699900+ entries in 0.514s
mircea_popescu: and
they ran it. without electricity. without
the combustion engine. without refrigeration, or pumps.
mircea_popescu: consider
this simple point : rome was, for a millenium and change, a larger
town
than
the majority of us
towns ever were or ever will be.
mircea_popescu: so you can't even speak latin
to
the barristers
these days,
then
they wonder why
the republic is in shambles.
bounce: the
thing with reviewing
the historic record is
that it isn't very good experiment content, if you will.
turnaround
tips on a similar
theme:
takes
too long
to evaluate effect for an interested outsider, much less
teach much
toward a desired or at least desirable outcome
mircea_popescu: but afaik
this is
the first instance of irony-the-meme
mircea_popescu: anyway. individual use is certainly earlier, shakespeare et all, and probably existed during
the romans but i just don't know of it.
bounce: "for my sins"
the original irony. don't let ms. morissette hear it.
mircea_popescu: de Baskerville, devoid of any faith but roughly interestred in
the paraphenalia such as
the libraries would say such
things
mircea_popescu: well let me be a pompous ass all
the way
then. "for my sins" is perhaps
the oldest, and
thus original ironic use of a phrase. at
the
time four centuries ago religious sentiment was still both strong and strongly in control. people like
bounce: it's clearly your sins
that are holding us all back. repent, etc.
mircea_popescu: bounce something hinders you from reviewing
the historical record ? other
than, of course,
the dictionary problem i've just re-re-rediscovered, for my sins ;/
mircea_popescu: in another decade it will be impossible
to even
talk
to
the children.
mircea_popescu: in·quir·ing /inˈkwīriNG,iNG-/ adjective: inquiring showing an interest in learning new
things. "an open, inquiring mind"
bounce: just like asking for ways
to measure effectiveness of ideology-driven political government would open up
the way
to comparing alternatives
mircea_popescu: inquiring means
that which has
the quality or
the form of asking a question
mircea_popescu: (shove it, ie, well if you like it so much and wanna apply it
to everything why aren't you doing
THAT with it
too)
bounce: just saying "shake it all up and hope something better comes out,
this one fershure is darn shitty" isn't, you know, very inquiring
punkman: this guys is making a career out of it
though
mircea_popescu: goethe has a coupla aphorisms on
the
topic as well if memory serves
mircea_popescu: punkman kind-of an obvious sidepoint i guess, even kant has some pages about how stupid
this is.
punkman: Morozov has a few
things
to say about
technological solutionism, not sure if worth reading
though
mircea_popescu: becuase
that's what i
think of you, approaching politics wholly ignorant of politics, with an expectation
that your voltmeter may do something.
mircea_popescu: what'd you
think of a shaman coming
to do architecture with his shamanistic beliefs ?
mircea_popescu: bounce
that is your flaw, and
the flaw of
the society you live in generally. you reflect each other.
the problem is
that "precision strikes" as you call
the category work amazingly well in
technology. as
the most
technologically successful group of people ever, contemporary whites have come
to worship it.
mircea_popescu: "crassus ipo. as
the richest man in all
the history of
the roman empire, and perhaps
the world, definitely i can repay you"
mircea_popescu: punkman it occurs
to me, someone should make an ipo as a pretend-historical character.
bounce: hm. even so. I'd say
that scientific method (properly applied) has a better chance of uncovering laws of nature
than religion does.
the scientific community certainly claims
this. do we have some sort of proof for
that, or maybe just strong evidence?
assbot: Evgeny Morozov, Not (NotMorozov) auf
Twitter
mircea_popescu: lmao
the forum just keeps getting better and better, in
the sense of worse.
mircea_popescu: know
the idea before others (with
this you can also steal it and make your own business before i), also you will get a percentage of "first believer shares"
that would be redeemed for final ipo shares and will give you
the right
to vote if
the company success."
mircea_popescu: I am making an ipo for an ipo ( yep need
to raise funds even
to show you
the "business plan", in
those days i need
to eat
too) so, with
the funds raised i will start
thinking how can i make a good company, you will have preference spot in
the share selling of
that company and upcoming ipo. Lets say if you are
the
top owner share of
this ipo,you would be able
to buy
the next ipo shares 4 days earlier
than others and
to
mircea_popescu: "Hey all!, after seeing some
topic in
this section i have
taken
the liberty
to share my idea with you.
mircea_popescu: bounce well you failed because if we knew which was
the pretend part in advance and universally we'd break godel.
bounce: what would
the
turnaround on catastrophic punishment be, anyhow?
bounce tried
to highlight
the pretend- part, apparently failed
mircea_popescu: but yes, i'm with chetty : stop pretend-fixing
things, and also undo most of
the fixes already in place.
they're broken.
