log☇︎
7400+ entries in 0.069s
mircea_popescu: meanwhile, some installs incorectly config'd (ancient ?) eat a tags
mircea_popescu: i dunno that it's a bug, just don't leave < floating around.
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-23#1930405 << his comment box eats less-than/greater-than signs as 'unclosed htm tags'. which i also observed on mircea_popescu's www, i think it is ancient wp bug (of the 'no one wants to fix' sort, it'd require a 2-pass parser)
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-23 05:37:59 spyked: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930228 <-- until I get proper patches published, here's an idea: 1. abolish "ping-thread" from ircbot; 2. instead, set up a ping handler for the bot, and have it respond with pong; this has the disadvantage that there's no more lag tracking, but it's simpler. proof-of-concept patch: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/LohMF/?raw=true
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i think trinque & ben also walked in with this, given as they used a heathen 'cl-irc' lib for some reason (thinking, i suspect, 'irc, grrr, gnarly to implement' )
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-23 04:49:37 mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930229 << you ever saw a ratchet work ?
asciilifeform: or for that matter , the function calls. e.g. #'start-ring/2 . dafuq, if it's a sexpr, it ~knows already~ that it needs the 'start-ring' that eats 2 args , not 1, not 3, not 17
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-23 05:56:34 spyked: upstack re erlang: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930095 <-- imho doesn't sound bad at all, given that e.g. feedbot threads communicate exactly through this type of message queue. meanwhile, I notice that there's a "lisp-flavoured erlang" dialect on teh interwebz, but no idea if worth looking into it
billymg: re: blog work, i'm about to head out for the weekend, back early next week. i'll be able to bang out some more test coverage based on mircea_popescu's spec on the trip and put together a status/roadmap post when i get back
diana_coman: feedbot is extremely useful to track all the comments + posts, basically I switched all to it and it's working great so far; there was the deluge of the after-break stuff coming in today but it's not a big issue (and it didn't choke on it either so all good)
mircea_popescu: ahh, feedbot conveniently pointed to me diana_coman 's comment. this thing is so fucking useful, making me look like a cyborg
mircea_popescu: can be extended a thousand times, and then broken.
mircea_popescu: that's why nobody has a working system : 1. any meaningful interpretation of "categories" reduces to "tags", so even though implementations give "the choice" it is a dud choice ; and 2. any meaningful implementation of tags requires they change with the blog, whereas every implementation presumes to enter them at the time of publishing (which coincidentally but harmfully overlaps with the "don't alter history" imperative)
diana_coman: they do, as they reflect the material put in; but I don't see a problem with a third person deciding to categorize trilema with whatever tags they think greatest and provide the resulting tags + links as their view of it, what
diana_coman: I would start with something rather simple indeed; and review it, initially it's really a sort of learning wtf in there because I have no idea atm how useful the tags produced would be
mircea_popescu: imo a correct tagging mechanism is the one item missing from http://trilema.com/2019/what-is-a-blog-complete-spec-inside/
mircea_popescu: on one hand, something simple like "tag each article with the 12 most frequently occuring live words over 3 characters long ; keep a central list of "dead" words that occur in more than x% of articles, re-tag all articles tagged with one of the words there"
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: I do; and a few other bits that are on the list to change but on which I kept thinking "there will be a mp-wp theme" and then can tweak; hm, who was it, billymg ?
mircea_popescu: lol. kinda the purpose of a good rand
diana_coman: hm, I *do* remember the idea but not having properly ranted on it (granted, I tend to forget it if I have a good rant over it, lol)
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, srlsy ? the core of the argument was that google lists a supposed number of results, in the bns, but it never disgorges any significant count
spyked: upstack re erlang: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930095 <-- imho doesn't sound bad at all, given that e.g. feedbot threads communicate exactly through this type of message queue. meanwhile, I notice that there's a "lisp-flavoured erlang" dialect on teh interwebz, but no idea if worth looking into it
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-22 23:59:49 trinque: if I'm going to bolt znc to it, what point has a lisp bot?
mircea_popescu: make yourself a spyked-genesises-stolen-crap sig, use that.
