with) claim that it's a regional nexus w/ 4 separate fiber hoses in 4 compass directions to 4 peers, 2 power grids, etc.

asciilifeform: diana_coman: meanwhile, i've successfully decoded and unpacked your rk backup. it will go into brand-new rk today.

asciilifeform: ty BingoBoingo for setting this up .

asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: i took a naive stab at calculating the 'floor' for this locale. the util co charges presently 7.83 cents per kW/hr. the halftower is supplied with a 1.2kW baseline . 24*30*0.0783*1.2 ~= 70 $ of mains current ; warehouse sq. metrage goes for ~30 / m^2 here, this yields 100; and the remaining unaccounted for portion of price is then 295 , which presumably includes net pipe , upkeep of the grounds (maintenance, cooling, sla

asciilifeform: ves) , and geschäft .

asciilifeform: can make this moar exact floor : the kWatt costs ~same to remove as to emit. therefore cooling can estimate also as 70.

asciilifeform: ( not inclusive of maintenance. )

asciilifeform: but i'ma leave off , it is difficult to produce solid figure w/out moar data, for above .

mp_en_viaje: trinque, is there some way to make deedbot wallet work within ~hour rather than ~days ? is there some way to make paste more like 20mb limit than the current wha tis it 2 ? 1 ?

trinque: deedbot wallet is cold storage, and exiting the cold storage requires my involvement

mp_en_viaje: asciilifeform, presumably if you actually eat 1.2kw you may hear some more about it.

mp_en_viaje: trinque, iirc there was a scheme discussed year or two ago re small sums and a definition thereof ?

mp_en_viaje: in practical terms -- i can use deedbot just fine for in-l payments ; but it is currently not usable for out-of-l payments because of the delay. 99% of those payments are tiny, why leave it on the table.

a111: Logged on 2019-10-10 01:37 trinque: no startup is an every couple days affair. it's an every waking moment affair, and it redefines waking without your asking too.

trinque: I've just watched these other guys shred their savings making a notbusiness and then apparently going to do the same thing in another spot, because the last one was cursed with the "locals are subhuman" or w/e, and having not to do with themselves

trinque: what other payment throughput is there to make the thing revenue, and if not, I can't spend my time like that.

trinque: I took a few passes at them to help with the business too, and this twat (yes you, alf) dares try to w/e, get me to take up the broken business or imitate it in same vein only after he's shat his pants.

mp_en_viaje: is the idea that you're not interested in developing bitcoin things because you don't perceive there's a way to benefit from it ?

trinque: I think it's hard to see the market, but in the last thread about the hardware RSA device it was clear I wasn't talking about market the same way as you, and that's where the clarity ended.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-06 22:36:09 trinque: that thing has a market. everyone knows tls is a lie.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-07 08:46:23 mircea_popescu: market schmarket, markets are created not identified.

diana_coman: trinque: are you saying that "I watched pizarro failing because they didn't bring people in the wot; so not worth dev the wallet because not enough people in wot" ?

diana_coman: trinque: but if you make a business out of it then part and parcel is precisely bringing people in to use it ie create the market, no?

mp_en_viaje: trinque, tbh, i started this discussion from the grass roots, "of my so many past txn, X% went through my friend trinque and Y% through rando retards ; why should Y >> X ?!?!?!"

mp_en_viaje: now, this may morph into a very different, from the top down discussion, okay, if you will. but then let's carry it properly, neh ? rather than mix everything in there.

mp_en_viaje: or if not, let's dispose of the raisins first. what is your beef with the pizarro folk, they lost their own money, being derpy. you donated them some boxes, iirc

mp_en_viaje: diana_coman, no, i know. and ima eg buy bimbo some instagram followers, cuz w/e, teenybopper interests, wants to instagram. and so on.

trinque: mp_en_viaje: one is going to have to figure out to get fed post-apocalypse, or ever larp in the grand shadow of mp

trinque: the latter is all these fucks have been doing, "if I tell these UYians my cock is 7ft, they'll line up at feet just like mp's girls"

mp_en_viaje: do you perceive the whole adventure is actually a grand scam, in the sense that what i claim is whatever, business republic bitcoin etc, but what i'm ~really~ looking for is people to prop up my ego somehow, like an elaborate social dance ? cuz i know full well success is impossible or something ?

