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phf: you know dos "com", which was just
a flat sequence of bytecodes and when you did foo.com it would just start executing foo.com with the first byte
mircea_popescu: suppose for this discussion it's already started ; else yes, you need
a running machine to compile your image as we said.
phf: i mean do you start it from inside
a linux?
phf: mircea_popescu: problem is that when you do
a execution like ./foo on unix, ~unix~ expects "foo" to contain certain bits and do certain kind of work to appease unix upfront. that work is specific not to "x86" but to "linux v 1.1.2, compiled on full moon, by three blind monks"
phf: asciilifeform's arguing from
a completely different architecture
phf: well, for what it's worth rewriting cmucl vm in asm would be
a gnarly but straightforward exercise
phf: well cmucl's approach is to hire some locals to carry
a palanquin
mircea_popescu: and yes, evidently
A LOT of asm by hand will go into this. guess what ? this is exactly what the fuck the early c people who made c possible in the sense of having rms hijack it 20 years later did.
phf: mircea_popescu: cmucl's assembly has
a different pattern in order to support all the tricky-in-c-trivial-in-lisp code behaviors
phf: c-machine assembly level has
a certain shape to it. when you write int foo { bar(); } an assembly of
a certain pattern gets spit out
mircea_popescu: if it doesn't compile ITSELF it is not
a compiler, ftr.
mircea_popescu: you need the following :
a) an item which inputs lisp text and outputs opcodes ; b) and sits down on x86 bare metal. clearly to produce
a running isntance of this item you will need
a running instance of this item. nevertheless : you do not need c, nor any "bootstrapping" outside of this.
mircea_popescu: yes, one instance of your machine-lisp running on x86 will be required to compile
a machine instance of your lisp. so ?
mircea_popescu: if the processor gets
a push, the processor will push. what are you bootstrapping ?
phf: "whole machine" approach was jammed into
a c vm layer. but if we were to actually attempt
a lisp on hardware hack, cmucl's approach would involve considerably less complexity
phf:
http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-17#1543401 << sbcl codebase ~is~ cmucl codebase, so all the same people who wrote above wrote majority of sbcl. newman's work in adding sane bootstrapping is reproducable by doing early diffs and perhaps should come as vpatch on top of cmucl since it's particularly clean. but here's the thing, the way cmucl does bootstrapping is borrowed directly from
a lisp machine, and breaks down precisely because the
☝︎ mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this "purple under
a blacklight" stuff is pretty lulzy. "
a blacklight" ? what wavelength is this black.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-17 09:27 adlai: ahaha, review of jaynes's book: "The weight of original thought in it is so great that it makes me uneasy for the author's well-being: the human mind is not built to support such
a burden." - D.C. Stove, in Encounter (from
http://www.julianjaynes.org/bicameralmind.php )
a111: Logged on 2016-09-17 07:59 gabriel_laddel: Actual LSD will glow purple under
a blacklight, unlike all other compounds people attempt to use in its place.
mircea_popescu: and yes, waiting tables IS how you start
a whore career ; no exceptions. all waitresses are apprentices of the trade.
adlai: ahaha, review of jaynes's book: "The weight of original thought in it is so great that it makes me uneasy for the author's well-being: the human mind is not built to support such
a burden." - D.C. Stove, in Encounter (from
http://www.julianjaynes.org/bicameralmind.php )
☟︎ gabriel_laddel: Blotter paper with actual doses on it should be perforated so the area takes up about 1/8th of your thumbnail. Anything larger is probably going to put you in
a psyc ward.
gabriel_laddel: Actual LSD will glow purple under
a blacklight, unlike all other compounds people attempt to use in its place.
☟︎ adlai: closing thought - is there
a way to get deedbot to barf all ratings somebody has made, other than enumerating all nicks present in the wot?
phf: ben_vulpes: it's s, but i suppose adding "search" is not
a bad idea
a111: Logged on 2015-08-29 14:35 asciilifeform: turn it all the way down - you get
a housewife
trinque: phf: I dunno that anyone claims the content of
a poem exists
trinque: adlai:
a brainputer behaving as though false inputs are present is crazy.
trinque: the question of the usefulness of
a tulpa cannot be posed because "tulpa" is not
a thing.
adlai: trinque: i don't think of this as mind-body duality at all.
a better analogy would be the phase of some matter. if you cool it enough, it seems solid; zoom in and you see it's still moving, but not enough to break out of formation.
trinque: for
a somalian, I don't know, maybe that's Tuesday
trinque:
a piece of nonsense here is trying to create universals where the context varies widely.
trinque: is it
a dead person's "tulpa" ?
trinque: that animal can be considered crazy just as
a paper can be rejected by peer review.
