log☇︎
692700+ entries in 0.427s
asciilifeform: the distinction between source and object code is an evil thing, rather like leaded gasoline - ought to have gone away a generation ago.
asciilifeform: even on a very minimal machine, with a few kb of memory, it is possible to use a language like Forth - which preserves the semantics of the code, and has genuine repl.
asciilifeform: it is possible - and has been done - to build cpu which executes high-level language more or less directly. but, given as i have an entire blog about this, i will omit the details here.
asciilifeform: people who design baroque contraptions (ml, haskell, ocaml, go - tradition) for 'smarter compiler' - that ends up grinding the original semantics of a program into incomprehensible soup - as if god came and said to mortals to use pdp-11 forever - are solving the wrong problem.
asciilifeform: you ought to be able to do 'who-calls' and other useful operations that need the machine to retain semantics of the original code
asciilifeform: it is important to understand what a proper repl consists of. i.e. a bash loop that repeatedly calls a compiler is not a genuine repl.
asciilifeform: yeah, the folks responsible for 35 years of static language well past sell by date
diametric: asciilifeform: it's also the brain child of Ken Thompson and Rob Pike
asciilifeform: 'go' is funded by the same bozos who spend $billion on a company making GUI thermostats.
asciilifeform: diametric: every so often, folks invent another 'ocaml' - compiled language with 'strong typing.' you lose the REPL - you lose me.
diametric: asciilifeform: I've been meaning to ask you on your opinion of Go
asciilifeform: benkay: and this reply to a reader asking about urbit (author of urbit was labouring under the same ill-conceived notions that produced haskell) - http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1390
Naphex: and using fopen('/dev/sttys*') to read serials and sh unix scripts with stty to setup serial ports
Naphex: and had some php scripts running as daemons over sockets to emulate IPC and threads
Naphex: if you're wondering how is that possbile, it ran a browser in full screen on the front-end
Mats_cd03: must be nice to have that contract
Naphex: so don't do that :)
Naphex: but just for lulz, i once saw a embeddec computer for public transportation, written in php :)
Naphex: anyway all languages are just tools, use what fits best with you/your team, your hardware etc
mike_c: back to 3.4 th/s. must be pool-hoppers on atc.
asciilifeform: Naphex: the readability and 'omg 111 parentheses' problems go away when you use an adult editor.
mike_c: i will certainly give it a try.
asciilifeform: mike_c: it wouldn't be too far off the mark to say that i like common lisp because 'slime' is possible for it, rather than vice-versa.
asciilifeform: Apocalyptic: did some ocaml ages ago. not my cup of tea.
Apocalyptic: since we're discussing functionnal languages what are you thoughts on Caml asciilifeform ?
benkay: its p true
assbot: SLIME: The Superior Lisp Interaction Mode for Emacs
mike_c: i have heard you say that (and filed it away for my future research)
Naphex: for lets say 3 years, enough that every programmer there is bored shitless
Naphex: but picturing a 8-man dev team working on a project in lisp
Naphex: i don't doubt they exist
mike_c: i used to agree about the readability, but i have recently seen some elegant looking lisp programs. and i used to think python was unreadable. so who knows.
jurov: and the body is (if (leap year) give bonus)
benkay: i wrote a function last night that runs a job, every now and again
benkay: it's just that cool.
mike_c: i'm starting to think it might be that cool. it's on my list to learn when i have a spare minute.. so who knows when.
kakobrekla: Naphex> c'mon now lisp aint that cool < php dev said to python dev!?
Naphex: c'mon now lisp aint that cool
mike_c: Naphex: mtgox would have managed to suck in any language. i just feel bad for good programmers who somehow have ended up using php. probably the same as asciilifeform feels for all of us that don't use lisp.
kakobrekla: but right now im trying to implement some panacea models in newlisp
Naphex: but that custom php wallet software, jesus :]
Naphex: mike_c: i doubt ZF had anything to do with mtgox vulns
kakobrekla: anyway the fw that i made was first tested on smpake.com service and was made with btc in mind
Naphex: ZF for php was more then decent
pankkake: many frameworks are more of a hassle to use than nothing, for sure
benkay: i want types
pankkake: I haven't tried haskell at all but it's definitively on my list of things to try out - perhaps the only one actually
pankkake: many companies say that, when the reality is that their code is YOLO style
kakobrekla: not with haskell though.
benkay: jvm issues are unless i miss my read (which is possible and do correct me plz) along the lines of 'don't let people have access to your box and don't run java as a consumer'
benkay: big old .45 that always wants to point at your foot
pankkake: it doesn't seem especially related to clojure
benkay: which i guess some people don't think about?
