assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13308 @ 0.00085035 = 11.3165 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29600 @ 0.00084798 = 25.1002 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 2250 @ 0.00195527 = 4.3994 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16100 @ 0.00084798 = 13.6525 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 200 @ 0.0019975 = 0.3995 BTC [+]
jurov: ;;calc 1/0.0019975
KRS1: why are markets this way? because it rose up so quick?
KRS1: seems there has been good news lately..idk
gribble: 1 BTC = 906.625 USD = 669.7238875 eur
jurov: ;;ticker --last --currency eur --market all
gribble: MtGox BTCEUR last: 658.33, vol: 1386.72019629 | Bitstamp BTCEUR last: 592.444787, vol: 16631.24159665 | BTC-E BTCEUR last: 597.99996, vol: 398.29529 | CampBX BTCEUR last: 590.96, vol: 163.33309995 | BTCChina BTCEUR last: 599.238717, vol: 4465.72000000 | Volume-weighted last average: 597.811355208
KRS1: i dont think there is anything to blame for the bearish markets..perhaps people are just wanting to sell after the recent run up.
jurov: it's going for a week already
mircea_popescu: maybe btc is actually pricing the eur/usd pair better than the fiat markets ?
kakobrekla: the differences there are nothing compared to btc
mircea_popescu: sure, but the thing is... a triangle is a triangle. you never know which si the wrong side.
kakobrekla: if you have a big exposure to btc you can not possibly whine about a tiny eur usd difference
KRS1: nov btc was around $500 this is probably just a correction
kakobrekla: it would make sense to make btc of eurusd like panacea does
kakobrekla: but i do not think this is the case here
ozbot: The Feds Are Ready To Sell $25 Million of Bitcoin Seized From The Silk Road - Forbes
pankkake: buyers that might buy less from the usual exchanges, then
Apocalyptic: <kakobrekla> this is not for regular folks // +1
jurov: no i think it will be buyers who don't like these play exchanges
jurov: banksters must be pretty scared of how gox and their ilk handles stuff
pankkake: that's understandable, but I would be surprised if it had no influence
Apocalyptic: may be a good way for institutional players to get some coins without wreaking the exchange price
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla you can participate in a public auction, sure, why not
pankkake: doing it outside of exchanges is pretty much the only way
pankkake: but they might be buying already; maybe they buy from bitpay or stuff?
KRS1: oh wow ebay allowing virt currency sales/trading by feb.
KRS1: is coindesk reliable?
kakobrekla: even if its public, regular folks dont buy such quantities of coin at once
pankkake: lol, so they are adding a category
KRS1: its certainly not bad news
mircea_popescu: coindesk is not very reliable, but then again ebay is in fact going to bow to virtuals.
pankkake: nothing really changing from what is already there really
pankkake: at least it means they won't ban it
KRS1: perhaps more people will at least be exposed to it if they havent already.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 352 @ 0.0008899 = 0.3132 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: i think by now pretty much anyone alive has been so exposed.
mircea_popescu: the btc rift guild is like 500 people strong, maybe half actually came from trilema, the rest just, randomly, from in game
pankkake: ebay is a slow, bulky, money hungry monster. don't think they'll have bitcoin as a payment anytime soon
mircea_popescu: thge funny think is that we did have the opportunity to crush ebay
pankkake: so it's closing because it's closing
pankkake: ebay is good because you are pretty sure you can sell fast at a good price
kakobrekla: not, its closing because its a window.
pankkake: but what if it was painless to list on both?
pankkake: "Havelock is where the future of bitcoin is being made"
jurov: bitmit was something, but was relentlessly driven to ground
jurov: and no significant contender appeared
mircea_popescu: jurov actually the dread pirate guy was a worse threat.
mircea_popescu: which sounded to me like an incredibly lame mp-wannabe moment.
ozbot: Cryptostocks Turnaround
mircea_popescu: most airplanes crashing into the ground spin all the way there.