trinque: that the definition changes over time... of course, because it's
a statistical matter of being an outlier
trinque: crazy is
a blunt term for "woefully inaccurate self/world model compared to others" but certainly exists.
adlai: my main takeaway from the 'experience' (including 46 days of involuntary commitment in the closed ward) is that there is no such thing as crazy. sure, some people are out of touch with consensus reality, but you can define that quite precisely, and
a lot of "crazy" people do not meet this definition.
ben_vulpes: some people go crazy, some people have crazy high tolerances, some people even eat
a shitload over
a long time and then one day break, the variance is wild and statistical claims cannot be made beyond "oh fuck might hose your brain under entirely unknowable circumstances but hey have fun with the tradeoff analysis kid"
☟︎ trinque: ordeal is therapeutic; psychdelics maybe if they cause
a beneficial ordeal
☟︎ trinque: and yes, you can "go down
a dangerous road" on them, and this is related to but not directly caused by dosage
phf: i know
a few people who went crazy in close connection to psychedelics, but of course no way to establish correlation/causation
adlai: that's
a tricky claim. i've taken much, much, much larger doses than the ones that (indirectly!) led to the aforementioned bad situations. i think YGFS50 depends much more on "set and setting" than on
a molecule's shape and headcount
trinque: adlai: there's
a you-go-fucking-schizoid-50
ben_vulpes: i'm going to go out on
a limb and doubt that there's enough data even on variation in human sensitivity to drugs much less by class and genotype to even be making claims about "LD50"
adlai: the more nuanced answer recognizes that i was hospitalized as
a direct result of an argument, which would not have happened if i'd left the house with
a sweater that morning. so... don't forget to bring
a towel?
adlai: oh dear, we're on to the difficult questions now. punting yours aside for
a second, here's an easy question: what does the "therapeutic index" have to do with therapy? answer: none. it's LD50 (median lethal dose) divided by threshhold dose (minimum to feel effects)
trinque: I don't believe the "thereaputic" angle for
a moment.
trinque: adlai: would you have been in
a ward if you hadn't taken
a bunch of drugs?
adlai: the only good drug is
a dead drug! (only heathens lick live toads)
adlai: what's with all the shitty drugs? i step away from irc-every-day for
a couple months, suddenly everybody's fiending alcohol, tobacco, and firearms^H^H^Hcaffeine?
phf: i'll bring it back probably tonight. i've got tea pot, i've got hookah, i've got
a fuck you to "no smoking in building" complaints
adlai is unfamiliar, digs, finds "When
a shlimazl goes dancing, the musicians' strings break"... or maybe asciilifeform meant "girl who can't dance says music sucks"?
trinque: you know what's sad? I'm actually running off of an SD card in
a USB reader
trinque lives in
a gentoo livecd nao
adlai: if you want to speak to somebody privately, send them
a message (i've sent you one, did you see it?)
adlai: covertress: you're speaking here to pretty much anybody who ever reads
a publicly available log
adlai: honestly though, isn't this more akin to culling
a peasant child?
ben_vulpes: beheading uppity peasants is
a privilege, and
a duty of the privileged.
phf: you have
a canonical sbcl i can throw the problem at?
adlai: * never. in
a toilet who's seat you've never warmed.
adlai: covertress: oh lol. then why are you offering people to shit in
a toilet you've warmed?
adlai: covertress: regarding "2016-08-29 18:36:38 +covertress mircea_popescu i've been asked to extend you
a similar offer... to write for steemit xD", i'm very curious how much you have earned (ie, withdrawn btc from an exchange after selling) from that shitpile
adlai: covertress: on
a nicer note, i believe par for this course is to not just "read 6mo of logs", but actually spend 6mo reading logs, before planning/attending
a conf
adlai: nah i feel like
a child using it, because i failed to configure znc properly so i lazed away how i always do
adlai: alternatively just run irc in tmux on
a server
ben_vulpes: have you ever heard of
a thing called
a 'bouncer'?
jhvh1: covertress: Error: "recd" is not
a valid command.
covertress: jhvh1, recd your tx from 5 days, 0 hours, and 29 minutes ago. evah heard of
a phemon called
a hurricane?
ben_vulpes: i am
a barbarian, use wd-40 for these applications.
ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: is that in some way i'm missing
a torque delivery device?
adlai: ben_vulpes: starting
a degree in chemistry. this is the first time i'm attending university, dunno if high school counts for (back)
BingoBoingo: <ben_vulpes> just two weekends ago i had to excise some rust-welded nuts that didn't have clearance for
a socket wrench. << PB Blaster!
ben_vulpes: yeah mhm right next to the pressurized vapor line that's
a grand idea.
ben_vulpes: just two weekends ago i had to excise some rust-welded nuts that didn't have clearance for
a socket wrench.
adlai will read the lamport piece to the friend as
a patience test, before suggesting sicp / little schemer