trinque: I even told alf I had the cash to do an experimental run of the RSA chip, and he ignored, because why have friends

trinque: and if the chip is mp's that's fine too, but my trust of these other chaps is at nil.

mp_en_viaje: the whole "i tell these fucks about my cock" became painfully evident reviewing the whole earlier nuttery.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-18 10:37:28 mp_en_viaje: it's llike watching silviu gherman pick up chicks. "hi i am from the dick people"

mp_en_viaje: well so what are you saying then, "i dun wanna be myself/my work associated with the rest of l1" ?

mp_en_viaje: if you're interested in my (allegedly clueless, as it periodically is) understanding of the matter, alf wasn't interested in baking you a rsa chip because the item is not currently feasible. it specifically requires an object not yet known to exist, the extremely long mult'er.

mp_en_viaje: i would certainly not mind it being baked, and i dunno, i'd have thought the pizarro history shewed clear enough i also don't mind people doing things on their own at all. you can make it if you want, that's not an issue. but you won't be able to make it as things stand, not anymore than you'll make a useful electric car. a central needed thing's not there.

trinque: the particular item might not be possible yet, maybe there are experiments leading up, maybe not yet.

trinque: but if others are going to keep bankrupting themselves for honor (or because they'd rather will the dicksucking rather than work like I'm certain mp did to have the money), we're just going to be boo-hooing that mp wont give us some of his coin.

trinque: so if there's something that will get more people using the wallet, and thus make the wallet viable (i.e. I can pay someone to improve it, and do so without it being charity out of my own pocket), I will have to think of that thing.

mp_en_viaje: i dunno how up to date on subatomic physics you are ; but the problem is just as fundamental as the energy-density problem (for which the link to the great log discussion escapes me now) of car batteries : at 4000 units wide, the noise well exceeds the signal.

mp_en_viaje: trinque, factually, everyone bankrupts himself for honor. consider this thoroughly if you will. someone just posted what turns out to be zuckerberg's ugly gf on trilema ; they "pledge to donate 99% of facebook" bla bla. why ?

mp_en_viaje: some guy arms a ship to whatever, discover uraniumgold. why ? "to discover" my foot, it's for honor equally so, he figures the goal's respectable.

mp_en_viaje: all you do, in the end, is honor-driven not otherwise ; may be justified otherwise, but at the root and at the core, the quantum of deed runs on a dropplet of honor.

mp_en_viaje: the "i'm not quite sunken low enough to eat here" coming before my leaving some shitty joint and the "i think nsa might finance a serious attempt" before, what, they're based on money ? not directly. the first node's honor.

trinque: sure, if money were root, I'd just get really good at sucking dick, but if honor were everything I'd not also eat.

mp_en_viaje: an' i defy you to give me an example of any business decision, you or anyone ever made, which didn't root in honor.

mp_en_viaje: (and yes, if honor's not root people do end up with direct equiv of sucking cock real good, which usually comes as crystal meth, or some other instant reward pathway chaser)

mp_en_viaje: (hence my point, the whole underlying mechanism of savings and investing's naught besides delayed gratification as a behaviour, which is how biologists call honor)

mp_en_viaje: you're the lord, i've no doubt you're smart an' possessed, you come up with it! i'm more than willing to sound it for you, but what, i'm togive you detailed marchong orders ?

mp_en_viaje: i wouldn't do that for BingoBoingo either, arguably who needed it more and asked more pointedly.

asciilifeform (will leave trinque alone for nao) but must report that the cage has been made ready, and installation of gear is to commence tonight .

mp_en_viaje: to circle back to the method : it's evident that reducing friction's universally a major goal. so it seems to me. thus things like the orig line that started the discussion. it further seems to me that talking to people's the other major goal.

mp_en_viaje: leaves two things to do, out of the three. high quality products, that we do quite well, i am well satisfied of this.

mp_en_viaje: trinque, i wouldn't even mind smg publishing for you, in some sane arrangement.

mp_en_viaje: to be quite frank, i wish for my sins i could be persuaded by the gloom and doom, "everyone's here idiots, will never do or amount to anything" and so on. i truly do, because my life'd be a whole lot simpler. but... it's not there, here's a group of people which over years not decades got a LOT of shit together. as far as making quality products this hole's unparalleled.

