990200+ entries in 0.77s
Namjies: Well multiple domain isn't hard. Multiple servers shouldn't be
too much hassle either with current cloud/cluster services and virtualization capabilities.
mircea_popescu: the beauty of how it's designed
tho, is
that i can run it symultaneously of multiple domains
Namjies: Hmm, I would find it interesting
to see how people would react
to
that change.
mircea_popescu: Namjies i actually was planning
to both sell dtng and move mpex
mircea_popescu: in fact
this is
the first online
thing of
that level. never before was a stock exchange ever had
this
mircea_popescu: anyway.
total cap on mpex (stocks only) is just about
to breach 1mn btc.
Namjies: I still disapprove of MPEx not having it's own domain however. Especially because of
the dtng board kept on same domain. Although I don't mind it, I know many people with large capital and qualified
to participate will be repulsed by
that fact. If you recall stating some were more sensitive on
the
topic in other cultures, like in America, or something
to
that effect.
mircea_popescu: so, as btc goes up (and in no small part because of mpex)
the fee scales. is perfect-ish
mircea_popescu: otherwise its a 30 units fee on a 20mn
total monetary mass.
Namjies: It's a small fee although
the
total capitalization on MPEx is also low. If it keeps going
to become one of
the major stock exchange for Bitcoins,
that "seat" would be quite a good value however.
mircea_popescu: if i call it a stock exchange i actually mean
the words.
Namjies: I often forget you want
to manage MPEx as a stock exchange and
that
the fee I paid is actually
to get a "seat" of sort.
mircea_popescu: in other words, my core mission still is
to equip btc with
the weaponry it needs
to win
the war with fiat.
this hasn't and won't change.
mircea_popescu: there's nothing wrong with having brokers serving any market niche. irl
there's ameritrade and optionsexpress and etc doing online accounts
Namjies: I suppose considering
this, it makes a lot of sense.
Namjies: Well I see
the point of not managing low income assets. Not worth
the support. However for
traders,
there's always
trading fees. But
to avoid providing
tech support
to
them, keep
them out with a large fee. Enters coinbr which acts like a brokerage firm. And requires a monthly fee for having an account and higher
trading fees.
mircea_popescu: mpex would never list some asset making 3 btc a month, let alone something as dubious as
those were. but it doesn't have
to not list it :
Namjies: Same as small investors go
through a brokerage firm
to get a few shares.
mircea_popescu: for instance, so you understand better
that i mean : in
the discussion for psychoticboy's asset relisting, mpex got 1 vote, out of like 30.
Namjies: I suppose
this is what coinbr is for
tho.
Namjies: The way I see it, if
they're not good investors,
there's not really any incentive
to protect
them from entering
the market. Any purchasing power small or large pressures prices up or down.
mircea_popescu: at
the macro level (which is what i do for mpex) you are well advised
to use macro
tools. a barrier
to entry for instance.
Namjies: Ah. But isn't keeping
the drama out basically coming out
to avoiding certain kind of issued shares like
the ones
that were allowed on GLBSE? Not
the size of investments?
mircea_popescu: this has been stated in
the inverse, as "keeping drama out"
mircea_popescu: i want
to keep people unable
to meaningfully contribute in
the market out of it.
Namjies: And you wanted
to keep low cash investors out like
the ones on GLBSE.
mircea_popescu: that measure
they have irl of qualified investors is pretty smart.
mircea_popescu: because
there's no practical way
to check people's disposable income.
Namjies: So...
to start another discussion... why was it
that you placed such high registration fees on MPEx?
mircea_popescu: and also for
the sake of keeping
them rare. idiots
tend
to self-select as
they can't cope with it.
