631700+ entries in 0.385s
fluffypony: when I graylist you
then you have
to reconnect
to me from a new peer and submit a bad block
fluffypony: well
that's what I'm saying -
the block flooding DoS doesn't work
fluffypony: if you just want
to DDoS
them from a bandwidth perspective
there are easier ways like LOIC
fluffypony: the point of
the DoS is
to burn CPU cycles and
tie up
the CPU of a peer
fluffypony: it graylists peers
that
try submit a bad block
fluffypony: it's
too aggressive in its consensus code
fluffypony: the block flooding DoS attack doesn't work with Monero, at least not
that we've been able
to simulate
mircea_popescu: fluffypony is your 5x estimate arrived at
through some process or just
taken from dga ?
mircea_popescu: " but assuming you accept its
technical
tradeoffs (slow block verification leading
to increased susceptibility
to block-flooding DoS attacks, in favor of a balance between CPU, GPU, and ASICs)" << stuff like
that sounds like a
total ouch.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo you feel like reading up on all
this crap and produce a summary ? but i mean a good one, like a disertation level
thing.
mircea_popescu: "This coin's enthusiasts contribute
to
the applied aspects of
the CryptoNote
technology. It has been launched as a fork of Bytecoin in April 2014. Bitmonero/Monero was subject
to a quarrel among
the community members on
the choice of name. Nevertheless, its contribution is valuable
to CryptoNote’s popularization. Moreover, it has
the fastest block generation speed of 1 minute."
jurov: with
the friend's miner i mean
mircea_popescu: "It is designed
to have zero commercial value since its genesis block is replaced every 2 months."
this is a pretty good way
to do it, actually.
mircea_popescu: (this based on history of human
tech,
the speed of difussion of
tech inovations as a function of
their added efficiency. for instance
the iron plow was about 7-8x more efficient
than
the shit it replaced, and it
took over practically in
the same generation. meanwhile longbows were not 2x more effectual over cataphracts, and
they
took about a century
to
take over)
fluffypony: if you're really interested in
the inner workings
mircea_popescu: but i would have suspected 1.5x ish is more
the range where it could be borne economically
mircea_popescu: and i guess if 5x is
the best so far
then it's
the best so far, and
that's what it is
mircea_popescu: i mean don't get me wrong, active experimental research in "o yeah,
those asics are
that cool ?" is quite valuable and a good use of one's
time.
fluffypony: punkman: it's not
the only
thing it uses
mircea_popescu: fluffypony but my point here is as
to market price, which really rarely reflects opex over capex
punkman: aren't
there plenty off-the-shelf hardware AES implementations?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: yes - but
that's a capex cost, we're discussing
the opex cost. At some point in
the future when
there actually are ASICs I suppose a ratio could be shown
that includes
the amortised cost of
the hardware over
time or something
mircea_popescu: that's
the problem with
the human species :
that because we're monkeys, which means we use young men as basically building material
mircea_popescu: which explains exactly
the adaptive value of idiocy in large groups.
mircea_popescu: what i mean is, i'm a kid with a computer, i have
to pay $200 for a new video card, and each watt gives me 1
thing.
this other kid pays $500 for a consumer asic, each watt gives him... 5
things.
the price of a
thing will reflect
this, going
to ~1/4
the price of a watt, making me able
to buy a lot more
things for my $200 directly
than i'd get mining ?
dub: mircea_popescu:
there's also
the problem of motivating a guy holding a stick
to charge at muskets
mircea_popescu: fluffypony: ASIC will likely outperform a GPU, but I'm guessing it will be in
the ~5x better range, not huge. << if
this is per watt, wouldn't it be quite huge ?
punkman: mircea_popescu:
that monero
thing
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mircea_popescu: punkman: I made a bitcent
trading XMR, I r
tradar nao! << dare i ask what xmr is or would
that spoil
the whole
trader
thing.
mircea_popescu: dub: where
these perchance, other primitave cultures faced with certain defeat in
the face of a
technilogically advanced imperial invasion << quite. just like
the forum retards,
the general response of
the primitive mind
to "o boy,
this guy's so much better
than you, better learn how
to suck cock" is "lalala i can't hear anything"
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo didja just drunkrate RagnarDanneskjol or what was
that
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fluffypony: the only guys in ZA
that have done anything notable are
the BitX guys, but meh
fluffypony: if it's
that guy
then he's in Switzerland
xmj: friend of mine's got a spare, doesn't know what
to do with it
assbot: I would very much enjoy reading Mircea Popescu's reply
to
the letter in
this post:
http://t.co/MndDYtNb9w < you can imagine
the SPANK!