mircea_popescu: this understanding is current as of cca 2016. meanwhile we agreed that because a) it is preferrable to work with republican rather than imperial items and to prevent more imperial seepage than needed ; and because b) there's no limit to signature count as per long standing observations and discussions (with a very early asciilifeform cca 2013 maybe) then therefore the correct approach is to sign things early, to get them i
spyked: mircea_popescu, I completely agree. fwiw, I can genesis hunchentoot next thing if somebody asks for it. but would rather have the thing reviewed first, a propos of: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930229 . IMHO gotta document it, so that I don't make the same mistakes when I attempt a sane http replacement
spyked: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930228 <-- until I get proper patches published, here's an idea: 1. abolish "ping-thread" from ircbot; 2. instead, set up a ping handler for the bot, and have it respond with pong; this has the disadvantage that there's no more lag tracking, but it's simpler. proof-of-concept patch: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/LohMF/?raw=true
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-22 21:25:26 trinque: wtf lol, how would the bot spend a lot of time in the notification mechanism?
spyked: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930226 <-- to be clear, discussion was re. rss bot, which is built atop trinque's bot. I made the mistake of having a long-running operation on the main bot thread, which is the same thread that handles pongs and does lag tracking. imho the fault was 100% in the feedbot coad, but if deedbot
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-22 23:59:49 trinque: if I'm going to bolt znc to it, what point has a lisp bot?
mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930241 << rather's the case, dude watched so much seinfeld he's so very firmly committed to non-committal he'll very happily die of it just to make a point "to the world". whatevers.
mircea_popescu: The time to whine about "what it all means" etcetera is henceforth, 'till forever."
mircea_popescu: "Needless to say, I am unamused ; and, to answer the original inquiry in firmer terms containing no ifs or buts : no, I personally have no further interest in hearing what phf may have to say on any topic. The time for "ok then, I will get my logger to spec by X date and hope to have my blog up by Y date" came and went, sometime yesterday.
mircea_popescu: a a. aite.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-07-25 03:30:20 spyked: trinque, could you pl0x share the ircbot auto-reconnect code that you're testing? I wanna give it a spin myself and give some time to ironing out whatever problems I might find.
spyked: mircea_popescu, tbh I find that to be a particularly cheeky question, since I asked him the same on more than one occasion and was greeted with silence.
mircea_popescu: now help me out here. is the answer "late aug/early sept i will publish my sept workplan which'll include a date at which i intend to publish the answer to that q" ?
spyked: mircea_popescu, no. feedbot is patched upon ircbot, not genesized (as per earlier log discussion), i.e. http://thetarpit.org/posts/y05/08a-feedbot-i.html ; http://thetarpit.org/posts/y05/08b-feedbot-ii.html ; http://thetarpit.org/posts/y05/08c-feedbot-iii.html ; this was planned to be the complete code, but sure, I'm testing the changes that I made and will publish a patch for it.
mircea_popescu: so is the idea feedbot gets abandoned a la lobbes' orig bot ?
spyked: there is a longer term plan that I have at http://thetarpit.org/posts/y05/090-tmsr-work-ii.html , but experience shows that usually changes.
mircea_popescu: yes, that wasn't in discussion. but the current plan takes you to week 35, after which comes week 36 and a new plan ?
spyked: mircea_popescu, why should the output of weekly work be necessarily genesis? for now, it's a review of coad; the review will be followed by a genesis, as stated.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-22 21:48:34 trinque: the thing's literally built atop tcp which supposedly has "connections" and it wants this ping/pong mechanism atop. ask me how many more hours of my life I wish to dedicate to this duck cunt that just wants a bit more.
mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930228 << this is definitely a good q. /me goes to see on thetarpit.org, when's publishing scheduled.
mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930229 << you ever saw a ratchet work ?
mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930209 << it's likely this is because they got re-encoded on his end ; it's also the case nobody gives a shit.
asciilifeform: ^ that way dun need any locking, no async speed will ever take place during a 'pong' or a synchronous reply to command.
asciilifeform: ( if anyone wants to put async-sends in mine, the natural place to do so is imho where recv() times out, pop (nonblockingly) string from a queue and speak() . )
asciilifeform: decided in the end that it is easier to pour a cup of tea an' write one from 0, than to wade through the rubbishes
trinque: if I'm going to bolt znc to it, what point has a lisp bot?
lobbes: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930218 << 'tis mircea_popescu's chan, so his call. Though I imagine there is reason to keep them (e.g. maybe one day in the future someone wants to make a post re: "hey remember how IRC sucked?"). Point being: it was logged, so it is in the logs.