benkay: other major points are "don't allow users to see each others data!"
benkay: <Mats_cd03> benkay: http://www.lispcast.com/clojure-web-security // i read that quite a while ago. a few kinda boil down to 'don't be retarded'.
jurov: !up tris
pankkake: or as a way to reduce the hipster population
Apocalyptic: pankkake, to give them ad gifts ?
pankkake: exploding macbooks, now that's something I'd like
jurov: and power density of TNT
fluffypony: yay WWDC time, I'm hoping for a Macbook Pro Retina that is the size of a Macbook Air and has 20 hour battery life
jurov is waiting for the eventual <fluffypony> HAR HAR
nubbins`: "certainly, daniel! shall i use the bitstamp BTC/GHS rate?"
fluffypony: nubbins`: ah yes, "siri, pay the cab driver 0.005 BTC"
assbot: Inside the Shadowy World of High-Speed Tennis Betting | FiveThirtyEight
nubbins`: he's using his phone's voice recognition capabilities to make the transaction
assbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
fluffypony: plus everyone is so familiar with mobile apps that it just makes sense
fluffypony: yes, and the other 10% own an Android device
nubbins`: they say that something like 90% of africans own an iphone
fluffypony: also if I see another post that is by an American about how Africa is ready for Bitcoin I'm going to stab them in the face
kakobrekla: possibly, i uninstalled half of the server by mistake.
nubbins`: "hey guise i'm the first hand-blown glass satanist dildo shop in the WORLD to accept bitcoin!"
nubbins`: nobody cares about that
fluffypony: but atm I'm not convinced either party particularly cares about all the ranting on /r/bitcoin
fluffypony: I'm sure that at some point in the future they'll let you fund your iTunes account with Bitcoin
nubbins`: well, they sorta fixed that around the time the smurfs game came out
fluffypony: can you imagine - someone will be like "someone broke into my phone with my pin code and stole my bitcoin, I'm going to sue apple"
fluffypony: nubbins`: yeah, I think they may also want to avoid the issue they've had with kids spending thousands on in-app purchases
nubbins`: they'll allow bitcoin apps if/when the point is reached where idiots can use it without saying "???"
nubbins`: consider that as far as feature implementation goes, apple is relatively conservative
nubbins`: "Today Apple makes an OS announcement --- I say we flood social media & news with questions about why they are anti-tech & anti Bitcoin"
nubbins`: vet says "je préfère parler en français au téléphone"
nubbins`: then later telephoned the vet to discuss the particulars
nubbins`: had a consultation with the vet, chose a nice model
nubbins`: so pascale had this dream last night where she decided that she'd like to get a large dick sewn onto our female cat
jurov: no issue with that :)
asciilifeform: jurov: plus, ferroresonant monster gets 25+ years of lifetime, vs. the laughable 3 or 4 modern semiconductor-based ups is good for.
asciilifeform: jurov: 'online' ups was costly last i priced it (for 1kW+. the tiny things are worthless in my setup) and rather inefficient (~60%)
asciilifeform: jurov: the 200ms figure was taken from actual measurement of an ancient ups i owned several years ago. i can easily believe 4ms with solid-state relays, in modern unit. still does nothing against small transients.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 2.19831909 BTC to 9`141 shares, 24049 satoshi per share
nubbins`: thanks for the tip!
gribble: #20672 Mon Jun 2 11:57:18 2014 nubbins` SELL 1.0 OFFICIAL #bitcoin-assets t-shirt @ 0.03981 BTC (Worldwide shipping included. Optional '#bitcoin-assets / freenode' text on back. http://imgur.com/jmcSFTx)
assbot: imgur: the simple 404 page
nubbins`: ;;sell 1.0 "OFFICIAL #bitcoin-assets t-shirt" @ 25/{bitstampask} BTC "Worldwide shipping included. Optional '#bitcoin-assets / freenode' text on back. http://imgur.com/jmcSFTx" ☟︎
assbot: imgur: the simple 404 page
nubbins`: ;;sell 1.0 OFFICIAL #bitcoin-assets t-shirt @ 25/{bitstampask} BTC "Worldwide shipping included. Optional '#bitcoin-assets / freenode' text on back. http://imgur.com/jmcSFTx"
gribble: Error: No orders found to remove. Try the 'view' command to view your open orders.
nubbins`: can i do that
danielpbarron: if payment is expected in BTC, it might make more sense to put the "otherthing" quantity in as "25/{bitstampask}"