338100+ entries in 0.215s
punkman: isn't compressing your otp akin
to whitening?
assbot: Logged on 03-02-2016 01:53:21; asciilifeform: actually for many years i have
thought about
the ideal electric otp.
danielpbarron: if it works as a board game it probably works on a
touch screen, is probably a good general rule
danielpbarron: and yes asciilifeform i know what gpu is, just saying
there are some fun games for
touch devices
assbot: Logged on 06-02-2016 16:59:13; mircea_popescu:
then again i suppose
there's some middle aged lawyers somewhere
that remember
the days facebook was really cool.
mircea_popescu: understand : if you collect say 1024 random bits,
the chances of seeing 512 1s and 512 0s are < 1%
mircea_popescu: to be plainer : otp works better with biased pad of unknown bias
than with unbiased pad of known lack of bias.
punkman: this sounds like you want
to do frequency analysis on otp, but perhaps I'm just
thick
mircea_popescu: this is actually usable
to describe a lot of
the plain
text, and exponentially more so when i know
that debug.log
tends
to contain a lot of "connection" strings.
mircea_popescu: now,
those 4 cases out of 8 of "10" have equal chances
to meet 00, 01, 10, and 11. as a result you will see :
mircea_popescu: let's work with a very simple example. suppose we use
two bits, and suppose
the plaintext is as follows : 00 appears 1 case out of 8 ; 01 appears 2 cases out of 8 ; 10 appears 4 cases out of 8 and 11 appears one case out of 8. 1+1+2+4=8.
mircea_popescu: punkman "items" is used
there deliberately,
to scale with
the size of
the block you use.
punkman: perfect noise = all items have exact same probability
to appear. << do 0 and 1s not have same probability
to appear in random bitstring?
mircea_popescu: this is an operation very close
to compression, a sort of crypto-lzw.
mircea_popescu: the correct way
to apply otp
to something like human readable
text is
to weigh it.
mircea_popescu: and yes as noted by alf
the "pill" for
this fundamental problem is
to make sure
that message length stays well under statistical sample.
mircea_popescu: this is fundamental instruction in
the importance of.... large block sizes.
mircea_popescu: the necessary result is (different items have same varying, known probabilities
to appear as in
the plaintext)
mircea_popescu: you're doing (items have varying, known probabilities
to appear) xor (all items have same probability
to appear).
mircea_popescu: perfect noise = all items have exact same probability
to appear.
mircea_popescu: to be studied in pairs, one kid makes
the scheme,
the other kid breaks
the scheme,
then alternate positions.
mircea_popescu: do
the experiment for yourself, it's really a great entry
thing into cryptanalysis.
mircea_popescu: esp since i know plenty of strings likely
to appear in
the plaintext.
mircea_popescu: i will
then proceed
to count
the As and
the Ws and break your
thing
to a large degree.
mircea_popescu: for instance, consider
the naive situation where you
take 1mb worth of debug.log, and xor it against 1mb of perfect noise.
BingoBoingo: <punkman> gotta have something
to remember how much of
the otp has been used << burn
the used pages of your cipherbook
mircea_popescu: the whole power of
the scheme comes from "everything's equally likely". yet if everything's not equally likely...
punkman: gotta have something
to remember how much of
the otp has been used
punkman: is
there a decent otp implementation?
BingoBoingo: Seriously now,
there's people paid
to believe warez doesn't lead
to innovation.
mircea_popescu: mod6 ah. well... negotiable insturment, you know. everyone values it as he values it.
there's not exactly a dearth of offerings - notably
the reward
to prove qmail is buggy was 500. knuth's rewards are a dollar and change., etc
mod6: mircea_popescu:
the reward for
the Block Cipher contest
ben_vulpes: what does c-s buy one over
the otp in
that case?
mircea_popescu: in
the EP? general scheme of
true cryptography, otp occupies a peculiar spot, equivalent
to rsa's use of multiplication, where otp uses "multiplication modulo 1" or "multiplication in
the binary group" for a º function
ben_vulpes: and
the need
to share
the key does not impose
the same operational considerations as otp?
ben_vulpes not even qualified
to ask questions about
this probably
ben_vulpes: cramer shoup + shared key does not reduce
to...otp?
mircea_popescu: mod6> i don't
think a billion units is lulzy at all. << what is
this re ?
mircea_popescu: so for everyone watching : s.nsa will be doing double month report next month ; s.mpoe will be filing later
today.
☟︎ adlai: if Watts were alive
today, he'd prolly amend "the planet peoples"
to "the planet Bitcoins"
mircea_popescu: if nothing else,
the
tiny ammt of publicity we've been doing around it pisses people off. so...
mircea_popescu: any
time any kid grows some balls, ars is longa, well lubed and awaits.
mircea_popescu: someone WANTS
to be a cryptographer,
THAT SOMEONE better be a cryptographer.
mod6: also, which block was
the last accepted? i.e., which block was it grinding on?
mod6: gernika: be sure
to capture logs. we've seen wedges in
the past, and
they hvae some distinct
tell
tale signs in
the logs.
mod6: i don't
think a billion units is lulzy at all.
mircea_popescu: there's no way
to extrinsically motivate astrologers
to become astronomers.
gernika: asciilifeform: Since I've already shutdown
the node, I can't answer your other questions at
this
time. I will once I've started it up again and it re-wedges (i.e. no new accepted blocks for 12+ hours)
mircea_popescu: explain
the requirement, offer fame and a little fortune.
that's
the only one path.
mircea_popescu: i can inspect other boeings
that were made, including by
the people
that
trained you.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform
there is a difference between making a boeing for pay and making a cipher for pay.
assbot: Logged on 06-02-2016 17:30:00; mircea_popescu: so - if "cryptologists" can not produce what i ask of
them -
their wives,
to
the brothel,
they
themselves
to
the mines, for fraud.
gernika: or perhaps
this is one of
those "hands of
the drowning" situations. bleh. C++ here I come.