Namjies: I always wonder if you willingly make your initial statements seem like an extremist "never"
to promote discussion or simply for
the sake of keeping it short.
midnightmagic: And
then let Aumann's agreement
theorem
take over! :-)
Namjies: I often end up wondering, why are we arguing on
the
topic?
mircea_popescu: if everyone's done dumping
the k's of btc on mpex for five minutes
Namjies: Hmm, so we don't really disagree. But at first what you say always seem
to point
to
that your beliefs revolves around an "all for myself" basis where no help/cooperation of any sort is acceptable (and similar with anything else, always seem like an extreme "never".) When in fact you either don't agree with how it's done or how it should be applied or when it's acceptable.
midnightmagic: I ruined
the first
two sets of pork bellies, and
the farmer was so pissed off at me for ruining
the mean (even
though I'd paid for
the damn stuff) she made me butcher
the last one myself.
midnightmagic: If my Dad hadn't
the foresight
to insist I keep my BBQ as far away from
the house, I would be homeless right now.
mircea_popescu: then he wonders why police
tries
to keep an eye on him
midnightmagic: I smoked my own heritage bacon a while back. Did I
tell you about
that?
midnightmagic: I've been
trying out some nice smoked meats.. shinckenspeck.. what prosciutto wishes it were.
midnightmagic: $10 for it.
That's an okay price, I would pay for
that.
mircea_popescu: one of
the main reasons im here. better food
than france, about on par wine, 1/10
the prices.
mircea_popescu: simple game of who gets
this euro ?
the "needy" or
the working ?
midnightmagic: For a long
time I just
tried
to convince
them of a better way
to
think.
That doesn't work, basically ever.
The last decade or so I've been
trying
to refine civil human compassion.
mircea_popescu: so i gave
the salesgirl 60 and
told her
to give
the guy food worth of
the change
mircea_popescu: there's very nice farmer markets here. i bought 56 lei worth of smoked cheeses and other nice stuff.
there was a beggar
there, when he saw my cashroll he got all excited.
Namjies: But yes, people should not be systematically helped, on
that I agree.
mircea_popescu: taxes are bs, nickle
to panhandler is bs,
tithe in church is bs,
these are failure modes.
mircea_popescu: and i help people all
the
time.
the catch is
that i never help people in systematic ways.
Namjies: It is often beneficial
to help kins if
they don't live from your help.
mircea_popescu: but in principle,
the problem with society is
this : no 100% solution will ever exist. so, in general, we need
to understand and accept
that some kids will get raped, some people will get shot etc.
trying
to make a system where
these are impossible results in an unworkable system
Namjies: And for
those requesting help, consider case by case wether
to or not.
Namjies: Ah. Here, I am simply considering
the benefits of protecting individuals on which harm is done. (and not helping someone is not harming him)
midnightmagic: with giant open-air vents
to
the outside, and lots of noise at
the neighbour's place.
midnightmagic: Reality is not governed immediately by rational
thinking, neither society.
Thus, consensus by mass hallucination is what society arises from; more's
the pity when
the masses have already accepted a certain lesser reality as
truth prior
to it becoming enshrined in law.
mircea_popescu: Namjies i don't propose
that. i am just pointing out
the inconsistency involved.
mircea_popescu: i mean, "society" was in consensus earth is
the center of
the universe. lalala, big deal.
mircea_popescu: and so what society does has no bearing on
the
thinking side of
things.
mircea_popescu: Namjies i do not propose society not be based on consensus. i just say we need
to understand
thinking is an anterior, more important
thing
than society.
mircea_popescu: consensus is in general
the best
tool
to identify when you're about
to get fucked.
mircea_popescu: the romans were in agreement
that
they kick ass, just as odoacer marched in.
midnightmagic: When I say "reality" I mean, "What a single human believes is reality." Not
the objectively measurable
thing itself.
mircea_popescu: midnightmagic no.
the social representation of reality is consensus
midnightmagic: If you have 99 people in a room repeating
the same
thing,
the final will, 30% or so of
the
time, believe it
too, even if
their eyes
tell
them differently. Asche's conformity
tests.
mircea_popescu: truth is not something
that is arrived at by consensus, nor is value.
midnightmagic: Consensus is a pretty powerful
thing. Children are incapacitated people, until
they either come into
their responsibility, or prove
they have it early.
mircea_popescu: hence
the distinction between practical (how society
treats
them) and philosophical (what
they are)
Namjies: You
treat
them
the same way
tho, wether
they're half or whole. You
treat it as food.
mircea_popescu: midnightmagic we're discussing
the philosophy of it rather
than
the practice.
midnightmagic: But
they do have human rights which are inalienable regardless of how old
they are.
midnightmagic: They are only not citizens insofar as
they can't vote and aren't held responsible for
their own actions.
Namjies: Well I suppose
they are indeed not really citizens.
mircea_popescu: i was using it in
the social participation sense. citizen.