kakobrekla: gosh i dont remember last time i played sturmikov
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.55988799 BTC [-]
KRS1: ah the good ole days
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1000 @ 0.00081495 = 0.815 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27350 @ 0.00084699 = 23.1652 BTC [-] {3}
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1174 blocks | Estimated Change: 17.5075% in 6d 17h 23m 59s
the20year2: cost to issue a stock on mpex if eligible is 25-30btc, right mircea?
mircea_popescu: you need an account in the first place. other than that, the listing fees are negotiated as part of the listing process.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22300 @ 0.00084642 = 18.8752 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 45 @ 0.00534976 = 0.2407 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48363 @ 0.00085 = 41.1086 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30637 @ 0.00085157 = 26.0896 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.5595 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31500 @ 0.00085172 = 26.8292 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62236 @ 0.0008528 = 53.0749 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19450 @ 0.00084952 = 16.5232 BTC [-]
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1162 blocks | Estimated Change: 17.5418% in 6d 15h 36m 20s
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28839 @ 0.0008488 = 24.4785 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5650 @ 0.00085338 = 4.8216 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 400 @ 0.0009 = 0.36 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25575 @ 0.00085141 = 21.7748 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5691 @ 0.00084874 = 4.8302 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47983 @ 0.00085465 = 41.0087 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23200 @ 0.00085491 = 19.8339 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21496 @ 0.00085539 = 18.3875 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10804 @ 0.00085567 = 9.2447 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11400 @ 0.00084754 = 9.662 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 9 @ 0.02649998 = 0.2385 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.569 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 55 @ 0.00534997 = 0.2942 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23646 @ 0.00085486 = 20.214 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25671 @ 0.00085604 = 21.9754 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36700 @ 0.00085427 = 31.3517 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43000 @ 0.00085427 = 36.7336 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50213 @ 0.00085493 = 42.9286 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46100 @ 0.0008517 = 39.2634 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 90 @ 0.02649998 = 2.385 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28714 @ 0.00084941 = 24.39 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37800 @ 0.00084779 = 32.0465 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36750 @ 0.00084751 = 31.146 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42963 @ 0.00084557 = 36.3282 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16450 @ 0.00084441 = 13.8905 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7849 @ 0.00084441 = 6.6278 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11779 @ 0.00084441 = 9.9463 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [7C] 35 @ 0.00479941 = 0.168 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [7C] 50 @ 0.005 = 0.25 BTC [+]
KRS1: wooo somebody do something crazy
KRS1: 0530 am here in the states
KRS1: blasting buck cherry-lit up
ozbot: Lit Up- Buckcherry - YouTube
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1109 blocks | Estimated Change: 18.7157% in 6d 6h 10m 59s
KRS1: When it comes to bitcoin irc is dead these hours.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20150 @ 0.00084588 = 17.0445 BTC [+]
KRS1: THAT folks is perfection.
KRS1: thats what i want for a wife..i thought thats the polish type of looks in a female..german maybe
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 4 @ 0.02649999 = 0.106 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19115 @ 0.00084898 = 16.2283 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6635 @ 0.00084898 = 5.633 BTC [+]
ArsKisS: is it a must to spam the bot
KRS1: yea..been up all night.