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930234 << near as i can tell , mp drilled him a new arse and consigned him to штрафбат for cowering in a cave for yr+ , rather than for sitting in hospital. ( see also mp's 'nickel' article )
asciilifeform: trinque: i cannot resist to wonder if the problem is in the hoster -- iirc deedbot used to stand up for weeks at a time , in earlier days
asciilifeform: trinque: i may be able to help w / bot ( would like a working cl bot at any rate ). how current is the published src ( that i used in pehbot ) ?
trinque: the thing's literally built atop tcp which supposedly has "connections" and it wants this ping/pong mechanism atop. ask me how many more hours of my life I wish to dedicate to this duck cunt that just wants a bit more.
trinque: wtf lol, how would the bot spend a lot of time in the notification mechanism?
asciilifeform doesn't give a damn in either direction, the archive doesn't weigh even within order of magnitude enuff to impact overall speed of indexing in any detectable way
asciilifeform: archives remaining to import : #a ( if ben_vulpes turns up, i'd like to use his mimisbrunnr log to close the gaps; otherwise will use own znc ) ; #p ( again ditto )
asciilifeform: going by informal walk via 'random' button -- that spamola is a substantial % of the archive, by mass
asciilifeform: oh hrm actually he does have a segment re subj
asciilifeform contemplates what a bvt-style dissection of the current 'urandom' might reveal.
mircea_popescu: nothing prohibits proggy reading 2mb ring buffer at gb/s speeds. it'll get... well, a lotta hashmaterial.
mircea_popescu: anyway, exactly what stretch factor to use is a bit of an open question. may be worth it to permit the thing to self-adjust, based on O read volume.
mircea_popescu: if indeed a stretch of say 8:1 is preferred, HF takes 1 byte makes 8, then the HG will work on 8byte buffers, take 8 bytes make 8 byres.
mircea_popescu: if you do, you stretch it into a "many" bytes. if you don't, you just prng those many bytes.
asciilifeform: seems to spec a somewhat diff item than originally contemplated tho ( where all userland proggies are guaranteed to get, if slowly, actual unique FG bits )
mircea_popescu: that's why the two-hash system : you either have a byte of FG, to put into O, or you don't.
asciilifeform: then i'm defo thick. let's work example ? machine booted up 5min ago. ergo primary FG buffer contains ~2MB. now i'ma a user, and i ask for dd if=/dev/random of=foo bs=1M count=3 , i.e. 3MB. nao what ?
asciilifeform: or is the idea that there's a per-user buffer which actually contains his ration, and reads block on ~that~ ?
mircea_popescu: ring buffers : Inner (small, 16kb to cpu-cache-size) ; Outer (large, 1 MB to swap partition size). each buffer has a writing head moving around it and a reading head moving around it, their position is W and R at any time.
asciilifeform: the 1st half of this , i get, is same as what i sketched. but for what is the outer buf ? seems like a single ring of same length as the 2, gives same effect ?
mircea_popescu: imo correct design is 16kb to cpu-cache-sized inner ring buffer, wherein fg material is simply written into a loop, plain ; and from where high quality entropy is read blockingly. whenever the writing head threatens to overwrite the reading head, the overwritten bits are instead fed into outer ring ☟︎
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930033 << naively seems to asciilifeform that whole thing oughta be replaced with a single ring buffer, where 1) root can write 2) users can read (w/ settable max byte/sec quota/ea. perhaps) 3) erry read consumes a segment of the buffer, i.e. no 2 users get same chunk of FG tape 4) if buffer empties, machine goes into single-user mode and rings alarm .
asciilifeform: ( for the curious : 'erlang' had 0 'shared memory' b/w threads. all inter-thread motion was in the form of messages (received in 'atomic' queues internally). these could consist of whatever -- symbols (a la lisp) , for simple 'a/b/c' cases ; strings of bits; etc. a message could be eaten, or forwarded to yet another thread, or even sent back to the sender. )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i keep coming back in my notes to the swedes, simply b/c in their notation, a 'bulletproof' net of mutually-synchronized bots is suddenly ~trivial.
