log☇︎
599800+ entries in 0.39s
asciilifeform: can extract != must exist canonically in that form
asciilifeform: and do all the linux contributors sign? i do not recall this being required
undata: you can extract a nice looking patch from git, and even email it from there
asciilifeform: not plain text.
asciilifeform: well there's the answer.
decimation: but I know they discuss important patches on the kernel list
decimation: nah he wrote git to ditch bitkeeper
asciilifeform behind the times
asciilifeform: linus uses some turdolator or other
mircea_popescu: then suddenly people discover that... wait... ?!!?!?!
decimation: asciilifeform: isn't the linux kernel still done this way?
mircea_popescu: until it becames a case of "we will hang whoever made this one byte error in bash"
undata: mircea_popescu: I use the same for code review, even if it's a matter of emailing myself
mircea_popescu: "nobody could be bothered to do that"
asciilifeform: i was hoping to rationally convince people that the totality of the project ought to be the mailing list, the totality of the mailing list ought to consist of gpg-signed ascii text, and that this includes patch sets - which, collectively, add up to the product.
decimation: I think people are complaining more aboug github than git
mircea_popescu: fuck, people use email to this day to exchange code.
undata: that makes more sense. In that case yes, I could see a very simple tool for auditing, signing, then releasing
mircea_popescu: undata that's kinda why this is not the same discussion. you're thinking of the scratchpad. they're talking the exhibition.
ben_vulpes: but for releases, history of changes to bitcoin x
decimation: of course you validate the signature
undata: ben_vulpes: sure, that's a fine value, but every time someone tries to reinvent VCS, they either produce something terrible or git
mircea_popescu: without signature, there's no code.
decimation: the important part isn't the signature, it's the code
ben_vulpes: name of the game being dependency minimization.
asciilifeform: i don't actually care if he signs via hook to his toilet flush lever
mircea_popescu: similarly, you could sign via a website that has your pubkeys
mircea_popescu: well ok, it could also be sung, or whatver. anyway, the central idea here is the signing.
asciilifeform: can i 'cat' it to my line printer?
asciilifeform: pray tell what else
undata: ascii isn't the only format that's "right there for your eyes"
undata: I don't see why that's a requirement, but ok
asciilifeform: naked eye means - no tools other than apparatus capable of displaying ascii text - plus one which can verify signature.
asciilifeform: that the entirety of everything submitted by a contributor must be signed, every time, with his gpg key, and this fact be visible to the naked eye at all times
undata: asciilifeform: you're saying "what if git tainted my commit"?
mircea_popescu: i don't think you two are discussing the same discussion.
asciilifeform: why use 'git' then
asciilifeform: every time?
asciilifeform: or let 'git' do its thing
asciilifeform: who the hell cares if it's simple
undata: asciilifeform: the hidden format being the git db?
decimation: I suspect git or whatever could be hooked to operate on such patches
assbot: S.MG IPO succeeded. Other statements. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: cazalla btw shouldn't http://trilema.com/smg-ipo-succeeded-other-statements be in there ?
asciilifeform: yes, the pluses and minuses.
asciilifeform: with totality of info visible to naked eye.
mircea_popescu: assbot: Breakout Gaming Fall Short In Attempt To Raise 10,000 BTC | Qntra.net <<< they shouldn'rt feel bad, minigames didn't manage 10k either.
decimation: it's amazing that there isn't a version control system with embedded crypto signatures
mircea_popescu: ima put kako in the bash nao
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: read why and then think again. ten times.