KRS1: didnt think it was a problem since nobody was here
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33892 @ 0.00085245 = 28.8912 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37954 @ 0.00084683 = 32.1406 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18850 @ 0.00084319 = 15.8941 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12800 @ 0.00084318 = 10.7927 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 477 @ 0.0008201 = 0.3912 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9572 @ 0.00084753 = 8.1126 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25059 @ 0.00085151 = 21.338 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 36 @ 0.00290319 = 0.1045 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 282 @ 0.00293251 = 0.827 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 336 @ 0.0029388 = 0.9874 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00085266 = 5.5423 BTC [+]
ArsKisS: KRS1, silly flood is always a problem
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32878 @ 0.00085186 = 28.0075 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3903 @ 0.00084969 = 3.3163 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18447 @ 0.00085174 = 15.712 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11100 @ 0.0008482 = 9.415 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17241 @ 0.00085125 = 14.6764 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25200 @ 0.00085196 = 21.4694 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.569 = 1.138 BTC [+]
ozbot: BitBet - Block 315k mined on or before July 28th
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47900 @ 0.00084829 = 40.6331 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32100 @ 0.00084578 = 27.1495 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 358 @ 0.0004 = 0.1432 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: Guns at home more likely to be used stupidly than in self-defense | Ars Technica
gribble: Time since last block: 45 minutes and 36 seconds
mircea_popescu: that's like the only block past... hour and a half or some shit
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 97 @ 0.00534997 = 0.5189 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1080 blocks | Estimated Change: 19.0158% in 6d 0h 46m 13s
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21200 @ 0.00085285 = 18.0804 BTC [+]
nubbins`: KRS1: there's been a "Virtual Currency" category on ebay.ca for a while. They wait til you've typed out your item description to tell you that you can't list things in there yet.
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: many had the opportunity to crush ebay, few put in more than a cursory effort
nubbins`: nod, look at windows 8. everyone reviles it, then goes out and buys a new computer with it preinstalled
mircea_popescu: i never bought a computer with software preinstalled wtf.
nubbins`: shrug, most common way to buy em over here
nubbins`: beyond the average person's ability
nubbins`: its cheaper to change the oil filter in your car on your own
mircea_popescu: anyway, i can see why you wouldn't, to allow the used oil to be collected
nubbins`: you can bring the collected oil to a garage
nubbins`: anyway, countless examples. home-baked bread is maybe 15-20% the cost of store-bought
nubbins`: given a choice between convenience and thrift, people choose the former
mircea_popescu: yup. but the reason baking is a required skill is that well... store bought bread is awful
mircea_popescu: i dunno how parents allow women out of the house if they can't bake
nubbins`: the old-timers here would call it "baker's fluff"
mircea_popescu: it's a recent perversion this, and quite atrociously antisocial.
nubbins`: the average set of parents handed off most of their responsibility long ago
mircea_popescu: and then these people have the gall to discuss sociopaths.
nubbins`: nod, such are the times we live in
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9406 @ 0.00085219 = 8.0157 BTC [-]
nubbins`: on an unrelated note, i had a couple questions about stock warrants
nubbins`: well. at least one question, which will likely lead to some follow-up questions
nubbins`: don't think you have the answers i'm looking for, but sure: what's the process for redeeming one?
nubbins`: not looking to do so at the moment, just curious
Apocalyptic: you would in general inform the issuer of your intention to do so
Apocalyptic: if you're asking about MPex warrants then yeah mircea will probably be in a better pos to answer that
nubbins`: i am indeed, and i'm looking for specifics :)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30450 @ 0.00085326 = 25.9818 BTC [+] {2}
nubbins`: ah yes. not looking to redeem my stock warrant, just wondering what the process is
mircea_popescu: you state you want it redeemed, and which account it goes to, you're given an address to pay w/e it is to, you pay and have the shares pushed
nubbins`: well i don't have an account, hence my wondering
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26261 @ 0.00085218 = 22.3791 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: nubbins` then you'll have to talk to a broker to take them for you
nubbins`: i'm admittedly not an expert in the language of fiance, but as far as i can tell, having an mpex account is not a requirement for redeeming a stock warrant
mircea_popescu: nubbins` well you'll have to hold the shares somewhere.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28950 @ 0.00085427 = 24.7311 BTC [+] {2}
nubbins`: one could in theory "hold" them as a pgp-signed doc stating ownership of said shares, although i'm not sure what sort of mess that would create
mircea_popescu: nubbins` that's exactly how one's holding them now innit.
