log☇︎
947100+ entries in 0.683s
dub: proffessional thetan?
kakobrekla: - perpetual thinker, - permanent tourist, - possibility thinker - privacy techincian, - pirate pass through
kakobrekla: what bullshit is this
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: I might take you up on that challenge.
mircea_popescu: there's like 5k bucks waiting to be won by some clever chap there
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: that wouldn't do the trick, necessarily. presumably they have plenty of BTC in house to absorb the "noise"
mircea_popescu: this is an open problem generally, there's even a serious bounty out for a certain formulation of it
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you can measure (a good portion of) mpex's inbound btc, for that matter.
asciilifeform: say, by measuring ping time
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not so sure about that. it might be possible to measure traffic to, say, mtgox, indirectly (without being in control of mtgox)
mircea_popescu: not something that can in principle be refuted, is it ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform was discussed here just a day or two ago
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.79980, Best ask: 50.85000, Bid-ask spread: 0.05020, Last trade: 50.85000, 24 hour volume: 71804.32426947, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.19010
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.79898, Best ask: 50.79899, Bid-ask spread: 0.00001, Last trade: 50.79898, 24 hour volume: 71294.17494196, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.17302
pgp: betcha that bitcoinity could do some sort of gox lag chart...
smickles: < benkay> is it unreasonable to ask for goxlag in the ticker? << nanotube
pgp: how it it that bitcoinity is updating and gox's US "Partner" coinlab isn't...
benkay: is it unreasonable to ask for goxlag in the ticker?
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.79898, Best ask: 50.79899, Bid-ask spread: 0.00001, Last trade: 50.79898, 24 hour volume: 71294.17494196, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.17302
pgp: at least that never happens on gox... lol
mircea_popescu: the adults has left the playground ?
pgp: tradehill looks like their down - soiled themselves already...
benkay: of transient value
benkay: are there any good charts of goxlag?
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.53002, Best ask: 50.82998, Bid-ask spread: 0.29996, Last trade: 50.52002, 24 hour volume: 70828.14155647, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.16342
Bowjob: $50 is the new 5
Bugpowder: How many russians are thinking of putting 1% in bitcoin.
Bugpowder: $50 is the OLD paradigm
Bowjob: $50 is the new paradigm
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.20001, Best ask: 50.80000, Bid-ask spread: 0.59999, Last trade: 50.20001, 24 hour volume: 70775.46761279, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.16174
Bugpowder: that seems to be up to date
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.83101, Best ask: 51.11538, Bid-ask spread: 0.28437, Last trade: 51.29899, 24 hour volume: 66200.90710021, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.02600
Bugpowder: he sold to market
Bugpowder: THat was the wall at 54
mircea_popescu: addy 1 sends to 2 sends to 3 sends to 4
mircea_popescu: Bugpowder check out the 6k ish txns
deadweasel: gox just took a gigantic crap
Bugpowder: Looks like 5000 BTC getting bounced from addresss to address with 2BTC missing each time
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.83101, Best ask: 51.11538, Bid-ask spread: 0.28437, Last trade: 51.29899, 24 hour volume: 66200.90710021, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.02600
deadweasel: i just cashed out, that was me....
mircea_popescu: 1mn btc transacted ?!
mircea_popescu: wtf is that block
BitHub: i like to build parks, and roads, and speedhumps
BitHub: When it comes to Tax why give money to a useless middleman that does a pretty terrible job at making the best of your money to make a better country, actually just waste alot, there's no point paying them when i can just hire people to make the country a lil bit less shit.
mod6: Bugpowder: yeah thought that was weird
Bugpowder: -25 BTC transaction fee?
gribble: There are currently 14319.578 bitcoins offered at or under 54.0 USD, worth 768614.569271 USD in total. | Data vintage: 150.8870 seconds
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.83101, Best ask: 51.11538, Bid-ask spread: 0.28437, Last trade: 51.29899, 24 hour volume: 66200.90710021, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.02600
gribble: BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 50.83101, Best ask: 51.11538, Bid-ask spread: 0.28437, Last trade: 51.29899, 24 hour volume: 66200.90710021, 24 hour low: 47.12009, 24 hour high: 52.87500, 24 hour vwap: 49.02600
smickles: Bugpowder: but it's taxed in a whole different way if you barter with it
mircea_popescu: BitHub practically or theoretically ?
mircea_popescu: of course, it wouldn't be the first time this here bird is considered a duck for the purpose of X law and a goose for the purpose of y law
Bugpowder: get that guide
Bugpowder: bartering tokens are still taxable
smickles: if stuff like the fincen doc keep popping up, bitcoin 'revenue' isn't revenue
BitHub: right so if everything is in btc why pay tax?
deadweasel: it goes to war.