xmj: that's, like,
the crashcourse in FreeBSD port maintainership. :)
xmj: before you submit,
try `make check-plist`
to see if
there's anything missing in pkg-plist, and `make package`
to see if
there's anything
that is in pkg-plist
that's not actually built into
the package
xmj: once you're done with
that you can assign it
to me and i'll
take it from
there
xmj: also, i maintain it, so if you find any bugs i can fix
them on
the fly...:p
xmj: it used
to have port submit, but
that died with GNATS and send-pr(1)
xmj: it has port(1), which can do `port create`, and `port
test`
fluffypony: I mean,
the USE_GITHUB stuff means
that I really only need 5 lines, and it builds out
the box
fluffypony: ok so I'm
trying
to create
the Makefile
fluffypony: 90% of
the
time when
there's a quirky PoW it's inevitably a scam
punkman: fluffypony: was reading
that blogpost again, got an idea. Someone should come up with quirky PoW, and manufacture a hardware miner before launching
the coin.
Then
they slowly ramp up
the hashrate, start selling
the hardware when profits level off.
fluffypony: oh well, even associate professors at CMU have
to make money somehow :-P
punkman: fluffypony: oooh, he was all like "back
to school" and I assumed <20
xmj goes back
to fiddling with stuff... f'realz
fluffypony: "Note
that GPUs *do* outperform CPUs, of course -- it's just
that it's only a factor of
two or
three. Which is pretty remarkable. And an ASIC will likely outperform a GPU, but I'm guessing it will be in
the ~5x better range, not huge."
xmj goes back
to fiddling with Subversion
fluffypony: oh punkman - are you
talking about dga?
fluffypony: xmj: once I'm done fixing
tests and I've committed
the changes
to master I will
punkman: are you
the guy
that funded
that kid with
the miner optimizations?
fluffypony: xmj: it's done, it compiles and works,
the only
thing I'm fighting with are some stupid oddities in
the
testing code
xmj: fluffypony: how are you getting along with
the FreeBSD port? :)
fluffypony: we're not at
the upper bound of GPU performance, although we're reasonably close
fluffypony: and in
that respect CryptoNight achieves its stated goal of reducing
the performance gap between CPUs, GPUs, and ASICs
punkman: right, aren't
the CPUs better in
that regard?
fluffypony: faster yes, but performance-per-watt is really how you want
to measure it
fluffypony: punkman: indeed - although
the GPU miners are starting
to ramp up a bit
fluffypony: bitmonero == monero,
the guy
that launched it wanted merged mining and other bullshit,
the community voted against it, he
tried
to put it in anyway, so we forked it away from him into Monero
punkman: what's with all
these clones
punkman: fluffypony:
there was some pool site
that had XMR, but it linked
to some bitmonero
thing
punkman: I made a bitcent
trading XMR, I r
tradar nao!
fluffypony: all compiles except gtest
that explodes
RagnarDanneskjol: erroneous in
that
the reasons cited have no basis in reality. but good point
BingoBoingo: RagnarDanneskjol: Much of
the present irrelevant doubt, as opposed
to relevant doubt connects
to harvest of
this irrelevant shit\
dub: where
these perchance, other primitave cultures faced with certain defeat in
the face of a
technilogically advanced imperial invasion
RagnarDanneskjol: BingoBoingo - You know for a fact I made efforts
to gain better clarity between parties from our pm earlier. All
the recruitment I have done for b-a has been out of
the kindness of my heart (which is a lot btw in
terms of
time spent - well over 60 hrs)
dub: A similar belief in
the mystical power
to avert bullets had earlier been reported among Islamic groups in Africa and Asia[7] and America, such as
the Ghost Shirt Movement.
RagnarDanneskjol: I am 33. Have been a recruiter since I was 18. what
the hell does
that have
to do with it
BingoBoingo: RagnarDanneskjol: I dunno
that you aren't
trustworthy, I apparently was lead
though (prolly by bad actors)
to believe
though
that you are much older
than you are.
RagnarDanneskjol: if you'll read
the emails I copied you on I have been quite clear - and ask if any clarification is required...crickets
BingoBoingo: That is incredibly likely.
The world is fucked. California is falling off of
the world.
BingoBoingo: I
think I understand, but I may misunderstand
BingoBoingo: No, You don't sell
things. You sell people.