nubbins`: holding cum != holding a baby, but yes
rattaTATpowpow: nubbins, i can help facilitate at some point if you want them ob Havelock (this is TAT on the road), though CoinBr might be better
nubbins`: anyway, there isn't much written regarding redemption, here are the few snippets i could find:
nubbins`: "Special Stock Warrants (abbreviated SSW) are numbered and GPG signed instruments which create the right for a beneficiary specified by GPG fingerprint to purchase a specified number of S.MG shares directly from MiniGame for a specified price, no earlier than a specified date."
nubbins`: nothing like a client that crashes when pasting
mircea_popescu: the only difference between the ssw and the share is that the ssw receives no dividends until it becomes a share.
rattaTATpowpow: it seems that storing them as warrants makes the most sense no?
mircea_popescu: but other than that, teh cum is in all respects a baby.
nubbins`: well realistically i'm going to hold the warrant for a very long time
nubbins`: but it would seem that the requirement to purchase an account on mpex or a broker is an ex post facto condition
mircea_popescu: not more than the requirement to have some sort of container is an ex post facto condition on buying milk.
Apocalyptic: I thought all issued warrants were tied to a GPG fingerprint of a registered MPex key
nubbins`: they are indeed tied to fingerprints
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic to a gpg fingerprint yes, but it doesn't have to be a key.
nubbins`: nah, you can buy milk without a container. the farmer will happily squirt it into your mouth or on the ground
nubbins`: to perfect the analogy, consider the case where a gallon if milk is $4 and containers from the farmer cost $6
mircea_popescu: well you can squirt it on he ground if you want, sure.
mircea_popescu: i doubt farmers will hook your head to the machinery because of the risk of being sued afterwards :D
nubbins`: haha. too true. luckily there's no such recourse in btc land
nubbins`: anyway, the text of the stock warrant and the ipo could be interpreted a few ways
mircea_popescu: all text can be interpreted an infinite number of ways
nubbins`: anyway, not trying to be a pest, but there's a few points here that i think a dissection of would be interesting
nubbins`: [SSWs] are numbered and GPG signed instruments which create the right for a beneficiary specified by GPG fingerprint to purchase a specified number of S.MG shares directly from MiniGame"
nubbins`: SSW #3: "S.MG will not process or administed any assignments of this Warrant by or among third parties"
nubbins`: on the surface, these two statements appear to cut MPEx out of the picture altogether
nubbins`: IPO section 3.2(b) offers 3 conditions for future share issuance; the first two conditions explicitly list MPEx as the venue, whereas the third, dealing with stock warrants, makes no mention of MPEx
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15442 @ 0.00085438 = 13.1933 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: yes, but these being contracts made by smg they're ancillary to its ipo agreement which is also its incorporation charter.
mircea_popescu: as s.mg can not issue shares on another venue, that's what it is.
nubbins`: another venue, sure. i couldn't ask you to issue my shares on, say, uh... wait, are there even any play exchanges left?
nubbins`: but that doesn't preclude a direct issuance of shares
mircea_popescu: shares are what they are, not what some noobs thought they were, in the glbse days.
nubbins`: back to SSW #3: "[PGP fingerprint] shall be issued [x] new S.MG shares upon payment of [y] BTC to S.MG"
nubbins`: suppose a warrant holder pays [y] BTC to S.MG, and then announces they don't have an mpex account
nubbins`: one side of the contract has been fulfilled
mircea_popescu: they can't, cause tey have to say what their acct is before they can pay.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20168 @ 0.00085107 = 17.1644 BTC [-]
nubbins`: suppose at some point down the road, S.MG happens to publish a BTC address that they control
nubbins`: even something as inocuous as "feel free to donate btc to S.MG for feature improvement at 1SmgFeaturesblah1234"
nubbins`: a warrant holder sends [y] BTC to said address
nubbins`: they've fulfilled the conditions of the SSW
nubbins`: you say donation, they say payment.
mircea_popescu: because bitcoin payments can not be refused by the receiver, it logically follows that any published address will be treated exactly as the owner describes.
mircea_popescu: just like the receiver gets no say on whether he receives or not.
