log☇︎
24500+ entries in 0.175s
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1862587 << i suspek the problem's deeper here. ie, "already exists" concept may altogether be broken on linux/unix ☝︎
ave1: note I kept the S.MG 2018 lines untouched
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 00:54 asciilifeform: this line of thought was prompted by my 'trb observatory', which has uncovered a number of 'mpb'-style nodes, i.e. trb-like but not presenting 'modern' vers and therefore invisible from heathen www indices
diana_coman: ave1, please update so I can sign the patch
ave1: diana_coman, Ach yes, I did copy-paste everything I did not touch
ave1: netsniff-ng seems to show raw frames (eth mac is reported) but yes I'll look into the socket raw code
ave1: So far (by reading about this), I found that some NICs can do part of the framing for the OS (but I would expect that to be for large messages and not for small ones)
ave1: This I do not know (it looks raw). I'am probably doomed to read the linux network stack.
ave1: mircea_popescu, I'm doing packet sniffing (with wireshark and netsniff etc) and I see different ethernet frame sizes reported
ave1: Alternatively I was thinking about some simple speed tests (i.e. half size udp messages would translate in < half bandwith of max size udp messages)
diana_coman: btw I think this is a very good description indeed: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1862713 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 16:49 asciilifeform: ave1: there is not much to be said further re subj, i looked into what actually comes out of my lan, it sends 1500 frames upstream always.
ave1: asciilifeform, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862451, I've been reading through the logs and could find no reference of how you did this. Could this be monitored with an FPGA? (there seem to be MAC level FPGA based routers). ☝︎☟︎
diana_coman: there isn't any question that I see remaining there; I think what happened was that I was thinking a bit out loud in the logs yesterday and I got to same conclusion basically but then you started answering to the first part and some things were not unclear at a distance too and so the whole thing
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 06:49 diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1862722 -> hm, multi for the sake of it would anyway be taken care of via who signs and who doesn't sign the various patches or trees; but anyway - do you mean you think there should be explicit multi-tree dependencies? this is what I was talking about there: tree A effectively links to patch B.3 in tree B so if B's maintainer regrinds then A's maintainer has to go on a shouting spree (as per "talk to peop
diana_coman: I gather that's re http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1862730 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 03:58 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862391 << i have no idea what you mean by this "taking out" expression.
diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1862681 -> taking out of the tree i.e. opposite of http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1862683 ☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 16:13 diana_coman: yes, the way I currently see it now is pretty much that: trunk (main line) goes along the production versions of all stuff (crc32 or keccak or whatever else) and otherwise at the respective points there can be additional branches /leaves with the reference implementations
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 03:57 mircea_popescu: in any case, type1 might get i dunno, later-patch-taking-advantage-of-ddram whereas type 2 might get later-patch-needed-for-old-arms etc.
diana_coman: I read and re-read and I get the impression that this sort of delayed conversation doesn't work very well so I'll leave it for now
diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1862722 -> hm, multi for the sake of it would anyway be taken care of via who signs and who doesn't sign the various patches or trees; but anyway - do you mean you think there should be explicit multi-tree dependencies? this is what I was talking about there: tree A effectively links to patch B.3 in tree B so if B's maintainer regrinds then A's maintainer has to go on a shouting spree (as per "talk to peop ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 04:22 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862411 << but if you don't care about computers why are you talking to them ? you're not ~dependent~ on it, but i presume you care to some degree.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862411 << but if you don't care about computers why are you talking to them ? you're not ~dependent~ on it, but i presume you care to some degree. ☝︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: which is the fucking problem with current versioning systems, they encourage illegitimate context creation, of the sort of "i need to publish or perish therefore let us rename biology and rediscover it".
mircea_popescu: wtf is signing a vpatch than "i sat down to rewrite $author's work and came to his exact text, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-12#1860859 style. therefore i undersign." ☝︎
mircea_popescu: in fact, a very solid basis for respect is, "whenever i sit down to rewrite x, i end up writing what he wrote ; whereas whenever i sit down to rewrite y, i end up using empty page. thus therefore x is rated 5 and y -10"
mircea_popescu: i imagine it's just you. http://trilema.com/2012/runcible-doom/ << example rewrite. i did not start with empty buffer, nor does it matter any if you do.
asciilifeform: ( when i rewrite , i actually start with empty buffer, but that could be just me )
asciilifeform: i do believe that diana_coman read.
asciilifeform: diana_coman's, i mean
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 16:18 asciilifeform: imho 'unifiers' (i.e. patch that pulls in specific state from a parallel tree) is a cleaner way of accomplishing this than cut&paste, but i was unable to persuade.
