asciilifeform: ( and other tcp )

asciilifeform: there are some invariant 'holes' that will never close so long as the thing has to pass www

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not necessarily.

asciilifeform: esp. if actual solution may well exist.

asciilifeform: which is a reasonable answer, but why package it as 'solution'

asciilifeform: that's 'fuckoff'

asciilifeform: that ain't a solution.

asciilifeform: can haz? maybe cannot

asciilifeform: just peers.

asciilifeform: ever.

asciilifeform: there must NOT BE any such thing as 'S'.

asciilifeform: can haz, or not, is a question that can be posed. but to give a solution WITH stars, is neither here nor there.

asciilifeform: i want a nonstar topology.

asciilifeform: it ain't a solution if it merely redefines the problem as 'the way life is'

asciilifeform: as BingoBoingo's 'big book' reminds.

asciilifeform: but the problem is not solved by pretending it not to exist.

asciilifeform: my contention was -- we dun have it. yet.

asciilifeform: mno. this is the hypothetical of 'how to get properly p2p net'

asciilifeform: but if you propose to package it with a hardcoded list of existing peers -- guess what, this is what people traditionally do. they get unplugged, and then whole net is useless.

asciilifeform: it's a clean install.

asciilifeform: it has nfi what exists

asciilifeform: what peers ?

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: let's concretize . say i write an infector. what should be its mechanism of connecting to greater tmsr ?

asciilifeform: ( there are various 'cheats' around this, but all resolve to hardcoded hidey-hole ~somewhere~ that contains where next to connect )

asciilifeform: there is no way to distribute an infector without hardcoded ips

asciilifeform: understand, nat is the principal weak link in botnet topology.

asciilifeform: i.e. uci installs

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: and how about unwilling bots ?

asciilifeform: there is no way to collect.

asciilifeform: it doesn't provide monetary incentive, any more than today's expense of running a proper node magically transforms into compensation

asciilifeform: ( without them, the action stops )

asciilifeform: which turns the class of S-capable nodes into stars.

asciilifeform: and yes it will require an S to reintroduce itself.

asciilifeform: not forever. strictly until somebody's dynamicip changes.

asciilifeform: i assumed D referred to a new node

asciilifeform: if D is already linked to B, it is not a D

asciilifeform: and it can't because D has no way to contact the A and B pair .

asciilifeform: this was actually my 1st thought, essentially, 'why can't it be C for D'

asciilifeform: read how 'udp hole punch' worx

asciilifeform: you can't presently 'become C for D'

asciilifeform: well this is where it falls

asciilifeform: skype

asciilifeform: expand ?

asciilifeform: i.e. stars.

asciilifeform: because nat.

asciilifeform: mno.

asciilifeform: mno. if there is a massive class of boxes that cannot plug directly into each other -- stars.

asciilifeform: unless you have proper p2p, you get massive 'stars'. provenphakt.

asciilifeform: so as things presently work, nobody can connect ~to~ them.

asciilifeform: most botnet nodes are behind nat.

asciilifeform: uci does.

asciilifeform: gossipd dun have the problem

asciilifeform: famous pic

asciilifeform: the thing usg mandates on all large machines for export

asciilifeform: betcha they disable that cnc mill also

asciilifeform: ahahahaha

asciilifeform: i have a theory which might, potentially, lead to a pill, will put it here slightly later

asciilifeform: in so far as the net is concerned, imho this is ~the~ openproblem.

asciilifeform: or any other non-1990s-usgolade protocol.

asciilifeform: sure would.

asciilifeform: ( the 'star' does not have to physically pass ~all~ packets between ~all~ leaves, but this is still not actual p2p )

asciilifeform: so the star topology is still there.

asciilifeform: the only quasi-reliable method ( 'udp hole punch' ), used by , e.g., 'skype', STILL requires a 3rd party non-natted box to broker the connection ☟︎

asciilifeform: all.

asciilifeform: just like www browser etc

asciilifeform: games connect to an un-natted central (star topology) box

asciilifeform: why 'yet' ?

asciilifeform: not while it remains a muppet of a living usg, lol

asciilifeform: last i heard, turks dun make own jet either..

asciilifeform: no place to hide.

asciilifeform: other thing, remote-boobies are difficult with transistor-poor culture.

asciilifeform: merely sold 2-3 generations behind state of the art.

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: su didn't do the remote-disable thing, for exported iron

asciilifeform: trinque: that'd depend on whether 'usg vanishes' includes 'usg remote-disable codes leak'

asciilifeform: 'cyber' only works against overcivilized idiots

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: mojahed kalash dun run winblows.

asciilifeform: nobody cancelled the jet. ☟︎

asciilifeform: did somebody build tesla's 100km death ray while asciilifeform slept, or wut

asciilifeform: ( tried to, but usg offered 'for phreeee' and israelis were dumb enough to bite the hook )

asciilifeform: afaik they still dun have a, e.g., self-made fighter jet. ☟︎

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: try as i might, i can't follow this

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: how's that relate ?

asciilifeform: the anglos ultra-specialized in the 'divide and conquer' thing, it is burned into their firmware somehow.

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: 'doesn't need no moar' is immaterial -- just like a freshly cut out liver is still trying, best as it can, to do its enzymatic business as if nothing happened, same -- reichs

asciilifeform: ' our cow died but hey, we can burn the neighbour's barn '

asciilifeform: ( see also 'taiwanization', http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-01#1511945 ) ☝︎

asciilifeform: see above.

asciilifeform: why to do this -- originally was simply to preserve british empire. later, to keep the fire burning, so that nothing fit to challenge the reich is born from the ash.

asciilifeform: ( usg uses the 'crack whore' business model with the israelis. send payola, but also keep'em from actually solving - via proper genocide + conquest of moar desirable real estate -- the problem that requires the infinite payola to begin with )

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: the pharma thing is simply another way of funneling payola, is all

asciilifeform: what in this case means yeshiva if not 'log highlighting and dissection' , out of curiosity ?

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: witness, usa and its nato colonies still pay sticker price for .il pharma

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: modern-day .il is a parasitic rider on usg -- and not merely in the well-known 'free money' sense, but also in that the ~only exports are 'intellectual property' racket, which rides on usg's patent enforcement shakedown ☟︎

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: relying on translators suxx. you oughta know that.

asciilifeform: lol

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: currently hitting language barrier tho, gotta strengthen my .il-foo

asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: the moar i dig, the moar i buy the thesis

asciilifeform: ( who first 'peace with british', despite the british being the folx nailing the door of nazi europe shut; afterwards -- 'peace with arab' )

asciilifeform: picture, the original was something vaguely tmsr-flavoured. replaced -- with the familiar socialists and misc. quislings

asciilifeform: aite.