mircea_popescu: this separation is actually one of the best things bitcoin is doing, even if few people had so far teh mental penetration to realise it.
nubbins`: we're back to ex post facto. payment has a specific definition
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 9 @ 0.04999997 = 0.45 BTC [+] {2}
nubbins`: i eat a meal at a restaurant, head to the cash register, "oh sorry we don't take cash"
Diablo-D3: nubbins`: thats when you walk out and tell them to fuck off
nubbins`: sure, yes, unfortunately the analogy fails at this point
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 35 @ 0.00534986 = 0.1872 BTC [-]
nubbins`: "S.MG will not process or administer any assignments of this Warrant by or among third parties"
nubbins`: ^ is MPEx considered a third party
mircea_popescu: and i suppose mpex would be a 3rd party except it seems moot ? what's the case, mpex wants to buy your warrant outside of itself ?
nubbins`: what's mpex? all i've got is a warrant that mentions S.MG
mircea_popescu: this strikes me sort-of like the girl going to the gynecologist who says "don't let anyone stick his thing in there for two weeks", at which point she replies "are you anyone ?!"
mircea_popescu: well... he's not about to take her on a date, so it's moot.
nubbins`: this entire discussion is moot, but worth having nonetheless
mircea_popescu: so yeah, s.mg would at no point be processing assignments of the warrant between its holder and mpex.
mircea_popescu: quote the contrary, mpex processes assignments between the holder and s.mg
nubbins`: more accurate would be "S.MG will not process or administer any assignments of this Warrant", full stop
nubbins`: that would make for a strange document indeed
nubbins`: we're in full spring here, 15C yesterday
mircea_popescu: nubbins` the idea is that if you decide to trade it to x, and x to y, and y to zee,
mircea_popescu: it's your damned business to sort it out, and s.mg isn't getting involved.
nubbins`: but if "S.MG will not process or administer any assignments of this Warrant"... the IPO contradicts that, when it defines an SSW
nubbins`: "...to purchase a specified number of S.MG shares directly from MiniGame"
mircea_popescu: so on paper 1 it says "we don't handle third party assignments" and on paper 2 it says "this is for buying directly"
nubbins`: sure, so what's the process for me buying my shares directly from S.MG?
mircea_popescu: you notify s.mg that X mpex account will be taking Y share delivery on this here warrant of yours.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 60 @ 0.005 = 0.3 BTC
nubbins`: so there's an implied, but not stated, 30BTC charge for redeeming an SSW
mircea_popescu: you can redeem just fine, you just can't redeem to your own account if you don't have one
mircea_popescu: o. you're reading the "no third party assignments" to mean you can't have someone else's X ?
nubbins`: well, it's an ambiguous statement.
mircea_popescu: it merely says X can't come and say here, i have an assigment by nubbins, on his warrant, so please accept MY pgp as a valid signature to redeem shares.
nubbins`: i took it to mean that S.MG would only issue the shares to an account with the same fingerprint as the SSW
mircea_popescu: just as long as the original fingerprint quoted in the warrant signs for it.
nubbins`: (this was my original intention anyway)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [KCIM] 90 @ 0.00315 = 0.2835 BTC [+]
nubbins`: it may be worth clarifying some of these points
nubbins`: i live in a commonwealth country, caselaw is all we have ;p
nubbins`: anyway, interesting instruments, SSWs, and this should be illuminating text for current and future holders of such instruments
nubbins`: you mentioned earlier about the inability to refuse payments to a published address
nubbins`: this was the classic "cover your ass" tactic of those who bought illegal items on SR and other websites
nubbins`: nah, bought. purchaser slightly misspells their name when placing an order
nubbins`: package arrives, is brought indoors and left on a table, unopened
mircea_popescu: hahaha i never heard of it, but hey, whatever floats teh boat.
nubbins`: purchaser shrugs, says "how can i control who sends me packages?"
nubbins`: "they didn't even get my name right!"
nubbins`: heh. just a thought experiment, but all the elements of plausible deniability are there
mircea_popescu: all the elements of plausible deniability as reddit imagines them.