asciilifeform: spyked: mine disconnects strictly when a send() or recv() actually return eggog (i.e. indicating dead tcp pipe)
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-22 07:50:22 spyked: to detail: trinque's bot has a thread that pings the irc server and does lag tracking (the lag then is: pong_response_timestamp - ping_sent_timestamp); if it detects that the lag is high, then it tries to reconnect. so when feedbot spends a lot of time in the notification loop, it doesn't receive the pong and gets disconnected.
asciilifeform: by this merciless slicing, he was able to make so that almost entire state of a program is reducible to 'which threads are alive', and thus was able to achieve interesting results
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i've a pile of'em in notebook, but generally dun like to throw in unless pertinent to thrd
asciilifeform: ( 'erlang' has a pretty martian syntax that most folx who didn't program in 'ml' or similar , dun have the digestive enzymes for )
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-11 20:36:42 asciilifeform: looked even at ancient rusty 'five nines' behemoths that apparently work , for potential dusting off a la gnat.
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930071 << the swedes had a model of programming which asciilifeform always wanted to steal, which was especially good fit for cases like this -- '9000' ultralight threads with ~0 spawn/die penalty, if you wanted to wait for an event, could spawn thread that does nuffin but ( and in turn if times out sends correct signal to
mircea_popescu: the 18. a class you quited yes
spyked: the downside is that now messages are going to arrive somewhat slower -- ISONs aren't sent too often, so as to not abuse that command; but probably not that much of a problem either way. if a user was offline for a while, then he can wait the extra minutes to receive the messages.
spyked: mircea_popescu, for PM notifications, the sender is called only when the target nick is online; to find out whether a nick is connected, it sends an ISON and waits for a reply; and on the reply handler, it (until now) tried to process the entire message queue for that nick, which... yeah, that's a really bad idea.
mircea_popescu: why doesnt the main program loop call the sender thing ONCE AT A TIME ?
spyked: to detail: trinque's bot has a thread that pings the irc server and does lag tracking (the lag then is: pong_response_timestamp - ping_sent_timestamp); if it detects that the lag is high, then it tries to reconnect. so when feedbot spends a lot of time in the notification loop, it doesn't receive the pong and gets disconnected.
spyked: grrrr, this is annoying. ftr, I set the delay knob for feedbot msg delivery to 2 seconds and it still gets disconnected for some reason. I suspect it's something other than fleanode simply disconnecting, so I will ask users who are waiting on pending PMs from feedbot to bear with me for a while.
asciilifeform: 1tb ssd btw ~100bux nao. keep pile of spares, and dun hesitate to rotate prophylactically, they're a consumable.
asciilifeform: algo -- simple, you pull the 1 that a) has nonzero write failure counter, or if none such, b) the one with highest blocks-written count .
asciilifeform: a++ pathologoanatomy
mircea_popescu: he did a pretty good job dissecting, imo
mircea_popescu: incidentally, the fucking notion of a byte-counted entropy pool is fucking ridiculous.
mircea_popescu: in any case it is obvious that using it as intended (ie, pretending fg is what the linuxtards call a "hardware random generator") is ~wasting it. i dun wanna initialize the middle 32 bytes out of anything.
lobbes: will also spin up a copy of alf's logger
lobbes: once this thing is up I'll probably be asking in #a (unless #mod6 still lives?) about doing a 'hot-start' with trb
lobbes: in other news, I'm in the process of provisioning a dedi server (for primarily a second trb node). I grabbed one with 2 512GB SSD drives. Now my question is: should I bother with RAID 1? Or will this just be stupid because they will wear at the same rate?
asciilifeform: a.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-08 16:13:35 mircea_popescu: do you realise every time i do a keyop it's ~half hour of slavegirl time going blind on asciisoup ?
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-20 22:39:42 snsabot: Logged on 2016-09-16 22:54:18 trinque: BingoBoingo: aha, in fact there was a thread where mircea_popescu explained that y'know, you teach the women things