log☇︎
254300+ entries in 0.179s
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how lond does a /stats/ pageload take on phuctor ? ☟︎
mircea_popescu: incidentally asciilifeform you'd love these people. chat just exploded in a spontaneous demonstration of local brawn and might since i was there, much like a rus' village cca 1600 would. and the whole thing more or less consists of an ad hoc primitive argument for "fiots in head".
phf: i like the whole 9front, plan9 fork, aesthetic, http://9front.org/img/thinkaboutthefuture.front.png but with plan9 influence they obviously started drinking the go koolaid, http://ninetimes.cat-v.org, lots of go tools, but "NOTE: This page ceased updating in October, 2012". i wonder if that's when they realized that they are drinking from google's corporate spittoon
phf: i like how cat-v hosts their own copies of frequently linked rants, so that in a conversation one can just reference harmful.cat-v.org. like here's linus on c++, http://harmful.cat-v.org/software/c++/linus
mircea_popescu: in other news, this cat-v thing mostly looks like "an approximation of tmsr pops up every 10 years ; this is the 2005 version"
phf: we broke ascii, we need more newblood here to immunize us against random "why not use rust in docker container!!"
asciilifeform: or to treat the output of idiot cocklets from 1990s as if it were hardware.
mircea_popescu: did we yet do this lulz https://twitter.com/tmsr ?
asciilifeform: not only that, but that it is even CONCEIVABLE that i might have to care about some future browser wart.
phf: you could probably write to ecmascript 5, but even then you're not going to have enough to support what ascii is trying to do. for one, there are no integers.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform is going to run the us presidential elections. FUCK THE MALL TO DEATH!
asciilifeform: fuck js and the horse it rode in on, and the ground under the horse, and the rock under the ground.
asciilifeform: ( not to mention, on plenty of my boxes it is NOT present )
asciilifeform: catvorg_cultist: telling me that it functions IDENTICALLY wherever present?!
catvorg_cultist: >I was specifically and deliberately uninterested in using for this tutorial any language that is not already present on every reasonable box
phf: plan9 standardized on quotes as a way to print/read filenames with special symbols (like space and newline) in it, but none of the filter tools support that convention, so awk print $1 will happily render "foo\space, grep will grep for "foo\newline with rest of filename cutoff in both cases
mircea_popescu: yes but this is too kind.
catvorg_cultist: what was the name of that Rust clone of Unix, which run with "everything is a hyperlink".
mircea_popescu: a "bug" that is introduced by trying to "support" idiots is not a bug. it is trying to support idiots. do not do that.
mircea_popescu: all filenames should consist strictly of alphanum characters ; and if the os simply purged anything else, AND clobbered all files that thereby ended up with the same name into a single file, i'd applaud.
mircea_popescu: i agree spaces in filenames should not be possible. nor for that matter any utf-8 bullshit.
asciilifeform: like that 000000000....... thing from a few hrs ago
asciilifeform: a bug triggered by a case that won't happen in 10,001 years is STILL A BUIG
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-29#1550461 << point is not that they are common, but that they are 1) possible and 2) change behaviours of various utils in nonsensical ways. ☝︎
mircea_popescu: in other news, i am enjoying the trifecta of superb coffee + local cognac + homemade muffins.
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/09/criminal-gang-in-dc-passes-another-resolution-to-continue-spending/ << Qntra - Criminal Gang In DC Passes Another Resolution To Continue Spending
asciilifeform: ( forget, for a moment, that this violates the promise that had us accept there being an os to begin with )
asciilifeform: because the work of checking for error conditions ~still has to be done~, the os simply unloads it onto the back of programmer, and this could be lived with, except that it is ~not made possible~ for the programmer to unwind every possible condition.
mircea_popescu: on the web they become i%20am%20a%20windows%20fucktard.docx or such. because willy-nilly space is a thing.