nubbins`: consider that one could send a kilo of cocaine to a reviled politician
nubbins`: no, but i know several of them
nubbins`: what's stopping me from mailing a key to one of them and then tipping off the cops?
mircea_popescu: good for you, but still, anon dork wants judge to believe someone hates him enough to blow 10k on it ?
nubbins`: replace politician with neighbour, key of coke with handful of LSD
mircea_popescu: someone with no prior contact sends you some lsd, you probably bought it.
nubbins`: let's suppose i hate my pill-head neighbours
nubbins`: because they smash bottles in the road all the time.
nubbins`: cops are there more frequently than houseguests
nubbins`: so i throw some pills into a box, write their address on the front, stick it in the mail
nubbins`: call the cops again and say "i heard them talking about receiving a shipment of pills in the mail"
nubbins`: it came from the same city, even.
nubbins`: what, people don't send mail inter-city?
mircea_popescu: they do, but people don't hate their neighbours inter-city.
nubbins`: so i drive 20 minutes to a post office in the next community
nubbins`: small inconvenience if i want my pillhead neighbours out of my hair
nubbins`: it's only a few pills. a padded envelope and a stamp will do.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 22 @ 0.0051224 = 0.1127 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.54601011 BTC [-]
nubbins`: you could fit 1000 hits of LSD in an envelope
mircea_popescu: so your defense hinges on the jury buying the theory someone is stalking you.
nubbins`: i don't have a defense, i'm not in the picture
mircea_popescu: if you're a dweeby teenaged male with no social circle this won't stick,
nubbins`: the pill-heads defense is that someone is framing them
nubbins`: the prosecutor's argument is that a frame job is ludicrous
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.54600011 BTC [-]
nubbins`: and the pillheads go off to jail
nubbins`: so for the cost of a stamp and a couple of pills, you can send someone to trial
mircea_popescu: and for the cost of a drink you can send someon to bed.
nubbins`: anyway, judges here are generally practical people who realize that they live in the real world
mircea_popescu: the judge will warn you and let you off if its your first time
nubbins`: if anything, the fact that i've complained about my pill-head neighbours so many times would lend much credence to my story, should i be caught with a package full of drugs in my mailbox
nubbins`: "must have been those pill heads, they hate me and they're into drugs"
mircea_popescu: yeah, except until the cops ransack your place and find 5 sets of opened similar packages cause your gf can't be bothered to take out the trash
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1700 @ 0.000094 = 0.1598 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8877 @ 0.00085446 = 7.585 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: leave aside if they actually had been stealing your trash for the past 5 months.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23723 @ 0.0008558 = 20.3021 BTC [+]
nubbins`: what's the story on casual drug use in romania, anyway?
nubbins`: something like 50-60% of canadians admit to smoking marijuana
mircea_popescu: i'd be surprised if a teenager in 10 actually ever had actual drugs of any kind.
nubbins`: although i always had the impression that eastern europeans didn't bother too much with the softer drugs
nubbins`: HEH. you should visit a high school here.
nubbins`: it's practically canadian culture at this point
nubbins`: pros and cons. the uninspired continue to be uninspired
mircea_popescu: mno. normally the population is more or less balanced, ever the marginally worthless can pull their own weight. get a job, pay the rent.
mircea_popescu: with drugs, 90% of the population ends up costing more than it's worth, and half of what by such a wide margin even salami is a poor use.
nubbins`: marginally worthless pulling their own weight -- is this before welfare became a thing?
nubbins`: so you can't get paid to sit on your ass your entire life?
pankkake: minimum wage isn't really welfare. well, it encourages other kinds of welfares
nubbins`: to calibrate, what's a loaf of bread cost?
nubbins`: going by a loaf of bread, that 150 bucks would be about $525/mo here
mircea_popescu: well... what's a gallon of milk there ? it's about 7 bucks here by now.
