397500+ entries in 0.26s
pete_dushenski: while you ALSO say "'do what he means not what he says' << just
the opposite"
pete_dushenski: either way, he is bound by what he says on record. not what he 'means' in
the context of whatever arbitrary
third parties may deem
to be relevant
teachings of his predecessors
wywialm: he cannot contradict what
they chose
to sign with
these keys, can he?
pete_dushenski: pope either owns
the keys of his predecessors, and
therefore everything
they've every signed, or he doesn't and
then he can pick and choose what
to sign with his own key
pete_dushenski: wywialm: well, catholic church
teaches
that he received some from his predecessors :) << doesn't add up with >> also, he is bound by what has been signed by
them
thestringpuller: In modern
times it seems
to enable stupidity rather
than squelch it.
thestringpuller: In
this instance I'd
think weakest hunter is used as cannon fodder.
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: my mistake; but intrafamilial socialism was beneficial in allowing
the species
to use "strength in nubmers" against say
the wooly mammoth and sabertooth
tiger.
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: hunter fucks women, not
the other way around.
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: but
this isn't caveman
times when women would fuck you based on how awesome of a hunter you are.
wywialm: i
think
this is a good metaphor
wywialm: also, he is bound by what has been signed by
them
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: your 'imo' as
to
the merits and value of intrafamilial socialism doesn't stand up against
the biological and historical record.
wywialm: well, catholic church
teaches
that he received some from his predecessors :)
pete_dushenski: there's no 'maybe he didn't say
that' when it's verifiably on
the record.
wywialm: no, as
the pope does not sign with only his personal key
wywialm: there is difference between what i say loosely, what i say clearsigned and what i sign and put on
the deedbot
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: imo in both
these cases, it's detrimental
to
the species since
the weak are perserved for no other reason
than "because I can and I love my son/daughter".
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: yes but
the affect of "preventing" natural selection from occurring in
the family unit is only
temporary. even d00d protected in parents basement until his 40's may never have kids. (or perhaps
the barrier
to having kids is so low
the
termporary shield against selection of any sort gives unfit offspring
the opportunity
to spawn with other unfit offspring i.e. idiocracy)
wywialm: we have
to disagree on
that point
wywialm: i wanted
to point
that
the level of officiality (at least by catholic criteria) is ambiguous even with most publicised
texts, such as his adhortation or encyclicals
pete_dushenski: there's no official v. unofficial distinction
to be drawn. none whatsoever.
wywialm: i do not believe
that pope has opinions, simply put. what pope says is what pope says *officially* and not
to
the journalists at
the airport
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: families are very personal
things, up for each
to decide where
to draw
the lines of 'close enough
to care about'
pete_dushenski: this rationalist dualist approach
to division of
the same mind holds no water.
thestringpuller: and even here wouldn't socialism in
the family unit prevent natural selection only
temporarily?
wywialm: pete_dushenski, i'm a little bit familiar with
the galileo case, and i wouldn't put it as an example of revision of doctrine
pete_dushenski: wywialm: nope.
that just doesn't wash.
this is
the EXACT same shtick as 'opinions of ceo of megacorp are not
the opinions of megacorp'
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: when you say from a family level (which is more decentralized in context
to global societies socialism), do you mean immediate family? Dad Mom Borther Sister? Or do you mean a larger lineage: grandpa, grandma, aunt uncle cousins?
pete_dushenski: phf: catholic church definitely revised its opinions from
time
to
time. see galileo.
wywialm: but i
think
there is difference between saying
that about Bergoglio as Bergoglio, and as Pope Francis
wywialm: pete_dushenski, i hope not. i said
that Bergoglio sounds leftist, because
that is in my opinion broader
than (at least economically understood) socialism
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: see, 'socialism', while we
tend
to use it in
this manner here, doesn't ~have~
to refer
to
the societal level. it can also refer
to, say,
the family level, wherein it works quite well and, yes, prevents natural selection, which'd be
the point.
phf: doesn't cathoic church has a deedbot of some sort? i'm more familiar with orthodox system, but presumably
they come out every once in a while
to updates for canon and
the catechism, "we found
the previous belief
that 10 angels can fit on a head of a needle invalid, and on
the account of recent scientific developments in nanotechnology, we are now convinced
that
the correct number is in fact 17" sort of
thing
thestringpuller: By forcing society
to be "equal" doesn't
that benefit
the stupid more
than
the fit?
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller:
to wywialm
there may be,
tis what i'm interested
to find out
assbot: Logged on 23-09-2015 16:14:26; wywialm:
then Pope Francis is not a socialist
thestringpuller: Look at
that smiley baby face! We've all seen shawshank redemption.
assbot: Logged on 19-09-2015 03:02:00; mircea_popescu: nobody's getting "anally dilated" in prison dude. wake up and smell
the coffee, erections are rare.
wywialm: yes, jorge bergoglio *sounds* way
too 'leftist' for me
wywialm: if
this sounds ambigous
to me - and it does - i'd check what is
the context of what
the pope says, and
this is e.g. his predecessors
thestringpuller: Random L0L: I'm Charlie Shrem, Bitcoin Pioneer currently in Federal Prison. << I'm
tempted
to ask, "Is your butthole still
tight?"
wywialm: but i'm interested in what is
the Pope's
teaching on
the subject of helping
the poor is
pete_dushenski: wywialm: is jorge
too socialistic for your
taste ? or ...