asciilifeform: the 'minimalism' of unix - and yes, of plan9, and the entire c-os universe - is a cardboard sham
asciilifeform: see also the thread re error codes
asciilifeform: if i wanted to steer'em separately, i would and could run on bare iron.
asciilifeform: the point of even ~having the os~ to begin with is so that i do not have to steer the fuckingwheels separately.
mircea_popescu: "oh, but i ~intuited~ in my very special place that parsing ls output is the way to go!"
mircea_popescu: a generation of "if you don't know what a word means, don't go look it up in the dictionary, it's not like western culture is a thing or that you're bound to it my precious snowflake! you can do anything, so ~guess~ what might have been meant!" cca 1960s ran into the products of a generation that made things very much like an ak, cca 1940s. the results are exactly of this nature,
asciilifeform: filename is an atom except when i EXPLICITLY desire the opposite.
asciilifeform: because car where each wheel has to be steered separately belongs in the scrapyard. and its builder - in meatyard.
mircea_popescu: the above is fucking correct behaviour (on the part of bash), it's your job to not do that to it. what.
asciilifeform: this is more re the folly of trying to clean this cloaca maxima.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform but it is not bash's fault that unix uses null-term strings.
asciilifeform: and especially string operations that never see their null and fail to terminate!
asciilifeform: pattern and substituted with a list of all filenames that match it.'
asciilifeform: 'If a filename contains whitespace, it undergoes WordSplitting. Assuming we have a file named 01 - Don't Eat the Yellow Snow.mp3 in the current directory, the for loop will iterate over each word in the resulting file name: 01, -, Don't, Eat, etc. If a filename contains glob characters, it undergoes filename expansion ("globbing"). If ls produces any output containing a * character, the word containing it will become recognized as a
asciilifeform: environments in the lisp sense, which resemble c-machine stack frames except not retarded.
catvorg_cultist: We must protect the "environment".
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the answer is called 'environment' and was a solved problem in lisp circa 1958.
mircea_popescu: -ChanServ- [#cat-v] Welcome to #cat-v. State your assumptions or prepare to be boarded. << the similarities are striking.
asciilifeform: if 'subshells' were a rare and largely unnecessary thing, that'd be one thing. but shells as a rule offer no clean way of doing 1,001 things other than subbing out to self
mircea_popescu: well, correct in the sense of simplicity. otherwise what do you do, maintain state ?
asciilifeform: 'correct' in the down's syndrome sense.
asciilifeform: because it has genuinely nfi, apparently, that it is a sub.
asciilifeform: didja know, folks, that you cannot exit-with-return-code the script from a 'subshell' ?
a111: Logged on 2016-09-29 18:55 catvorg_cultist: it's non-standatd, it's full of undefined behavior and stupid gotchas like these http://mywiki.wooledge.org/BashPitfalls
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-29#1550397 << the 'sub-shells' idiocy melted my brain when i was writing http://www.loper-os.org/pub/lam-par/lamport_decode.sh . ☝︎
mircea_popescu: well depends what you're trying to do.
catvorg_cultist: I should probably join that channel too at some point.
mircea_popescu: o look, there's even an irc.
BingoBoingo: catvorg_cultist: This alf prefers to watch unkept cats oppress local vermin
mircea_popescu: huge task though.
mircea_popescu: whaack if you're inclined to tinker, you may try making the ring buffer discussed in the logs ; should solve the problem permanently.
mircea_popescu: "Cat-v.org Random Contrarian Insurgent Organization" (from http://cat-v.org/ ) << check those cats out lol.
catvorg_cultist: alf is that american tv show about an alien who eats cats.
whaack: alright now i connected to the six you listed and I seem to be getting responses for my askfor tx requests, I'll leave this running for another 24hrs while I get more ram (should take about a week) and report back
BingoBoingo: Nah, eventually he's going to Chinese FPGA his own lisp machine
mircea_popescu: masse isn't that much of a concern.
catvorg_cultist: Well, the gospel recommends ditching sh completely and using rc shell from plan9 instead, but guess when this will happen en masse
mircea_popescu: catvorg_cultist as pointed in the logs, non-bash is simply not used ; so the fact that dumb holes like that weren't found is not actually much proof they're not there.