nubbins`: ~$4.50 for two liters, although being on an island with few cows, it's understandably more costly than mainland canada
mircea_popescu: in short : breat is a poor comparison point (partly because most women being able to bake bread keeps bakeries honest)
nubbins`: hop on a ferry and it's maybe $5/gallon for milk
nubbins`: rents for a 1br apartment start around 7-800
nubbins`: 5 years ago you could rent the same place for 450-500
mircea_popescu: anyway, i don't think it's significantly different, tbh.
nubbins`: cost of living is generally calibrated towards min wage, more or less
nubbins`: with some hardship, sure, but what do you expect
mircea_popescu: well i tell you, in general a student chick is either living in a four to the room dorm or else five-six chicks in an apartment, here. giving her her own place is a larger step up than her education would afford.
nubbins`: to be fair, that's maybe the most vulnerable to regional variation
nubbins`: yeah, you don't find many single young people living on their own here
nubbins`: either still with folks or in a house with 3-6 others
mircea_popescu: then again romania has excellent infrastructure, lot of hidro, lot of nuclear.
mircea_popescu: they do this thing where they give it @2 cents/kwh to old geezers etc. so some very passible welfare sort of hting
nubbins`: massive hydro project coming online in "2017", will increase rates dramatically for us while providing cheaper electricity to other provinces and american markets
nubbins`: largest coal plant on the island is ~10 years beyond expiry date
nubbins`: the rolling outages started this winter and are expected to continue for the next four winters
nubbins`: hydro megaproject is actually located in mainland canada, connected to the island by undersea cables and then above-ground cables passing through a mountain range
nubbins`: repair time for a downed line? 1 month
nubbins`: needless to say, you can't buy a generator or a bottle of kerosene here at the moment
nubbins`: propane shortages since early december
mircea_popescu: i don't get this bs. how can a market economy experience shortages, at all.
nubbins`: companies blame weather conditions, citizens blame complacency and lack of planning/foresight
mircea_popescu: everyone's moved on to a planned/command economy and refuse to admit it.
nubbins`: in fact, the lack of planning was on the part of the citizens
nubbins`: but few will admit their complete failure to plan for the unexpected
the20year2: Futures contracts are a part of a market economy
the20year2: which should smooth winter costs for fuel
nubbins`: much easier to complain about shortages than to address the fact that they caused said shortages by rushing to stock up on fuel when the outages begin
nubbins`: the20year: costs remain constant, availability doesn't :)
the20year2: Depends on how contracts were written, they can be written to deal with availability. A market economy could also see the need for fuel/goods and transport them
nubbins`: generally "scalping" doesn't happen here, so there's that, at least
nubbins`: well, the need for fuel wasn't visible for many until substations started exploding
the20year2: Sort of like when hurricane sandy hit NY/NJ this year, instead of letting gas go up 50c a gallon they just let the stations run out. Fuel companies could have brought in fuel for an extra 25c-50c a gallon, but the states ruled it illegal
nubbins`: TBF the weather did play a small role in the availability. all supplies are brought here by boat
nubbins`: we received i think 140cm of snow in december, without any melt
the20year2: you'd think with average snowfall that high you'd have people prepare
the20year2: but who wants to do that? it takes effort
nubbins`: compounded by the fact that there are a lot of "McMansions" being built by those who made their fortunes in the oil and gas industry
nubbins`: and 90% of new builds use electric for the primary heat source
the20year2: I told everyone I knwo for the past 2-3 years they need to be buying backup propane hosue heaters and fuel, hardly anyone did it. And now we've had this freeze that's really caused problems
nubbins`: and the same 35-40yo coal generating plant pumping out the kWs
nubbins`: a generation ago, nobody gave a fuck when the lights went out
the20year2: here in the US the coal plant would be producing less and less due to more regulations
nubbins`: throw another log in the wood stove
nubbins`: today, you have communities setting up "warming centres" when the lights go out
nubbins`: oh, i was mistaken, that plant burns oil
nubbins`: that's what, one step away from crude?
nubbins`: anyway, capacity was last upgraded in 1989
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32950 @ 0.00085425 = 28.1475 BTC [-]
nubbins`: relevant quote from "survivorman" les stroud:
nubbins`: "You won't see me crying when the power goes out. It's your own responsibility to keep warm, that's yourself and the vulnerable, so just deal with it. It's not the government's fault."