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 16:16 asciilifeform: diana_coman: iirc mircea_popescu in particular specifically hates libs-as-separate-trees, insists that proggy oughta include errything it eats. ( i dun recall whether he answered why it should not also then include the os and compiler also in same genesis, but i'ma leave thread alone for nao)
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 16:13 diana_coman: I honestly don't quite see the point of taking crc32 out for instance
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862391 << i have no idea what you mean by this "taking out" expression. ☝︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: in any case, type1 might get i dunno, later-patch-taking-advantage-of-ddram whereas type 2 might get later-patch-needed-for-old-arms etc. ☟︎
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 15:29 trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862212 << I don't see how I could have shaved off just that rating while fixing the diana_away thing, but if it turns out I did, my apologies
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862352 << i see it ? http://archive.is/Bxyso#selection-549.1-549.3 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 15:08 lobbes: "castle-only" may be the way to go anyways; I'm not sure #trilema even needs the auctionbot to sit in here
phf: i don't think i'll be able to cut rename tonight, and then i'll be busy until friday, though will try to steal an hour here and there
asciilifeform: so nomoar 'with what do i press vtron' , 'where is php', etc
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i'ma switch to issuing cuntoo for new pilot rk folx as soon as trinque is finished birthing it
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 12:55 lobbes: and speaking of auctionbot: development is complete. At the moment I am getting ready to begin some prod testing and then all that's left is to write the blog post explaining the usage. Getting close!
mircea_popescu: bvt "Ada exposes no functions that have 'exclusive open' semantics, so I imported C ☟︎
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i possibly dun wanna drag the nice thing into it, but i dunno, way too early to optimize this partuclar pile.
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 07:53 diana_coman: in fact the 3rd option that is the one actually to use is having different sizes on the two processes (i.e. different constant simply)
asciilifeform: funnily enuff , i have 2L bottles of both water and kerosene, dun rely on purely size to distinguish. but mircea_popescu can write his proggy however he wants.
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 04:30 Mocky: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-13#1862167 >> I don't see how it would necessarily be any simpler aside from one `if` statement. And there's nothing to stop listening on separate ports and getting all benefits asciilifeform mentions with different sizes
phf: asciilifeform: i actually forgot! i'm swamped right now, but can you remind me again in about two weeks, i have a thing for you from the dig that will help with the little piece of silicon you have ☟︎☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: phf: i'm still waiting for those archaeological finds phf hinted at 2y ago...
phf: diana_coman: i've updated eucrypt to keccak, i also added ave1's patch there. also brought udp up to date.
phf: i like how C 2012 standard says that x flag works "to the extent that the underlying system supports exclusivity". of course no indication when it doesn't..
phf: oh i guess i see why that would be tricky, because of the specialization. i don't know enough ada yet to know how to fix that... perhaps just renaming it to Temporary_File is sufficient ☟︎
phf: (when i proposed the name i was thinking that it will be a wrapper around http://www.ada-auth.org/standards/rm12_w_tc1/html/RM-A-8-1.html#p6
phf: the other thing, and that's somewhat of a personal preference, i think Create_Temporary_File should either act identical to create or be called something else. right now it clashes with ada's naming convention
phf: bvt: your patch has "Binary files..." at the very end of it. i assume it wasn't made with vdiff ☟︎
ben_vulpes: mod6 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: the remaining stateside fuckgoats are packed in a specific box that i will relocate with my person.
phf: i was like "wtf, kind of shit ascii accidentally pasted instead of the real url" :p
asciilifeform: i wonder what other spamola lurks.
phf: lol, i accidentally pasted that archive url without the d, https://archive.is/ltRH
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I have come around to thinking of the process that leads to this "wished helplessness"
asciilifeform: and i'd like to know .
phf: i wonder what sort of technology those heathen node walkers use, i.e. if it's a patched up bitcoin client, or if they have own protocol parsers. seems like too much serious know how for the later
asciilifeform: this line of thought was prompted by my 'trb observatory', which has uncovered a number of 'mpb'-style nodes, i.e. trb-like but not presenting 'modern' vers and therefore invisible from heathen www indices ☟︎
asciilifeform: i'd like a (ideally real-time) picture of the actual network.
asciilifeform: phf: i was aiming for 3 basic things : 1) recursively getaddr entire reachable btc net, perhaps erry hour or so 2) find trb-compat (i.e. 'services' == 1 ) non-pseudos (i.e. if i pull block hash out of a hat, he quickly gives correct block) and eventually 3) get inv's and monitor tx propagations.
