951000+ entries in 0.696s
mod6: there needs
to be at least 3
MJR_: anyway I
think
there is a
ton of room for competition
to mt gox
MJR_: they listed
the loss in dollars, but you can't send cash over a wire
pgp: you can lead a horse
to water
pizzaman1337: "Overall, due
to major choke points and redundancies in our system,
the hacker was only able
to walk away with $12,480 USD in BTC, and send
them in 3 installments of 333 BTC
to bitcoin addresses."
pgp: they weren't using
two factor auth with
that exchange...
mircea_popescu: usure ? cause i wrote about
this and iirc shrem was saying btc
MJR_: front page hackers used DNS
to steal 12000 worth of BITCOINS
mircea_popescu: pigeons wait. didn't bitinstant lose
the BTC on vircurex ?
pgp: moreover, because like asset exchanges belong
to
the same "clearing clubs",
they can route orders
to one another
to ensure "best execution" for
their customers (while, of course, charging for
that convenience)...
MJR_: they stole usd from
the servers
mircea_popescu: pgp
the reason is
they're mixing bizdev with
the fee schedule.
pgp: for starters, most all exchanges
today pay you
to add liquidity
to
their book -
the so called "maker-taker" fee model.
MJR_: I meant
the bitcoin exchanges
mircea_popescu: if we scale
this liniarly we discover it'd cost more
than it's worth
to have
ti
trade
mircea_popescu: what's sad is
that
they
take ~5k a month in hardware costs
to process 8k
trades in 30 minutes
mircea_popescu: MJR_ mpex doesn't do fiat
tho, so it's kinda moot for
this problem
pizzaman1337: well,
there must be some info on it somewhere
that I could get access
too
MJR_: it is pretty sad
that
the biggest exchange can't handle orders in less
than 5 min
mircea_popescu: pizzaman1337 no but srsly,
this is
the sort of
thing people pay in
the 100's of k's for,
mircea_popescu: pizzaman1337
this ain't knitting we're discussiong here man.
pizzaman1337: so what is
the "proper" way
to run an exchange? where can I read about
this?
MJR_: well...last I checked
there was only one exchange
that hasn't been hacked
mircea_popescu: pgp bitfloor,
the guys currently owinfg like 900x what
they'll ever make ?
mod6: we're
the laughing stock
MJR_: so you need people who are
tech AND finance savvy
mod6: i got
trolled so hard by my gf for
this shit yesterday
pgp: yes - with
the exception of bitfloor, it doesn't seem
that
these exchanges are run by anyone familiar with how "real" exchanges (and clearing operations) actually work...
MJR_: you would be surprised how many financial wizards have
trouble using email
mircea_popescu: the problem with bitcoin in general is
the userbase is dumb.
mircea_popescu: problem is every exchange wants
to act as if in a vacuum, because
mircea_popescu: or independently, but pgp is a good solution
to keep it safe.
mircea_popescu: pgp
that could easily be implemented using
the mpex push for isntance
pgp: this would also require something akin
to DTCC (depositiory
trust clearing corp) where every exchange is a member and keeps money on deposit...
kakobrekla: the first important step, realizing
that.
mod6: i don't
think im smart enough for
this stuff.
pgp: credit lines between exchanges
to allow cross exchange arb would be an important start...
MJR_: well, again I
think
that could happen on a larger scale...
mod6: and fixing
this block size
thing is kinda crazy. its like you know when you get a UDP request
to your DNS server and
the reply from
the Zone is >
than
the max size of UDP, it rolls over
to
tcp
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:19:27 <mircea_popescu> this process is called fixing, it's widely used
to obtain a price.
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:19:14 <mod6> think i just need
to add some sleep
time....
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:19:08 <mircea_popescu> now a b and c review
their books
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:19:00 <jurov> ah
that kind of meeting you mean
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:18:58 <mircea_popescu> x has
to call a lower price now
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:18:45 <mircea_popescu> then
they say. a buys 50k usd. b sells 25k usd. c sells 70k usd.
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:18:27 <mircea_popescu> a, b and c go
through
their books, see what customers want, see what
they want on
their own account
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:18:13 <mircea_popescu> chair X calls
the meeting. X proposes price, say 47.5
mircea_popescu: Mar 11 09:18:00 <mircea_popescu> ok, it's like
this. suppose
the
three main dealers are A, B and C.
mircea_popescu: few people involved actually have enough finance knowledge
to get it going yet.
MJR_: well, one
thing is
that instant settlement is going
to be harder and harder
to scale
mod6: this will help distrbute
the load of exchange, and
then btc wont have 1 place
to look for price signals.
mircea_popescu: mod6 it would be good
to have many exchanges, but
there's problems with getting
that
to work in p[ractice
mod6: root servers don't keep
the same code either, not exactly anyway,
this way it prevents a simutaious attack against all
pizzaman1337: kakobrekla wants something like
the way fx is setup
mod6: not
that all
the code should be
the same.
mod6: dns has root servers worldwide
to resolve requests.
thinking
that maybe btc could do well
to have like 10-13 worldwide exchanges all independant of eachother.
mod6: i was
thinking about
the gox issue...
mod6: im just depressed about
this shit
mod6: i couldn't possibly remember
them all
mod6: so many problems over
the years
mod6: its just something
to be cautious of
mircea_popescu: mod6 bring me up
to speed, what exactly is
the objection ? it is widely deployed and consequently well debugged by now
mod6: yeah BDB has been a
thorn in dev's side for a decade. but sounds like
this
time
they forgot about a landmine
they already stepped on once before.
mircea_popescu: the proof of something awful's general cluelessness/irrelevance is
the low level mock articles
they're pushing out.
pigeons: you can configure it
to use more locks, so far
that seems
to work just uses a lot more ram but works
mircea_popescu: pigeons i fear it'll
take me a little
to digest
this one
mircea_popescu: this is possibly
the worst case of "hi i am calling
to report a bug" bungled
tech support ever.
mircea_popescu: devs say berkeley is broken. it is fine.
they forgot
to configure it.
pigeons: "If anyone has any idea how I can buy a large amount of bitcoins please message me.
The largest amount I can buy from bitinstant is $500 worth ive looked and looked and its near impossible
to make a large bitcoin purchase anywhere."
mircea_popescu: well... let's just hope gavin sends him
the correct lists
then
pigeons: "if I was a scammer I could be living it up easy some place warm instead of braving
the same upstate new york winters I have been for 30+ years"
mircea_popescu: so he couldn't do refunds all
through february because
the devs borked
transition
to .9
pigeons: today I downloaded .7 and have been patiently waiting for my blockchain
to download, im not sure if I will continue refunds or just buy a big crack rock and smoke it in a cave some where but I am
totally offended by
this scammer
tag
gribble: BTCUSD
ticker | Best bid: 45.01770, Best ask: 45.01771, Bid-ask spread: 0.00001, Last
trade: 45.01771, 24 hour volume: 171261.27579910, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 43.77026
mircea_popescu: until someone figures out how
to
trigger
the berkley bug with a smaller block
kakobrekla: anyone having any
txes hanging in
the air?
imsaguy: I am one of
the unidentifieds
ThickAsThieves: i'm just stuck on meta
thoughts lately, i
think its lack of sleep
smickles: imsaguy: compile your own from .8 but modify it
to say
that it is 1.0
Luke-Jr: imsaguy: draw a big circle and write 1.0 in
the middle?
imsaguy: Luke-Jr: could you make one
that's futuretime?