mircea_popescu: after all, they fucking invented that.
mircea_popescu: amusingly, "always use quotes" and "don't use the sh wordsplitting" is good advice for sh just as much.
catvorg_cultist: it's non-standatd, it's full of undefined behavior and stupid gotchas like these http://mywiki.wooledge.org/BashPitfalls ☟︎
whaack: cycling through them one at a time
mircea_popescu: catvorg_cultist cool. so check this out : http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160929/#203
whaack: fwiw if I connect to only your "trusted nodes" list I connect but don't get back any resposes from asktxn requests etc. (assuming "askfor tx xxxx 0" in debug.log means the request returned nothing)
BingoBoingo: <Mariono> the 3 is multisig address :D << Not a real thing.
mircea_popescu: catvorg_cultist you the guy from alf's blog ?
mircea_popescu: there's a ream of other possible explanations also, at this juncture.
mircea_popescu: whaack it's also possible you have one of the mysterious connectivity issues we've kept seeing but never managed to properly document. seems less likely.
mircea_popescu: whaack it is entirely possible that your node is stuck on validating that block because of lack of ram, yes. ☟︎
whaack: asciilifeform: is there a box I can create an ssh tunnel to? would I do something along the lines of ssh sync@46.166.165.30 -L 9001:127.0.0.1:8333 and then run bitcoind with -connect=127.0.0.1:9001?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform actually the mempool-node and the blockchain-node split is pretty evident and definitely necessary. they got spit-glued together because well, early on in the prototyping phase people didn't know what's the engine and what's gonna be the carriage so just made one ball of everything.
trinque: ben_vulpes: I don't think it got in before other vpatches changed the antecedents
mod6: asciilifeform: No vpatches, other than critical ones + the makefiles were considered. There is a blerb in the forthcoming SoBA that we will begin again taking a look at some of these that have been submitted.
ben_vulpes: phf: why doesn't funkenstein's privkey tool patch show up on the patch graph?
trinque: afaik this is the first n00bdeed in a while, which is cool.
trinque puts on the list
trinque: mircea_popescu: Mariono: I need to fix key sync between the two servers involved in deeds
asciilifeform: ( i could even see an argument that, e.g., rawtx eater doesn't belong in trb , and that tx ought to be injected via the ordinary tcp method. but i dun recall having this argument )
asciilifeform: mod6 et al : was there a particular reason this one -- http://btcbase.org/patches/funken_prikey_tools -- was not considered for the release ? remind me. dun look like this was in the logz...
a111: Logged on 2016-09-29 17:28 phf: mod6: makefile is now in stable, nicely tying everything together, http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=stable
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-29#1550269 << tight ☝︎
asciilifeform: whaack: packets sent between btc nodes on the wild net have been known to 'mysteriously' vanish, like in bermuda triangle. the folks who control the backbones dislike bitcoin. the gold standard for syncing a newly-birthed node is to do so with a working node on your lan, or otherwise, if transporting it is impractical, via ssh tunnel to same.
whaack: alright I'll get more ram on my machine then. that being said you don't imagine this would be a reason for it to stall for 24hrs on a single block?
asciilifeform: btw, mircea_popescu , mod6 , et al: might be interesting to have a mempool-less mode (block relay only) for cases like this.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-29#1550319 << 2g is on the low side. ☝︎
asciilifeform: $ od -N 32 -An -t x1 -v /dev/zero | tr -d " \n" | ./lamport_encode.sh privkey.txt | ./lamport_decode.sh sha256sum pubkey.txt
mircea_popescu: Mariono ok, NOW you're good. you will have your payment later today.
mircea_popescu: what can i tell you.
mircea_popescu: Mariono dun worry about it, you;re all set ; will have your payment later today.
mircea_popescu: Mariono yup, like that.
Mariono: like that right mircea_popescu