log☇︎
99700+ entries in 0.77s
phf: although i wonder where you should start the emacs tumour countdown, sometime around MULE
asciilifeform: common lisp verminization will proceed on the same schedule as the emacs one, i imagine
ben_vulpes: shinohai: i don't know on what basis you think this is relevant to any particular programming language
ben_vulpes: "minimalist" means "i made an epic shitton of assumptions and then laid down a zillion lines of code in support of those assumptions"
ben_vulpes: one thing i know to be true in this world
mats: i liked you better when you were busy hating yourself
mircea_popescu: i thought everyone wants azn semen
mats: semen didn't work out so gud since i was unemployed and, you know, not-white, not-six-foot, etc
mats: the blood thing worked out handily but i never got anything better than food gift cards and free cookies, juice
mats: i was unemployed for a few months last year and i looked into donating bodily excretions, ie, poo, blood, semen
mats: i have desirable poo
mats: too bad I moved, no poop for you
a111: Logged on 2016-04-21 21:39 asciilifeform: i have nfi why anyone here even bothers with reddit today.
mod6: oooh, i heard about that 'information superhighway thingy'. they say we'll all be doing everything in 'Virtual Reality' in a few years.
asciilifeform: i have nfi why anyone here even bothers with reddit today. ☟︎
phf: i suspect snr on reddit is so low the event is not even going to be perceived as something that requires a cover up on such articulated terms. the burying is something in the range between "confederate flag? downvote." and "mircea? something not scam? downvote."
a111: Logged on 2016-04-21 21:25 mircea_popescu: and for that matter i've yet to hear someone go "i'm not sending anything to derpy webwallet / webexchange / webusgtronism because htey don't gpg sign the address"
midnightmagic: (That I know of.) Oh Well.
midnightmagic: I think I'm one of.. perhaps two people requesting it or trying to do something about it. We never know we need that sort of thing until one day we do.
asciilifeform: just as i would never know about mpex if mircea_popescu had not awakened me from my cave.
asciilifeform: i'm willing to believe that there are other pgptronic businesses, 'other mpexes', but strictly on the same basis as 'life on other planets', i have no knowledge of it
mircea_popescu: and for that matter i've yet to hear someone go "i'm not sending anything to derpy webwallet / webexchange / webusgtronism because htey don't gpg sign the address" ☟︎
midnightmagic: fwiw, I don't have much of an opinion one way or another. If I went into it knowing this were the case, I could find it very useful to have this property in my transactions with, say MPEX. But for, say, a *deposit address* on a webpage for an exchange, I *would* want non-repudiability as per, say, TLS message authentication extension in RFC .. hrm. That RFC where it's defined but was never implemen
asciilifeform: didn't we do this way back when, when i wrote the mpex review
mircea_popescu: apparently, i'm discovering, this is an entire market vertical, "young women + illegal sex". usually school setting, always some sort of lawsuit as to rape, corruption, what have you.
mircea_popescu: i already had my sammich, doing a review of wild things, of all things. anyone saw it ?
copumpkin: no problem, I'm eating popcorn
mircea_popescu: copumpkin excuse me while i strawman you into a convenient position for the benefit of the kids.
copumpkin: but feel free to demolish that argument I never made
copumpkin: not sure I ever claimed otherwise :)
midnightmagic: I could see that sort of thing (non-repudiability) being useful for something like an exchange which operates under some kind of public law.
midnightmagic: yay I'm a person
midnightmagic: copumpkin is pretty realistic about things I think. :)
midnightmagic: "I warrant I will do this when you ask." "I'm asking."
midnightmagic: On the other hand, this way copumpkin -- I think -- can state things about the transaction that can't be known and nobody can say different. And MP for that matter, which reduces the transaction to trust.
asciilifeform: i.e. the session key being revealed.
asciilifeform: i described the basic essence
midnightmagic: revealing the key would break the forward secrecy. But I know what you mean. Still, as described all an eavesdropper would have to do to fairly strongly prove the authenticity of the message is stamp it and assert that there's no evidence the pubkey was revealed before then. That is, a third-party passively listening to the conversation with self-assured reliability could watch it happen, then obse
midnightmagic: I *think* the OTR protocol uses a revealed MAC between the parties *but more crucially, a stream cipher for malleable encryption* so that at explicit termination of the conversation neither party can claim later that the other one definitely wrote something specific in the log of each. The deniable authentication protocol therein doesn't reveal it to the public -- only to the other party. Publically
mircea_popescu: mpex is very carefully designed with various such tradeoffs considered, an' i think i've done enough free consulting on the topic for one day.
asciilifeform: midnightmagic: prolly why mircea_popescu specifically does not spit out such receips, i thought this was clear from the thread
midnightmagic: (In order for the hypothetical discovery to successfully take place, I mean.)
