765500+ entries in 0.472s
greenspan_fan: to bring it back
to my understanding of
TLP's point, it's
that society's "power" (in some loosely defined sense) is distributed according
to a power law
mircea_popescu: inasmuch as you don't draw any inference from it, you may continue
to
think so.
greenspan_fan: but
that can be biased (and occasionally is) by
the people around
them;
those
they look up
to,
those
they get paid by, people on
the news, etc.
mircea_popescu: "suppose
this brick is a boat. obviously actual boats actually float, but nevertheless.
greenspan_fan: obviously people have
their own directions and goals etc.
mircea_popescu: and predicate a retrospective causality
that never existed.
mircea_popescu: for instance,
there are people right here working for me as we speak and probably reading
this. i have no fucking idea where
their working for me is going,
greenspan_fan: tell me, and I'll strive
to correct it, insofar as such is possible
greenspan_fan: so what I'm saying is
that having 1000 people who listened
to leaders was a necessary (but not sufficient) condition
to launch some revolutions
greenspan_fan: weren't you arguing
the other day
that
they're still
there regardless?
mircea_popescu: in fact, matrices aren't even
there. and besides
they could never be small enough
to fit.
mircea_popescu: just because i use some matrices
to describe eigenstates does not mean matrices are now integral parts of quantum mechanbics.
greenspan_fan: it's
true, I've only read books on history in english
mircea_popescu: but plenty of retellings of history of
the world in english have been predicated on
the cognitive device you describe.
greenspan_fan: how many revolutions were launched because 1000 people agreed with
the analysis of someone else?
mircea_popescu: "if you have 1000 average people [...]
take over a small county "
mircea_popescu: no, but
they are capable of making
their own fucking judgements.
greenspan_fan: so you're saying
that everyone who works for you is universally equally good at everything
greenspan_fan: like presumably you're able
to gauge
the relative strengths and weaknesses of
the people who work for you, right?
greenspan_fan: the problem with
those places is
they were run by idiots
greenspan_fan: well I mean agency in
the "standing athwart
the bow of history" levels of agency
greenspan_fan: just saying
that if you have 1000 average people who listen
to you, but no money, you'd still be able
to run a business or
take over a small county with
them
mircea_popescu: are you going
to
try and resurect an argument as
to agency underneath
there ?
greenspan_fan: yeah but I mean, people are more effective
than
that
mircea_popescu: that's what
the fucking coal finder machine is for : it finds coal.
mircea_popescu: if i don't find
the coal over here i'll find it over
there
greenspan_fan: "Everyone who gives himself a master was born
to have one"
greenspan_fan: because you wouldn't be part of
that mass if you had real agency
greenspan_fan: yeah, in
terms of resources, not in
terms of agency
mircea_popescu: do you mean add up
to something in
terms of resources, like a lot of coal or plankton adds up
to something more
than less coal or plankton ?
mircea_popescu: the huddled masses add up
to something ? why and wherefore ?
greenspan_fan: mircea_popescu because if
the self-appointed "bitcoin community" listens
to you (even if
they're on average <0.1 btc holders)
then you might either get lucky and a) influence someone who actually matters or b)
the huddled masses still might add up
to something
greenspan_fan: mircea_popescu well
the very
top opinion leaders have *some* power, but
the average is in
that 98%
greenspan_fan: but it's irrelevant because most of
the money isn't in
the hands of
those people
greenspan_fan: so for instance in bitcoin (and other currency) you can look
to r/bitcoin for a community
that is generally really homogeneous and has strong beliefs one way or
the other
greenspan_fan: what's interesting (and
Taleb hits on
this as well) is
that people are generally really poor at evaluating power-law
types of extremes
greenspan_fan: you can either have
the most money or you can have
the loudest megaphone, but if you don't have one one of
those
then it doesn't matter what you
think
mircea_popescu: see, many aspire
to be a bitcoin jesus, but
this guy actually has enough insight.
mircea_popescu: You are
the 98%, you are
totally without any access
to
the machinery of power and worse, much worse, you plug yourselves into
the machinery of media and become a slave.
mircea_popescu: "Marching gets our message out." No it doesn't, it gets CNN's message out. "We don't watch CNN, we use
the internet." Yet given
the infinity of
the internet you still surf
the same 5 websites, looking for and finding exactly what you want, like a baby playing peekaboo in a mirror over and over and over and over and over and over and...
greenspan_fan: "So I decided
to
try again, I
told myself
that
there was going
to be porn at
the end of it,
took off my pants, and watched. No, I didn't go back
to
the
theatre; fortunately,
the major studios have joined
together and created a website called "The Pirate Bay" which allows you
to watch a movie for free before you decide if you want
to buy it from Amazon for 4 bucks"
greenspan_fan: on
the off chance you haven't read
those particular ones
mircea_popescu: "The government allows it because someone has
to deal with
those "patients."
The government doesn't any other options. "
greenspan_fan: like, everyone here is more or less interested (and able
to understand) all of
the great stuff in
the world
mircea_popescu: people suddenly discovering
that joe=from-across-the-country also read hitchhiker's
mircea_popescu: greenspan_fan you know what
this has a lot in common with ?
mircea_popescu: soviets couldn't have fucking done it for lack of you know,
tv. internet. roads. stuff.
ozbot: The Last Psychiatrist: You Are
The 98%
mircea_popescu: the road was a lot wetter during rain
than during drought,
too.
mircea_popescu: course with or without
that
the system's movin'
that way
mircea_popescu: i actually
translated it in romanian cca 2011 so as
to equip
teh countrymen with
t\he
tool
greenspan_fan: kinda disturbed
to find out all of you read
TLP as well...
mircea_popescu: e Man (but with no pension.)
That's
the system. Cut SSI payments and
those docs-- and nurses and etc-- don't get paid.
mircea_popescu: The system not only pays poor people, it employs lots and lots of almost poor people. I'm not saying
this is a good
thing, or a desirable
thing, I am simply stating a fact. Some of
these are direct government jobs (e.g. staff down at
the SSI office) and some are pretend private sector jobs. If you're a psychiatrist at an inner city clinic, you may
think you're an independent contractor, but you're really working for
Th
mircea_popescu: works before you spew nonsense
to your local Fox affiliate. "Hi,
this is Bill from Cleveland, and I blame liberals." Son of a bitch, why didn't I
think of
that.
mircea_popescu: I'm guessing
that
this probably upsets people, on both sides of an imaginary political divide
that only
took 40 years
to perfect.
Thanks
TV! Certainly I have my own opinions, but it doesn't matter what I
think, what matters is what is.
This is
the system. If you
think you can effect a huge social overhaul
then feel free
to vote for Hope And Change and ongoing Afghanistan deployments, otherwise understand how it
greenspan_fan: looks like pympex is open source? It's on github, if
that's
the right one
greenspan_fan: also I'm kidding,
the above kinda defeats
the purpose of git
greenspan_fan: here's a great way
to solve version control problems
cads: I wish I had access
to shapeways' production statistics
jurov: maybe
they have high sekurity and it's not allowed
jurov: note
the quotes, wont work without
jurov: did you
try passing 'PUSH|X.YZ|123GPGKEY|100' as parameter ?