935000+ entries in 0.632s
jurov: this is fiat at
the moment
jurov: gold covered money was not either. $1m could really create panic at its
time
pgp: leverage and credit lines are
the key
to liquidity in modern financial markets
jurov: yes, and i do ask, where is
the liquidity from?
jurov: and
there were crashes every now and
then
jurov: tiberiusiv, all
that "volume" and "liuquidity" on irl fin markets is
thanks
to leverage
jurov: but where you can
take it from? someone will lend it
to you
jurov: and use it
to
trade
jurov: bitcoin is scarce, not easy
to just lend 10k block
jurov: i'd argue
that fiat is "overliquid" since it has inflated supply so you have
too high expectations
pgp: mt gox makes it a closed system
to a certain extent
pgp: often
they float <10% of
there shares and often aren't
that liquid
pgp: the same can be said of companies
that ipo
pgp: bp - your right about comparing
to
trading in midcap stocks
jurov: tiberiusiv so how do you propose
to get instantly into 1trillion mkt cap?
Bugpowder: a 1M buy right now moves
the price 5%
jurov: so? don't clamor for impossible
them.
jurov: then 1m USD would still move
the price considerably
Bugpowder: single 1MM gox orders have been going off once a day for
the past 2 weeks
jurov: like if
there were millions going in and out,
that wouldn't cause wild swings?
jurov: and
that's actually good, it slows
the rally while we accrue some real competency (by
tial and error, but hopefully still)
jurov: tiberiusiv because it is
too risky
to keep big amounts on exchanges
MJR_III: what happened
to
the sr dealers?
jurov: yea,
these poor silkroad dealers you mentioned yest. let's remember
them with moment of silence.
jurov: but we also need someone
to do it properly
jurov: bitcoin is *not* ready
to replace any amount of worldwide economy. we do need experiments/forks at
this stage
jurov: and boy,
they are
thrashy...
jurov: anyway my peeve with
them altcoins is
they all use outdated satoshi codebase
Bugpowder: oh, here was
that blog with
the mining profit plots
jurov: aside from
that dusted consideration
jurov: een after
they were verified, satoshi client defaults
to higer
txfee
MJR_III: jurov: because
they haven't been verified yet?
jurov: and all btc coins aren't equal
too, as anyone who
tried
to spend new satoshidice outputs can attest
MJR_III: bugpowder: just find someone willing
to lend you some
MJR_III: i just finished reading
their white paper
jurov: well, actually i heard about it
today first
time,
that's how i understood it
jurov: and only older coins can be used as proof of stake
to mine
MJR_III: in some ways
this ruins
the fungibility of
the money
though
jurov: but you can't use
them as a proof of stake
tomine
smickles: take many massive loans, get near 50%,
the claim you can't pay because you have
to protect
the network!
MJR_III: it would need
to have a signifigant advantage
jurov: if someone gets anywhere near 50% *he* has
to wait
to be able
to pull 51% attack, meanwhile others mine blocks and lower his part
MJR_III: as with all
the others i doubt it will gain
the momentum it needs
smickles: so, if someone gets anywhere near 50%,
then people have
to stop spending coins
to protect it
jurov: this actually would be motivation
to hoard, hence inflation is necessary
jurov: yes, if you spend
the coins, you lower your weight
smickles: but, wouldn't
that mean
they have
to do nothing w/
their coins
to maintain
jurov: after receiving
them
jurov: you have
to wait with your 51%
to get
the right
jurov: no, someone with older coins
than you can issue blocks instead
smickles: i feel like
the proof-of-stake bit
turns it into a game, get 51% of
the coins and you win
jurov: that was mentioned
too
that he considers inflation as consequence of 2nd
thermodynamic law and
thus it should be allowed
MJR_III: while i rate all other cryptocurrencies chances as around 1% might be worth it
to hold a basket of all of
them, just in case
jurov: but it's not in effect yet, its mining normally until some
time passes
jurov: everyone who has enough coins*time can have a right
to issue a block
jurov: so if we become suddenly rich, we shoudl
thin about
the outcome of our actions
MJR_III: driving difficulty up further and using
the same power
MJR_III: if you find something
that uses less power, more people will mine
jurov: plus we received stern warning
that moeny is not morally nutral
jurov: bitcoin is
too power hungry, ppcoin is more ecological
MJR_III: i
think it has
to do with
the cloudflare anti-dddos
thestringpuller: sometimes I wonder who actually has more power, people like you, or
the blokes at
the bank...
KRS1: is
that his warning
assbot: Hell, ain't we about more fucked
than a whore at closin'
time, huh?
MJR_III: i'm looking into
the exact details
MJR_III: you just won't be able
to withdraw USD via Mt. Gox USD codes i
think
KRS1: what happens
to gox accounts once "depreciated"
MJR_III: yeah
those will be deprecated i had heard
smickles: mtgox will be depreciated on apr 10 due
to legal issues
MJR_III: mircea_popescu: i wasn't aware
that you did web hosting, but I saw
the little hosted by mpex on bitcoinity
MJR_III: everyone focuses on CEO/CTO in
this space...but COO is where you really shine
MJR_III: but
the main difference between web based ideas and
the other businesses is interaction with
the real world
MJR_III: i
think
that one
thing is becoming clear, from kickstarter projects and bitcoin projects, creating a cool website is not
the same
thing as creating a viable business
MJR_III: error4733: i hope
that
the
tablet works
MJR_III: mt.gox is laggier
than bitcoinity.org
MJR_III: in
this specific case,
there were only 3 real contenders
error4733: change a little setting in any part of
the process and you get 6 more month delay
error4733: i still
think in
this big money business, should be easy
to give 50K$ in china
to fuck up a concurrent
MJR_III: someone
thinks
there won't be much of a dividend i guess
MJR_III: but was just way better at execution
than
they were
MJR_III: I
think he felt pressure
to keep up with BFL
error4733: was not a strategic choise for
time
MJR_III: just so
there would be diversification in
the market
MJR_III: he was
trying
to stave off monopoly by BFL
error4733: MJR, i always read yifu never
thinks he can succes
to be first
MJR_III: just another example of management
trumping design specs or programming knowledge
bgupta: Yeah need
to ship
to stay in
the game
MJR_III: AND understood
that being first was more important