mp_en_viaje: and i do not say this idly ; i have made my own experiments as well as seen others', very EXPENSIVE, experiments in the same vein all over the world. people regularly sink billion+ in "tech incubator" producing nothing comparable.

mp_en_viaje: now, how to keep tmsr from being another xerox parc / symbolics / etc is, and has been a major thing on my forebrain.

mp_en_viaje: because yes, it seems producers are blessed with fucking stupid by aunt nature.

mp_en_viaje: trinque, you're actually the one that gets in ~least trouble for being fucking weird. almost on girl level.

mp_en_viaje: the reason i asked "why videogames" was because, oddly, that's the one field i feel like i've a good grip on/.

mp_en_viaje: of course, it's taking its god damned sweet time, and ppl keep waylaying diana_coman with weird, but...

trinque: wouldn't be the first time I said fuck it, grabbed guitar and joint, and said "that's enough money for now, bbl"

mp_en_viaje: the "artist" idiocy is prolly the most annyoing part of it all, all these people just want to make ONE commission and run off, zero interest in anything besides masturbation, "art" is just pretense. fundamentally they're still http://trilema.com/2018/and-in-todays-lulz-the-obnoxious-cocksucker/ ust in a different line of wank.

mp_en_viaje: some dude draw me as hitler ; some other dude (quite good, too) drew eulora's splashscreen (and some kid another) and jesuis, what 12, there's a bunch more.

mp_en_viaje: but it's quite manifest, their principal fear/problem/goal is to AVOID investment.

mp_en_viaje: so you know, maybe you're the merchant who went to town to talk to the lord, to ask his question, "your grace, how the fuck do i keep my shop open when it's raining sulphuric acid"

mp_en_viaje: and the lord answered "i don't know, my good man. for, you see... it is raining. SULPHURIC ACID."

mp_en_viaje: i have been keeping a (quite public, at that) log of a wide reaching "where is it not raining" research project. expensive enough, too, i've been burning 4 figures/day, every day, since ~april. not that the point is how to make it cheapest or anything

trinque: re: atomization, girl got in big trouble recently for dealing with people at concerts incorrectly

trinque: told her she was being an idiot, and you make them your friends, and then tell them to make space for the dance party

trinque: I couldn't fucking believe this had to be explained, not just to her, but to everyone there

trinque: "what they're scared animals too; tell them what they're doing there, it's not like anyone knows"

BingoBoingo: So in today news found a responsive lawyer interested in the case. As our conversation started http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=1YXH hit my inbox

diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-18#1946571 - mainly because it was mp_en_viaje & you conversation; and you keep yourself quite private otherwise so I don't really know how much/where from you want any feedback.

mp_en_viaje: because that'd be the correct answer at this juncture, "here's my copy of police report"

BingoBoingo: Well, most recently recommnded lawyer so far is responsive, fellow who recommended him has actually used him as a lawyer rather than merely an acquintance.

BingoBoingo: Anyways, only 4 mentions of "causa extraña" in the entire civile code. Two involve liability in construction. One involves the operation of depositories. Then there's: El deudor es condenado al resarcimiento de daños y perjuicios, sea en razón de la falta de cumplimiento de la obligación o de la demora en la ejecución, aunque no haya mala fe de su parte, siempre que no justifique que la falta de cumplimiento proviene de c

BingoBoingo: asciilifeform mod6: Update. As of the most recent communication from the datacenter, it seems they want to be sued. You have this weekend to think this matter over. There is the chance they may be pushed into settling. Based on their response and the fact they pushed it through Maxi, I suspect they ended their week of sweating by deciding to bluff. First sit down with counsel scheduled for 8pm UTC Monday. Another sitdown may be

mod6: Thanks for the update BingoBoingo. I'm a couple of days behind on logz here; I've been horribly ill for the last 3 days. I'll start catching up, bbl.

BingoBoingo: Anyways http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-17#1946062 was all too prophetic when it came to dealing with the survivors. They will be fed shit!

ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-17 01:44:25 mp_en_viaje: c) you're thinking too cleanly, which is adequate for republican work but inadequate to interfacing work (a point somewhat reminescent of this php discussion). it's the empire of shit for a reason, let it have it.