917800+ entries in 0.614s
MJR_: that is
the best feature of it in my opinion,
that it isn't controlled
truff1es: why does bitcoin ned
to be controlled...
ThickAsThieves: started with whether paypal would use bitcoin somehow, or make
their own coin
MJR_: basically...decentralized vs centralized (why a coin controlled by paypal is pointless, and if
they don't control it,
they are not adding any value)
truff1es: im not sure what
the discussion was about, free market rules in bitcoin?
MJR_: if your promotion or your marketing cause you
to get
the most people
to join, its
the best
MJR_: lol, bitcoin is slowly
taking over freenode
truff1es: yea
there are many channels for bitcoin
MJR_: everyone is free
to compete with everyone
augustocroppo: Thank you by
the
tip, I am lost in
the Freenode server...
MJR_: since anyone can start a mining pool,
the best mining pool will win
ThickAsThieves: careful, if you arent predicting where
the price is going, btc-anal crew gets antsy
MJR_: anyway, since anyone can create software
to use
the bitcoin protocol, people will create
the best one, as long as its worthwhile for
them
truff1es: <augustocroppo> join #bitcoin-analysis more discussions
that you desire imo
MJR_: well...since i said it is a system, which is what you disagreed with, systems are abstract concepts...the current implementation of our economy has some features
that are based on a free market economy
augustocroppo: I
think
this concept of "free" market is just a fictional idea...
KRS1: Everyone gets it in
the end
MJR_: but i agree
totally
MJR_: i'm not
trying
to get semantic
MJR_: your ability
to impact it is only limited by YOUR ability
to impact it
ThickAsThieves: guys, getting semantic about everything is worse
than a circlejerk
MJR_: within
this system, everyone is able
to impact it as much as
they can
MJR_: it means
that
there is no external regulation
augustocroppo: Right, and what exactly
the "free" means in all
that structure?
KRS1: those are for
the alt-coins
MJR_: A free market is a market structure in which
the distribution and costs of goods and services, along with
the structure and hierarchy between capital and consumer goods, are coordinated by supply and demand unhindered by external regulation or control by government or monopolies
KRS1: i just started
the channel #bitcoin-anal, everyobody's welcome
to come
MJR_: it is exactly
the same
thing
MJR_: saying
that
the guys who made netscape navigator could have ruined
the internet is pretty unlikely
ThickAsThieves: the conversation did stem from how an entity like Paypal would never
touch bitcoin because of
these factors
mod6: eventually
they'll get us
that spec and some more dev's will be off
to
the races on
their own client
MJR_:
http is a protocol, i can write a browser
to use
that protocol
MJR_: if people don't like
the mining pools decisions,
they will join a different one
truff1es: if you build it,
they will come
MJR_: so, bitcoin is closest
to
that ideal...if people don't like
the devs,
they will build
their own software
MJR_: anyway, my point is
that a free market is
the most efficient system so far
MJR_: sorry had
to run downstairs
truff1es: they actually seem
to like discussing
things in
there
ThickAsThieves: turns out
the bitcoin-anal crew actually are a little anal
truff1es: there arent
too many people in here compared
to otc
augustocroppo: Someone
told me
that IRC is where
the most important subjects related
to Bitcoin are discussed.
ThickAsThieves: mainly i was saying
that devs have ability
to ruin bitcoin
iz: and you are abstracting what "centralized" vs "decentralized" means far
too much
iz: because it's
too abstract
iz: i
think your idea of a "perfect decentralized system" doesn't exist really
iz: can you give any examples of such a
thing existing?
iz: how would you define a decentralized system
that acts like one in your mind
then?
iz: that's not what decentralized vs centralized means
though
ThickAsThieves: because
there are a handful of people deciding its fate
iz: are you saying bitcoin isn't decentralized, because all
the clients follow
the same protocol?
ThickAsThieves: the ability for a party
to manipulate it enought
to affect all users
iz: maybe
there is some confusion about what decentralized means in
the bitcoin context
iz: they don't? who
the hell was
that guy
then?!?
MJR_: last i checked
they didn't come
to your house and install it without your consent
MJR_: you can choose
to download it, or not
MJR_: they are allowed
to release whatever
they want
MJR_: they released
THEIR software
MJR_: next
time
the pool operators could say no
MJR_: the point is,
they had
to ask at every step of
the way
MJR_: no...that is like saying
that since I can vote in elections I control who is president of
the US
MJR_: and if everyone decides
to go in one direction, i can mine my own forked chain and have my own little world...or i can go with
the majority
ThickAsThieves: control only requires
the ability
to manipulate
the controls
MJR_: that is
the key word
MJR_: what do mining pool operators control?
the hashes
they produce...no biggie
MJR_: so what do
the devs control?
their implementation of
the bitcoin protocol
gribble: There are currently 74644.128 bitcoins offered at or under 250.0 USD, worth 14832772.4797 USD in
total. | Data vintage: 46.1288 seconds
gribble: There are currently 57833003 bitcoins demanded at or over 0.0 USD, worth 19845908.6143 USD in
total. | Data vintage: 31.6619 seconds
MJR_: anyone can write
their own software
gribble: There are currently 47694.042 bitcoins offered at or under 200.0 USD, worth 8461014.99825 USD in
total. | Data vintage: 24.4125 seconds
gribble: There are currently 57796.802 bitcoins demanded at or over 100.0 USD, worth 7146181.94725 USD in
total. | Data vintage: 16.2669 seconds
MJR_: you don't have
to use
the software
they create
MJR_: they just
turned
them off
themselves
gribble: There are currently 159761.04 bitcoins demanded at or over 50.0 USD, worth 14120174.0375 USD in
total. | Data vintage: 0.0096 seconds
MJR_: they didn't have
to ask
the mining pool operators
MJR_: they
turned off
the miners machines?
MJR_: and you could have kept on mining
the longer chain until it became invalid