41600+ entries in 0.026s
mircea_popescu: but
the galling idiocy of
these schmucks actually making
territorial demands ? it wasn't gonna be forgotten.
mircea_popescu: lenin hadn't what
to fight a soccer match with, let alone war.
mircea_popescu: because
there's
this group of people who
talk for you so you don't end up more hated
than you need
to be.
mircea_popescu: which is why people even have diplomats in
the first place, and why
the whole "oh, washiongton correspondents dinner" wank ever even had any root in reality :
mircea_popescu: but nevertheless, diplomatically
they were fucking inept.
there's one
thing
to fail on an obligation,
there's another
to be offensive about it.
mircea_popescu: im not saying
that staying behind and honoring war committments was POSSIBLE for
the russians. i suspect -- was not possible.
a111: Logged on 2019-03-13 21:06 asciilifeform: so you
try an' make a 'new'. and pray
that it worx, before 'a bunch of foreigners land on your shores, buy up some local chiefs, chop down your forests, rip
the minerals out of your soil, enslave a few generations, and eventually go home, leaving
their bastards in charge'
mircea_popescu: it's
the sort of historical
truth people dun wanna hear, but
the causation's plain an' obvious.
mircea_popescu: the incredible mismanagement of world affairs by revolutionary govt cost
the russians stalingrad, quite plainly.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes, but
the russians also didn't ally with swiss against mongol horde only
to withdraw midway
diana_coman: asciilifeform, at
the grassroots
thing, quote great-grandmother who lived
through both wars: ffs ,the german soldiers were at least clean!
the russians got us full of fleas!
a111: Logged on 2018-06-19 15:59 mircea_popescu:
the universal oppinion of romanian officer corps, which, in romania, a country very german, were more
than a
third of
the whole shebang, was
that russians are literally worse
than dogs.
mircea_popescu: wehrmacht had
tanks, and
the finns had impassible
terrain.
mircea_popescu: understand
the situation : ro army held its 1/4 of stalingradf front with infantry and
the occasional
tachanka.
diana_coman: asciilifeform, ^ ; I can't really make it any shorter / clearer
than
that
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform romania had
this brief surge in
the late 1800s / early 1900s. her pov is factual, ro army had better officers
than ~most anyone, for instance, and it was proven in both
the extrication of
the
tsar from his inept
turkis venture and in ww1.
diana_coman: makes anything; I mean:
talking
to
the pigs ?
diana_coman: and I'm not actually sure
that pointing out "oh, but he was very correctly pointing out
to
the pigs
that
they should do something for
their food"
diana_coman: I wasn't even for a second considering *those* elites, no; as I said: elites were long dead by
that
time;
the
thing was precisely
that being between
them, well, he was asking
the fat pigs
to actually do something; big surprise
they oinked only louder
trembling
that
the food might stop.
mircea_popescu: ie, it would have been ~better~, and for all of
these dorks,
to have obeyed ceausescu in '71, and in '83, and whenever else,
than
to adlai about.
mircea_popescu: witness how
the "boierii mintii"
to
this fucking day have on display neither a) work
to compare with
trilema or else b)
the required prosternation before it.
diana_coman: I suppose it's even ironic
that
the work he wanted
them
to do was by all indications closer
to
their possibilities; after all he wasn't asking for art or culture but simply for
the set number of sentences with
the set number of correct words and so on.
mircea_popescu: what elite ?
the
pliiceanu corps ?
that fat pig above ?
gunoi dinescu ? laisses, as inept as ceausescu might've been politically,
the culturniks were inept ^ inept.
mircea_popescu: in his relations
to, eg,
the "intellectual elite" (in
their own mind, and exactly nowhere else) as gathered before him at say neptun, or mangalia, he was entirely correct. and his pointing out
that
they have yet work
to do before
their workproduct is as
tall as he stands is sound, if unpleasant.
mircea_popescu: diana_coman
the point of
the discussion,
though, is
to not end up accidentally banning shitting just because ceausescu was known
to shit.
diana_coman: and yes, I can see him easily and predictably as a scapegoat; kids, don't
take crown found in
the mud just because nobody else wants it
mircea_popescu: whole
thing went bankrupt in
the 70s, by 72 it was dead. he decided
to blame "the jews", as he understood
them, hence "show off
those slick ny bankers, pay debt".
mircea_popescu: as incidentally (and incompehendingly,
to him) oil was high
then (arab embargo) he decided
to center
this mini-empire on oil production and refining.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu, "greaua mostenire" cuts both ways
though; he gets
to hide behind it for a while but he also doesn't get credit for a while
mircea_popescu: other
than escaping
the soviets, he attempted a sort of mini-imperialism,
the cutest
tchotchke show you could ever imagine, romania as an imperial power of a rag
tag group of nowhere countries (including columbia, we discussed
the very unhappy lulz of romania when
those doods decided
to just walk out of "agreements" -- mirroring exactly say spain, over
the centuries)
mircea_popescu: he
then implemented his own state apparatus.