mircea_popescu: why
the fuck would you do anything other
than because it's supposed
to fix something.
bounce: hm right. so how'd you call it when I'd rather make policy without
the "because we believe from a priori assumptions
that
this will make anything better" part?
mircea_popescu: because principles can now be
things, apparently, you've found a way.
mircea_popescu: just like, you know, your govt
that supports rather
than manipulats people.
mircea_popescu: i want my
tits colored IN PRINCIPLE, not any particular color.
bounce: here's some paint, bring your own
tits
mircea_popescu: bounce and i want a pair of colored
tits. not any particular color, mind you, just colored in principle.
bounce: that's
two kinds rolled into one
then
mircea_popescu: two kinds of nerds :
those virgin yet and
those virgin still.
bounce: not impossibly difficult, actually. I'd want government
to be a support for
the people instead of a
tool
to manipulate
the people.
fluffypony: "[11:29:31] @todor:
Two kinds of Mongo users -
those who've lost data and
those who will."
mircea_popescu: it's nonsense outright and in principle
this. what precision ? you can't even distinguish.
bounce: reason why I don't want
to go into politics for
the ideology
bounce: "the road
to hell is paved with good intentions"
mircea_popescu: they're just you know, waiting for it
to become possible.
mircea_popescu: politicos, just like bitcoin ceos, just like anyone else, would really do great
things, "were it possible".
mircea_popescu: bounce obviously nobody fucks up deliberately. people fuck up with
the best of intentions.
bounce: that ought
to be a working angle for
the crowbar on
their bad lawgiving
mircea_popescu: the innocents exist, as a category, for
the slaughter.
mircea_popescu: bounce yes.
their hope is simply
this :
that people like you stop believing
there's any value in saving
the innocents.
bounce: oh,
there's hope for
the non-connected in politics
then. provided
they found a way in.
mircea_popescu: politicos are wrongly connected, which makes
them worse off
than were
they poorly connected.
mircea_popescu: this is a subtler point, but probably
the best way in is
through considering
the "nothing sinks a good startup as well as bad revenue early on" observation
bounce: right. apparently I misremembered and ended up even more apt
than intended.
mircea_popescu: also,
the politicos are arguably
the least well connected of anyone.
mircea_popescu: the chick with
the close her eyes and
think of england
mircea_popescu: start beating your wife whether you know why or not, she's going
to start behaving like lady huddington.
mircea_popescu: <bounce> so with different structure we'd get better ideas bubble up
to
the
top? << people don't do what
they want
to do. people do what works.
mircea_popescu: in a world created out of catastrophic punishment and complete and utter disregard for
the /other/ sections of society however,
bounce: so with different structure we'd get better ideas bubble up
to
the
top?
mircea_popescu: in a world created of
tailored punishment and precision strikes,
the incentive is for
the bullshit you see.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: the problem is not
the people,
the problem is
the structure.
bounce: so you'd have a new culture made up out of
the same arses all over again
bounce: then again it's
the well-connected
that'll survive best. ie, our
targets,
them politicos.
mircea_popescu: chetty but in
these matters, "precision strikes"
take effort. carpet bombing, on
the contrary, does not.
bounce: the result needs
to be worth
the expense, not
the victims
mircea_popescu: chetty i
thought we were discussing metaphorical bombs.
chetty: carpet bombing
takes a lot of ammo, are
they worth
the bullets?
mircea_popescu: bounce
the argument here is
that "later" is meaningless absent and sort of process, and
that precision strikes are a liability not a +ev move.
bounce: they'd be aimed at
the wrong
target, and I'd rather
try
this
targeting
thing first
assbot: Economic cycles finally explained pe
Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
bounce: not in
this case. we can always carpet bomb later. even if doing
that now would preclude
the expense of precision strikes
mircea_popescu: otherwise,
the weasels plan and account for it aforehand.
mircea_popescu: i am assuming
that precision strikes aren't
to be preferred because punishment must be disproportionate and impredictable
to work.
bounce: I happen
to not buy into
that idea
bounce: you're assuming revolutions work like clockwork and arguing
that
therefore precision strikes aren't
to be preferred over carpet bombing with daisy cutters
mircea_popescu: those /other/ sections of society have
to be bled for
their indolence.
mircea_popescu: so
then you don't really have half a leg
to stand on here, do you.
bounce: so far it's mostly
them making
themselves impossible.
bounce: provided we do manage
to excise
that bit. if we can't, we can always escalate.
bounce: nah. I don't
think we're all
that desperate (yet), and since
the problems come from a rather well-defined section of society I'm not really willing
to let everyone, mostly /other/ sections of society suffer for it.
mircea_popescu: i should be so fucking lucky, walk from here
to
the bathroom, be ready for
the olympics.