log☇︎
636300+ entries in 0.414s
asciilifeform: this, as i understand, is why schwartz never made any attempt to raise funding
decimation: 'how much would you have to pay your enemies not to crush you in your moment of need'
decimation: yeah but it would have implications for relativity theory apparently
asciilifeform: but to even begin the kind of work it would take to 'technologize', is an investment that no one would remotely contemplate without the kind of proof that can only be obtained after his enemies were to give in.
asciilifeform: it exists - if exists - somewhere after the 8th decimal.
asciilifeform: understand that the effect in question, even if it turns out to work as herr schwartz predicted, doesn't yield an 'antigravity jetpack'
asciilifeform: (if schwartz were to be permitted to carry out his experiment, and obtained a positive result)
asciilifeform: decimation: adelberger, for example, would have to perform seppuku - and all of his students, and their students
decimation: one wonders which forgotten scientist will be recorded by history while official science is resigned to the dustbin
asciilifeform: decimation: there's also other factors.
decimation: well, mircea's theory is that musical tastes randomly change with time & entropy, the same is true for academic fashions
asciilifeform: but that'd be it.
asciilifeform: he could, potentially, upgrade to rich pariah instead of modestly wealthy pariah
asciilifeform: schwartz is one of the very few people i know of whose problem cannot be solved with money per se.
decimation: I called up NIST a few weeks ago, asked them how much it would cost to measure the phase noise of an oscillator. They said it would only cost their time, which would come to about $10k! for a morning session
asciilifeform: if i were to sell a few extra organs, i could run the 50k variant of the experiment. and i'd go to my grave knowing that equivalence principle can be violated. but that'd be all.
decimation: wow, that sucks. metrology is it's own weird little world
asciilifeform: including the set that want schwartz to die in a fire
decimation: as in, ensuring that all of the masses can be traced to some standard, etc?
asciilifeform: i recall mircea_popescu even used this tale as an example in an essay
asciilifeform: (atmosphere of controlled temperature, pressure - and, more importantly, provenance)
decimation: okay that makes sense
asciilifeform: if you want the needed accuracy - it's rather more complicated.
decimation: But according to wikipedia, it appears that the Eötvös balance is some balls, a rod, some string, and some mirrors
asciilifeform: if you want to know what test - bring schwartz out of his hidey hole, wherever it is, and ask him. he enjoys explaining it, me - it just depresses
asciilifeform: The20YearIRCloud: no need to be a con man in the usual sense to acquiesce to usg SOP.
assbot: Logged on 27-07-2014 19:05:02; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in 2010 i concocted a variant of the test that could be carried out for approx. 50k USD, from scratch. schwartz answered that, in his estimation, the test would work to spec, but results would not be accepted by the field unless carried out on one of the two existing eotvos balances. one - adelberger's, one - chicom. ☟︎
The20YearIRCloud: And harold white is a con too?
asciilifeform: decimation: we came up with a setup that didn't require eotvos balance
asciilifeform: decimation: dig the log
decimation: asciilifeform: it seems to me that an Eötvös balance would be pretty straightforward to build
The20YearIRCloud: And now, peer reviewed studies seem to come out every few months continaully supporting entanglement
asciilifeform: but the folks involved with 'emdrive' have a rich history of fraud (usg and principals both)
The20YearIRCloud: I'd have to find the papers, but 30-40 years ago it was supposed to violate several principals
asciilifeform: understand, we'd all love a working perpetuum mobile or reactionless thruster.
The20YearIRCloud: and in the case of emdrive as well, it's signfiicantly more efficient than ion drives, but not absurdly so
The20YearIRCloud: neither does the emdrive
asciilifeform: nasa is happy to fund every perpetual-motion crank on the planet - but if you're an industrial organic chemist with a history of rocking the boat - forget it.
The20YearIRCloud: And from the papers I've seen, it doesn't seem to be signfiicantly more different than the theory behind VASMIR, and NASA was all over that 15 years ago
The20YearIRCloud: It's going to JPL for testing, which is a pretty darn good sign as to it working
asciilifeform: in the sense that podkletnov's drive 'worked.'
The20YearIRCloud: Emdrive seems to work too
The20YearIRCloud: is he the emdrive guy?
asciilifeform: al schwarts published a possible recipe for room temperature supercon - afaik, it was ignored.
The20YearIRCloud: We have been very much on the upswing concerning superconductors. 50 years ago you had to be near absolute zero, now you can do it at like -200c
asciilifeform: (bonus: shoot with the battery)
decimation: I think there are some cold superconductors used in new york to move lots of electricity through tight spaces too: http://spectrum.ieee.org/energy/the-smarter-grid/superconductors-enter-commercial-utility-service
asciilifeform: room temperature supercon is a box of surprises.
asciilifeform: because there - yes, critical.
asciilifeform: heat loss in conductors isn't terribly critical << consider why virtually all present-day applications of low temperature superconductors is in high-strength magnets.