mircea_popescu: of course i wasn't thinking of pig iron, rather, one of the fiberglass / ceramic sorta things with high magnetic dust included.
mircea_popescu: what i was hoping for.
mircea_popescu: i'd have thought nicely made wheel out of paramagnetic alloy ; then vary a field.
asciilifeform: i can think of a few tricks that won't be immediately apparent.
mircea_popescu: I DO.
copumpkin: or I could just present a signed slip
mircea_popescu: and so we go through this a coupla times and then i go you know what, just register a deed already, this is getting ridiculous
copumpkin: before they accept my claims that you're being dishonest, they'll want proof that I actually asked you for money
mircea_popescu: and i say i dunno dude, never got it.
copumpkin: I'd go say "yo mircea, where's my fucking money"
mircea_popescu: copumpkin i don't, no.
copumpkin: you know what I mean
mircea_popescu: it's unlikely i'd claim anything on reddit.
copumpkin: so I claim on reddit that I have a balance, and you keep claiming that you never get my orders
mircea_popescu: there's all sorts of things i ~could~ do.
copumpkin: I also have a signed STAT output
copumpkin: I have a signed generic reply
copumpkin: I'll keep sneding them
mircea_popescu: i guess i could.
copumpkin: "but I never received it", he says on public form
copumpkin: I'm saying that it's fine if you don't honor a sell order of mine
copumpkin: I'm not setting it aside
mircea_popescu: this "that's fine" device, lolz. what's it supposed to accomplish ? you can't set aside what i say.
copumpkin: that's fine. But signing my slips still gives me a verifiable paper trail of the things I attempted to have you do, whether or not you guarantee doing them. It gives me an avenue to claim that you've at least seen and acknowledged an order, even if execution is best-effort
copumpkin: I could then store those signatures and chew you out publicly in the case of a dispute
copumpkin: all I'm saying is that with today's system, I have no cryptographic paper trail that you've actually received the commands I expect you to have received
copumpkin: a) the coins have already been sent to the wrong place. Perhaps I'm not "liable" and have a claim, but it's adding inefficiency to the system if you have to cover for a mistake which could've been avoided in the first place
copumpkin: yes, but I have no receipt acknowledgment of that signed slip. You've just acknowledged getting some slip, and are not committing to any particular slip of mine. If you mess up your book-keeping, you might dig up an old signed slip of mine making a different request to a different address, and I'd have nothing to talk to you about until after it was too late
mircea_popescu: it'll be too late for what ? i have your signed slip, it's what it is.
copumpkin: the only way I'll find out is by waiting 48 hours, at which point it'll be too late
copumpkin: there's no acknowledgment of the parameters of the withdrawal. For all I know you think I want a completely different amount, to a completely different address :P
trinque: sorry about that guys. I left a tcpdump running to catch the SSL weird and filled my disk
asciilifeform: as in the thread re biological process of 'i am not my mother!1111'
asciilifeform: my first paying job was to observe telomeres shortening. so i understand this process pretty well. BUT mine are not any longer from this!!111
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: do you have any idea what, e.g., i, could do with a whole month !
phf: mircea_popescu: i don't think so, since moses was a man on a mission from god, it would be a distraction for him (from the mission) to choose to become a magi, hence the story
asciilifeform: i.e. the folks who play lotto, are selected in practice for dullness
mircea_popescu: i dunno, that it dilutes the cool ?
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell trinque the problem with deedbot being offline is that i am forced into the dilemma of either turn ben_vulpes req for voice down, or else voice people outside of the model. i don't like either horn, at all.
asciilifeform: i think pete_dushenski knew
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform they will, in article i'm writing.
asciilifeform: (btw i wonder how many readerz know who was roxy.)
asciilifeform: i did not say there were.
mircea_popescu: not anymore than "can i trust this eunuch with my dear roxy" is political.
asciilifeform: i see more quisling than lobotomy victim re esr et al
mircea_popescu: in the first kind, random derp ends up with some chumpatronium. being random he is randomly distributed re skill, and normally the juice leaves him. similarly if i took a marketable blonde and told her to go live with random guy on the street, which she will because they do what i say, he'll STILL manage to lose her over time.
mircea_popescu: i god danged mixed them up!
mircea_popescu: [i suppose we're all too distant from our sailing ancestors to know what age at sea does to man]
asciilifeform: incidentally i saw esr alive on several occasions.
asciilifeform: but i suppose gnu was seen as possible threat, as pgp once was.
asciilifeform: (who and why saw rms as needing a counter-pill, i have nfi)
asciilifeform: i specifically remember what esr was a pill against
asciilifeform: 'i-can't-believe-it's-not's.
mircea_popescu: as is usually the case, i guess.
asciilifeform: i have never seen it in the field. but it appears to be a webtard thing
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i am mostly reading the names so they're in the search.
asciilifeform: and no i have no idea who the zoo animals were.
mircea_popescu: i can see that.