there's nothing peculiar about
this -- incoming us president also gets rid of old regime bureaucracy, at least if he has any fucking sense.
mircea_popescu: let's do a quick ro commie likbez : ceausescu
took over in '65. he got rid of dej-era leftovers as part and parcel of continuing dej's own policy of escaping
the soviets.
this
the west ineptly (but in
typical self-centered manner) misreported as "loosening".
mircea_popescu: this isn't made up, either, various high officials joking about it, "what, ima desert in moscow ?!
these schmucks have it worse
than we do"
mircea_popescu: the 60s worked signfiicantly better in east berlin
than i nwest berlin.
the 80s miserably -- but mind
that at
the
time,
the russkis were doing ~even worse~.
a111: Logged on 2019-03-13 21:24 asciilifeform: diana_coman:
this is where i admit
that it is above my paygrade
to say just how 'maybe without shoemaker, less worse and shorter' . if
there's a way
to keep neighbours from
turning yer congo into a resource extraction base without marching peasants at gunpoint
to city and having'em stand in front of lathes
to make kalashes, i do not know it
diana_coman:
http://btcbase.org/log/2019-03-13#1902040 -> ftr
the problem is not
that he "moved pesants
to
town" but simply
that he did
that a.
through blatant lies (what communism is) rather
than an honest gunpoint if
that's what it
takes b. failed in
the end anyway
☝︎ a111: Logged on 2019-03-13 18:14 BingoBoingo: "La misma impotencia, o más, sienten las chicas del CB Guadalaviar. Ganaron la liga femenina la
temporada pasada. El otro día perdieron 50-4 contra un rival masculino. Hemos pasado de ser campeonas de liga el año pasado a sentirnos humilladas. Es un chasco de competición,
todo esto desmotiva, porque
todos los partidos acabamos por los suelos con golpes."
diana_coman goes
to read some more Caragiale
to calm down
diana_coman: I haven't really followed in ages what democratic
this and
that is going on in
there but I doubt
there's anyone
to ask anyway
diana_coman: precisely
that:
there aren't
that many crown wearers
to just let
the one you have die
diana_coman: asciilifeform, sure, at
the root of it being wtf was a shoemaker doing with
the crown on his head
a111: Logged on 2017-05-31 16:28 asciilifeform: and if someone wants
to mention godel etc -- ethical engineer MAY NOT cite godel, EVER, just as a police detective MAY NOT cite
the supernatural and admit a hypothesis of miraculous
theft from a safe
a111: Logged on 2015-03-06 03:29 mircea_popescu: if you are one of
the people buying belgian rubber concessions on
the stock exchanges, you make money. if you're in africa, you make quick with
the hands and feet.
diana_coman: I meant it lost its options really; and having an uppity peasant "rule" is not going
to change
that, only make it likely worse and longer
☟︎☟︎ diana_coman: well, england is particularly good at misery making from what I can
tell so I'd even grant
them
that
they probably did
the misery part even worse
a111: Logged on 2018-05-14 16:41 asciilifeform:
there's a common set of jokes from su, q: 'if only we let germany win, we'd be drinking bavarian! riding in mercedes!' a: '... yes, ride in mercedes. but -- as
the leather seat.'
diana_coman: in
terms of communism it was possibly
the best communism
there ever was, I can readily grant
that. My problem is with
the fact
that it was communism
though so...
diana_coman: I can't see any sort of communism
that is better.
a111: Logged on 2019-03-13 16:23 mircea_popescu: diana_coman what,
the horses ?
the "killed elite"
thing would be what,
i gh duca ? (and guess what, digging for
that reference i also ran into -- apparently
there's
a piece re
the afore mentioned prince)
diana_coman: you know,
the other funny
thing is
that all
the Russians I
talked
to were rather shocked when I described every day childhood in an industrial
town of
the 80s in Romania; and usually
the final comment is "hmmm, Romania didn't get
to
the part where it gets better". Perhaps
though I can't quite see exactly how does it get better given
the fundamental
trouble.
diana_coman: look
that if we burnt down everything , we wouldn't even be able
to chat; sure, make a new whatever but either you find a way
to organically grow it with whatever bridges are needed at first out of what is or it's not going
to work.
a111: Logged on 2014-03-04 01:25 asciilifeform: counter-derper: 'as
the leather seats'
diana_coman: from zero because "new man" and "proletariat will make now
the middle class and
the
top class and everything else in between" ; oh, and culture and literature-with-party-line
too, since we are at it
diana_coman: asciilifeform, yes;
the contention is whether
there is any option in fact
to create it out of nothing and moreover by someone who never saw it other
than from a distance at best
a111: Logged on 2019-03-13 20:56 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: is exactly what i meant as 'same relation as peasant
to his horse', 'it is simply
there'
BingoBoingo: I'm becoming rather convinced
the common man encounters a psychological failure mode if
they aren't scratching
the dirt
to avoid starvation