The20YearIRCloud: I'm sure that's right, but i can dream
The20YearIRCloud: Most of the data I'm seeing seems to support that once we reach that point, everyone gets their own airship
decimation: The20YearIRCloud: doubtful. in most circuitry heat loss in conductors isn't terribly critical, and it's hard to imagine said superconductors would be better/cheaper to fabricate than the metals we are discussing
The20YearIRCloud: The little bit of silver soldering I've done has been quite smooth too
The20YearIRCloud: This is of course until we discover room-temperature superconductors, then it's all off
asciilifeform: gold also solders beautifully, because the coating remains smooth
The20YearIRCloud: That's also true
decimation: gold is also used exclusively to connect pins to chip dies if I recall correctly
The20YearIRCloud: Although theoretically silver wire with gold connectors would be the bee's knees
The20YearIRCloud: gold connectors are usually large, so there's more conductivity (due to lower resistence)
The20YearIRCloud: Well, considering how little of the connection is used for the gold, it makes plenty of sense
asciilifeform: usually the absolute conductivity isn't critical. resistance to corrosion and heat conductivity - is.
decimation: gold actually has worse conductance than copper, but it doesn't oxidize
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah oxidation, terrible contacts
decimation: silver makes excellent electrical conductors though.
asciilifeform: they occasionally turn up in loose change even now.
decimation: after 'backing' your currency with relatively worthless metal, the next logical step being to 'back' it with nothing it all
decimation: yeah back in the early 1900's the whole idea of the 'silver dollar' was the precursor to the modern bezzle
asciilifeform: silver, at the time, (and largely still today) being primarily an industrial metal - the supply was already safely corralled.
The20YearIRCloud: speaking of the 30s-50s
The20YearIRCloud: In the us , gold hording could be jailable, but silver hording was encouraged
asciilifeform: (gold, rather than foreign currency, in that case, but applied across the board)
asciilifeform: khruschev turned this into a hanging offense. retroactively.
decimation: asciilifeform: brings to mind the play quoted by Mr. Yarvin where the kulak is found guilty of hording foreign currency in basement
asciilifeform: see the many stories of lotto winners who take home mazeratis and then go bankrupt
asciilifeform: other interesting thing about treasure is that, afaik, your tax liability officially begins when the shovel opens the box
The20YearIRCloud: Other than that, it's pretty easy to stay quiet, and slowly sell off the horde without signfiicant attention
asciilifeform: eventually, the soviet denouement is that all precious metal is presumed 'stolen from mint.'
The20YearIRCloud: With regards to coins, you only need to avoid the very, very limited types that are assumed to be stolen from the mint
asciilifeform: so we're no longer answering the question of what the find per se is worth, in that case.
asciilifeform: but this destroys most of the value of the find
The20YearIRCloud: The serial numbered portion is the only part essentially that's illegal
asciilifeform: to go back to the example with coins - you're probably safe if you melt them down and sell by gram
The20YearIRCloud: if they're semi autos, they can be sold to out of state
asciilifeform: if they're the real thing (full auto) - you're probably bankrupt just staying out of court
The20YearIRCloud: if they're real-deal AKs you just demill the reciever, then the rest can be sold
The20YearIRCloud: Theoretically it'd be possible to sell them in any state if you take the right steps
decimation: "Army officials say the canisters, if they exist, do not pose a threat to the affluent Spring Valley neighborhood as long as they remain undisturbed." << "it's okay for you"
The20YearIRCloud: If I find a box of AKs here in the US there's nothing to do but leap for joy
mircea_popescu: o wait, it wasn't him. it was bush that hung for this
asciilifeform: worth what? plenty. liquidate it? more likely, your organs will be sold to pay for it carted away
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ah that's where saddam was keeping his chem weapons ?
decimation: heh didn't hear about that til now http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/local/daily/jan99/mustard24.htm
decimation: or barrels of toxic waste
asciilifeform: or - to make life more interesting - let's say that you find a sealed crate of kalashes, in cosmoline, rather than coins.
asciilifeform: for instance, IANAL, but i can easily picture, e.g, a landlord, arguing 'mineral rights' on the coins.
decimation: one wonders about the potential 'laundry' being done off of such a rich stash
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: and this isn't even considering the variant with spurious lawsuits
The20YearIRCloud: heck we had a local auctioneer do one guy's coin collection, the whole collection fit on a few small tables and sold for $350k
decimation: :The so-called Saddle Ridge Hoard, made up of denominations of $5, $10 and $20, could bring in $10 million when the sale is all said and done, with several pieces expected to command prices as high as $1 million, experts say."