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 2 @ 0.0828 = 0.1656 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: <nubbins`> and 90% of new builds use electric for the primary heat source << in canada ?!
mircea_popescu: in a coal fired county ?! by people who made their fortune in energy ?!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.546 = 1.092 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6649 @ 0.00085425 = 5.6799 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.5455 = 1.091 BTC [-] {2}
nubbins`: well, a generation ago, 90% of new builds had oil furnaces
nubbins`: today, an oil furnace will bleed your wallet dry over the course of a winter
nubbins`: when selling a house, oil heat is a huge negative these days
nubbins`: oil furnaces in homes burn #1 or #2 fuel oil
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 59 @ 0.00270918 = 0.1598 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12431 @ 0.00085443 = 10.6214 BTC [+]
nubbins`: Duffer1: perhaps the biggest lel of modern history
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 67 @ 0.00294 = 0.197 BTC [+]
nubbins`: democracy came about as a way for power-hungry low-borns to claw their way to the top
nubbins`: turns out the power-hungry aren't necessarily the best people to be placed in positions of power
pankkake: isn't it the modern panem et circenses?
ozbot: Idiot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
nubbins`: at one time, an idiot was one who was unconcerned with public affairs
nubbins`: to a point, this original definition still fits
nubbins`: it's not that hard to pull off.
nubbins`: side note, "nub" is a synonym of "pith"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7800 @ 0.00085221 = 6.6472 BTC [-] {2}
nubbins`: t-shirts with public keys printed on them, think there's a market?
nubbins`: probably the nerdiest t-shirt i can think of
nubbins`: but surprisingly economical if you order even just two
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54166 @ 0.00085008 = 46.0454 BTC [-] {3}
benkay: q4->q1 drought looks to end soon
nubbins`: i was just floating the idea of bespoke t-shirts with one's public pgp key printed on the front
benkay: i want my pubkey embossed on my business card now that i think about it
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 39 @ 0.00512033 = 0.1997 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17000 @ 0.00084927 = 14.4376 BTC [-]
nubbins`: black ink on a black shirt, even
nubbins`: need to catch the light to see the pubkey
nubbins`: imagine the nightmare of transcribing that
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.548 = 1.096 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 10 @ 0.0264999 = 0.265 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26881 @ 0.00085299 = 22.9292 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 49 @ 0.00534107 = 0.2617 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21166 @ 0.00085005 = 17.9922 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53900 @ 0.00084808 = 45.7115 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11611 @ 0.00084686 = 9.8329 BTC [-]
deadweasel: where's my "Got land? Thank Whitey!" tshirt, nubbins` ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12900 @ 0.00084571 = 10.9097 BTC [-]
nubbins`: deadweasel: 0.06 btc and it's yours
nubbins`: that's with both lines on the front tho, extra cost if you want it split back & front ;(
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32464 @ 0.00084567 = 27.4538 BTC [-]
ozbot: Egor Homakov: Account hijacking on MtGox
nubbins`: i reported a gaping CSRF vuln on havelock last year
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00084533 = 5.4946 BTC [-]
nubbins`: yeah, i submitted a fix and they applied it almost immediately
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 175 @ 0.005 = 0.875 BTC
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6300 @ 0.00084537 = 5.3258 BTC [+]
nubbins`: ^ a square peg, if small enough, will fit into a round hole
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12300 @ 0.00084533 = 10.3976 BTC [-]
pankkake: nude in public isn't fun when it's on a deserted street at 6 am
nubbins`: might as well be a stack of $100 bills
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1018 blocks | Estimated Change: 18.4961% in 5d 18h 10m 42s