BitHub: right mircea because MPEX is paying coporate tax right?
deadweasel: because 51%+ goes to something worse than churches
smickles: also, they gave me ~4kusd for my kid this year
mircea_popescu: smickles not you, them
smickles: mircea_popescu: i'm not, it's just that i'm poor and haven't done it yet
parseval: Have them mail it to you
smickles: it's all part of the plan
mircea_popescu: why are you folks so hell bent on not paying tax ?
benkay: why do that?
smickles: deadweasel: not when you trade it for usd
BitHub: cant you just hide your coins and tell them you got hacked?
deadweasel: fuck those guys, this is bartering
smickles: i might actually have to pay federal income tax this coming year if this shit keeps up
Bowjob: work at like mcdicks. make more money than the manager
Bugpowder: That FinCEN thing looks interesting
deadweasel: coinbase just took my txn. given their history that doesn't mean anything.
Bowjob: i ougtta work or something. this feels cheating
smickles: i think it said both
parseval: I think it's just if you sell it
smickles: that doc says if you buy a decentralized virtual currency, you are a money transmitter
smickles: i dun think so
smickles: BitHub: if you buy wow gold you're a money transmitter?
BitHub: they class it the same as wow gold here
mircea_popescu: kinda nice to have them come out with "it is not a currency" statement.
mircea_popescu: so in the end, fincen guidance supports at least in part http://trilema.com/2012/the-reasons-why-bitcoin-securities-cant-be-regulated-by-the-sec/
smickles: not foex, but money tx
parseval: Oh, nice, I missed that part
mircea_popescu: A person must exchange the currency of two or more countries to be considered a dealer in foreign exchange.19 Virtual currency does not meet the criteria to be considered "currency" under the BSA, because it is not legal tender. Therefore, a person who accepts real currency in exchange for virtual currency, or vice versa, is not a dealer in foreign exchange under FinCEN's regulations.
smickles: looks like they are trying to say anyone who buys or sells bitcoin for fiat is a money transmitter
parseval: You have to follow the BSA as a transmitter
mircea_popescu: to be a transmitter it substantively requires you blabla as part of acceptance/transfer of funds/currency/etc.
parseval: Looks like MtGox is getting out just in time
mircea_popescu: to be an administrator it substantively requires you have the ability to withdraw units.
parseval: and is a money transmitter. In addition, a person is an exchanger and a money transmitter if the person accepts such de-centralized convertible virtual currency from one person and transmits it to another person as part of the acceptance and transfer of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency.
parseval: A person that creates units of this convertible virtual currency and uses it to purchase real or virtual goods and services is a user of the convertible virtual currency and not subject to regulation as a money transmitter. By contrast, a person that creates units of convertible virtual currency and sells those units to another person for real currency or its equivalent is engaged in transmission to another location
parseval: A final type of convertible virtual currency activity involves a de-centralized convertible virtual currency (1) that has no central repository and no single administrator, and (2) that persons may obtain by their own computing or manufacturing effort.
mircea_popescu: putting into circulation) a virtual currency, and who has the authority to redeem (to withdraw from circulation) such virtual currency.
mircea_popescu: This guidance refers to the participants in generic virtual currency arrangements, using the terms "user," "exchanger," and "administrator."6 A user is a person that obtains virtual currency to purchase goods or services.7 An exchanger is a person engaged as a business in the exchange of virtual currency for real currency, funds, or other virtual currency. An administrator is a person engaged as a business in issuing (
benkay: where did you find that, parseval?
kakobrekla: anyone singed up for that prime idiotism?
parseval: FinCEN's statement on applicability of regulations to virtual currencies, posted today
mircea_popescu: Bugpowder the only thing the rental store had was a pink tux and a strapless sperm-white gucci dress
mircea_popescu: 53 about to gho