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> forsaking version control systems entirely! << i cannot conscience this.
kakobrekla: i guess my guess is better than sexygingers
asciilifeform: ehe here we kinda do more psychiatry than psychology
kakobrekla: mircea_popescu is that verboten here?
asciilifeform: and then interrogate him.
asciilifeform: then arguably their external 'face' is the fellow in their private net who -will- talk to strangers.
kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> asciilifeform: the non-classical version strings are interesting << the first time i said ppl alter their strings ppl hgere were "oh, mp is just making shit up to win an internet argument" < i can see how someone running v0.9 would set the string to 'ducky duck' but not v0.1.
mircea_popescu: if the right person asks, they answer.
mircea_popescu: nodes can implement their own private ip allows.
asciilifeform: in what way, then?
mircea_popescu: and because of ddos, plenty of time miner doesn't rely.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: one can fudge the version string in the proggy, yes, but if you're on the network, folks can presumably connect to your node and test behaviours <<< miner doesn't have to rely
asciilifeform: if yes, could arrive at a kind of truth moment
asciilifeform: ask nodes their strings - also elementary
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: the non-classical version strings are interesting << the first time i said ppl alter their strings ppl hgere were "oh, mp is just making shit up to win an internet argument"
asciilifeform: incidentally, technically we never left 'c wrapped'
mircea_popescu: you shoulda seen the days of c wrapped.
decimation: turns out they were calling the buggy-as-hell bash then too
mircea_popescu: you think the web is insecure now, brother...
asciilifeform: patterns as first-class data type
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you may be old enough to recall the fucking relief php was back when ppl were stuck doining web-cgi
asciilifeform: it's intended to process strings << incidentally - 'SNOBOL'. i invite folks to read about it. the idea of dedicated 'string processing' languages is rather old, and has not really gone anywhere 'snobol' hadn't gone.
mircea_popescu: oh i see. meh. prolly jurov should just reg it to mess with people.
decimation: mircea_popescu: it appeals to the un crapolade
asciilifeform: (never heard of shitburial? it's when yer in a hole and they park a honeywagon, lead the pipe out, throw reverse gear, and... fill)
undata: overgrown templating language
mircea_popescu: consequently, the incredibly idiotic shit it does is concentrated
mircea_popescu: decimation no, moreover, php doesn't try to do much. literally, it's intended to process strings.
decimation: I guess php has had a 'trial by fire' as the lingua franca of web devel
kakobrekla: except not < i think you are the most common in bash say last 5 pages
mircea_popescu: no dude, php is a lot more stable than ruby bs, then the ruby crowd goes around bitching about php
decimation: I guess I thought that anything written in php was exploited to death
mircea_popescu: fucking scavenger culture. "o, nice car, is it the latest ford ? no, it's an old toyota civic with the crap thrown off"
asciilifeform: what, didja think i actually did work on it
mircea_popescu: this is getting to be more and more the way to go.
asciilifeform: nah it's just an ancient 'wordpress' with all the crapolade ruthlessly burned out
decimation: yeah I guess hosting static text is cheap
asciilifeform: reading the tale, it is easy to forget that it is about a soldier, albeit an unusual one
undata: wow, that's a quote.
asciilifeform: what's in short supply, is an 'earth' home to supply mr. wasp with containers, forged documents, etc
asciilifeform: it needs a fragile paranoia-state << these are not in any short supply
gribble: Quote by Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn : “And how we burned - Goodreads: <http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/34738-and-how-we-burned-in-the-camps-later-thinking-what>; Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn Quotes (Author of One Day in the Life of ...: <http://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/10420.Aleksandr_Solzhenitsyn>; The Gulag Archipelago - Wikiquote: (1 more message)
asciilifeform: all that 'wasp' without support can hope for, is
assbot: Logged on 18-10-2014 18:23:44; asciilifeform: thestringpuller: note that, for all the poetic license of the tale, it is very clear that wasp needs a support network.
undata: and still very relevant to Russian life
undata: still there, rotting, but not gone
thestringpuller: ^- this point should have probably been mentioned earlier
undata: "Grandpa, tuck us in and tell us ISIS wont ruin Christmas!"
undata: some guy comes along and pledges to slap our oligarchs around; after a bit economic collapse they'd eat that shit up
undata: why wouldn't I expect Americans to choose their own Putin