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: can
the machine have lazers ? for shooting non-tall slaves ? but
then one
tall one survives
the blast and becomes
the leader of
the resistance ?
wywialm: i'm not particularly interested in Jorge Bergoglio's opinion and what he means, i'm rather scared
that
this is far away from i'd like
to hear
thestringpuller: the protohumans eventually die off and what is left is a human race dedicated
to maintaining
the machine, in
the sense of
the zerg protecting
the hivemind. Here
the machine is
the leader not a man.
thestringpuller: Well lets say
the machine was created by protohumans (pre-machine humans), and
then as a result became slaves
to
the machine
pete_dushenski: you seem
to be doing a very circular and specious job of it :P
wywialm: yes,
that is what i'm
trying
to defend
assbot: Logged on 23-09-2015 18:24:29; wywialm: is
this another case of 'do what he means not what he says' << just
the opposite
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: and
the machine came about naturally ? just like
that ?
wywialm: well, catholicism has not begun in 2013 and not in 1965 as well and
there is plenty of context
to be applied
pete_dushenski: either pope's words are his words and stand as
they are, or else
they have an alternative and alterior 'meaning' and can be 'charitably interpreted'
pete_dushenski: wywialm: mkay
then
the issue at hand is from whence we derive
this 'charitable interpretation' if not from his 'meaning' rather
than his 'words'
thestringpuller: In
this scenario I would say all men are a slave
to
the machine. Without
the machine
the species ends.
wywialm: however,
this pope doesn't seem
to be bothered by such
things as 'official
text'
wywialm: what he says, in particular what he says officially and marks as his official
teaching, is way more important
thestringpuller: lets say we have a breeding machine
that breeds all humans.
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: actually no. in
this context
the leader is bred of "the machine".
wywialm: what pope means is not more interesting
than your average intellectual
wywialm: do what he says as interpreted as charitably as possible and in
the light of
the whole catholic
teaching
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller: because
the leader is
the breeder, not
the slave clone ?
thestringpuller: At
that rate instead of limiting wealth, why not make
the leader of society
the person who happens
to be
the
tallest, (if
that is everyone is bred
to be
the same height but due
to anomolies one or
two individiuals are much
taller
than
the rest)
wywialm: is
this another case of 'do what he means not what he says' << just
the opposite
☟︎ pete_dushenski: wywialm: because
that opens
the door
to an untold number of personal fantasies, as has been previously discussed in
the logs
thestringpuller: Add some soma and other drugs in
the mix and you have robotic people who don't care about wealth but "maintaining"
the machine
that spawned
them. Honestly in
this context a differentiation of male clones would benefit society in
the same way
the Irkin empire in Invader Zim came
to power.
pete_dushenski: wywialm: is
this another case of 'do what he means not what he says' ?
wywialm: pete_dushenski, you don't have
to convince me
that pope allows himself statements
that sound dangerously leftist
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: "As such, I would find it absolutely essential, in order
to
take
this question
to its logical conclusion,
to murder everyone in my constituency extant and
to replace
them with an army of sterile maleviii clones (perhaps with
the help of Monsanto because I hear
they’re pretty good at
this sort of
thing), whom will be raised by robot nannies, so as
to control for
the differences between parenting qualities and s
pete_dushenski: thestringpuller:
this'd be
too hard
to measure and even harder
to enforce. honestly, a sterile male clone army is simpler.
danielpbarron: and on
the
topic of socialism vs capitalism and
the Bible, see also:
http://www.atruechurch.info/slavery.html >> Believers in
the first century owned slaves (Ephesians 6:9; Colossians 4:1; 1
Timothy 6:2), and
they were not instructed
to let
them go; but rather,
to
treat
them with justice
thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: kill all
the rich people when
they get past
threshold
danielpbarron: I met
the author of
that site, and a couple of his daughters, one of his sons, and his sister and her son, oh and his mother
lobbes: atruechurch.info <<
this one?
danielpbarron: > Paine rejected
the
teachings of "any church
that I know of," including "the Roman church." << me
too (with
the exception of
that one, which I found almost by accident
through a mutual interest in
the Ron Paul presidential campaign)
pete_dushenski: "It is not poverty, but prosperity,
that needs explaining. Poverty is automatic, but prosperity requires many
things – none of which is equally distributed around
the world or even within a given society."
wywialm: that does not however mean
that his power is arbitrary
wywialm: pete_dushenski,
there is no letter in Jesus's
teaching
to be followed