asciilifeform: that's approx where i left off, aha
phf: yeah, i wrote a small subset of bitcoin protocol in lisp, but rolled my own binary types. i think i can ask for version, and i can also ask for peers, and i started on getblock functionality..
asciilifeform: phf: context : i was baking a noad walker / torturer, orig in python, little thing, thought it would be doable in a day or 2; then found that mass of prb etc all break protocol in 9000 interesting ways, an extra byte here an' there, and realized that it aint doable without adult condition handling/restarts, which means cl.
asciilifeform: actually looking at my notes from ages past, i did, and did.
phf: i suspect you might discover it to be same kind of situation as tinyscheme
asciilifeform: and sbcl aint it. i'd prefer something like kyoto, or which ever was the absolute shortest that implemented whole standard, for starting point
phf: well, after reading the CADR documentation, source code and generally spending more time on a lisp machine, i realized that modern common lisp is a cargo cult. i'm not sure how naggum didn't see it, but possibly because his lisp was emacs/cmucl/franz
asciilifeform: it's actually one of the reasons i haven't ever finished rewrite of phuctor in cl. erry time i sat down to do it, barfed on one of these things
phf: one of the major wtfs when reading asdf code, is that when all the ifdef's fall through, hte system falls back to some seriously questionable solutions, like shelling out to unix level with elaborate commands (i don't remember the example, but it's almost like "mkdir {} && cd ..." type stuff)
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 00:17 phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-13#1862183 << no, i don't use portability packages in my own code (they are the hole through which the darkness comes), and when something pulls it as a dependency, it comes from quicklisp
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1862519 << i dun want to marry sbcl.. is this so much to ask ☝︎
asciilifeform: i dun see why it ougta be possible, period
phf: (btcbase uses 0.8.5, though i might have an older version somewhere on backup drives)
phf: out of curiousity i went through the log, and bordeaux-threads had that bt nickname pretty much since creation, in 2006
a111: Logged on 2018-10-13 23:31 asciilifeform: !Q later tell phf wouldja happen to have a frozen nonretarded version of bordeaux-threads somewhere ? the one i have, is utterly sad, squats nickname 'bt' which prevents binary-types from working...
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-13#1862183 << no, i don't use portability packages in my own code (they are the hole through which the darkness comes), and when something pulls it as a dependency, it comes from quicklisp ☝︎☟︎
BingoBoingo: hanbot: Thank you. I haven't found anything promising here yet.
hanbot: BingoBoingo re remittance shits, i found something here, going to investigate tomorrow if it'll do .uy; will update.
lobbes: I will be monitoring it to make sure everything is running smoothly. Let me know of any funkyness
a111: Logged on 2018-10-12 18:18 asciilifeform: the 1 'litmus test' i was able to think of , is the 'i pick a block hash and you gimme the block in <1s' algo.
ben_vulpes: reading satoshi's varint gave me no ends of headaches with binary-types, i eventually cheated out
asciilifeform: ( recall, i have my own working block eater in ada, posted last yr, but currently was looking into 'binary-types' in application to btc trad encoding )
ben_vulpes: i'm sure that i did but cannot recall where immediately, sec
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: unrelatedly, didja ever post yer cl block/tx eater src ? i seem to recall that you did, but can't presently find in l0gz
ben_vulpes: fence is done, transpocubes for possesions arrive tomorrow. house still unleased and one car yet needing transportation scheduled. other than that, girl and child fly out soon, and i drive out with dog shortly before.
ben_vulpes: i've since just cut over to using postgres' own godly datetime knobs because a) better in every way b) works with timezones trivially
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 18:06 asciilifeform: i'd eventually like to be rid of asdf tho.
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862478 i lost a few hours to cl-postgres/postmodern/simple date over the past two months; there is now some cl-postgres-simple-date-glue package that needs loading in order for postmodern to use its local-date set of classes. once upon a time loading simple-date after cl-postgres was enough to get the mechanisms in place. ☝︎
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-12#1861273 << largeish place, live music of poor quality on the first floor, asciilifeform and i had the top balcony to ourselves for an hour at least ☝︎
asciilifeform: i'd eventually like to be rid of asdf tho. ☟︎
asciilifeform: trinque: unrelatedly, i resolved the binary-types thing, will eventually genesis a working ver.
trinque: purged a few pieces of technical debt lingering from the rapid prototype I built during the schism. sorry to have made you a casualty of the purge!
a111: Logged on 2018-10-14 15:44 trinque: Mocky: yep, looks like I trashed it, and I see no corresponding !!unrate. restored. I will make sure there were no other dropped ratings.
Mocky: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-14#1862360 >> does 'restored' mean it should be in there now trinque? I don't see it. ☝︎