573200+ entries in 0.395s
badon: Man,
the Canadian coins are not very impressive compared
to
the Chinese coins.
Naphex: what about all
that work and
time wasted on building it up?
mircea_popescu: Naphex yes, but intrinsic
to what. see, when i say "kim kardashian has intrinsic value" i mean specifically,
the hole(s) in her ass.
mircea_popescu: i can't believe half
the fucking log is keyboards. you people are nuts you know
that ?
Naphex: does
the current form of
the Bitcoin Blockchain have intrinsic value (without referencing its market value)
Naphex: what i'm
trying
to ask
nubbins`: just
thought it was a nice analogy :P
badon: nubbins`:
That's
time dilation.
nubbins`: you're now moving slower
through
time because of your movement
throught space
nubbins`: and even
though your displacement
through spacetime has not changed
nubbins`: once you start moving
through space, some of your displacement is now occurring on
the x (space) axis
nubbins`: sitting where you are, all your displacement is on
the y (time) axis
nubbins`: now imagine
the y axis is
time, and
the x axis is space.
nubbins`: anyway. suppose you're walking at 5km/h, due north. all of your displacement is in
the y direction. now suppose you head northwest; you're walking
the same speed, but you're going slower in
the y direction because some of your displacement is occurring in
the x direction.
Naphex: soo.. does bitcoin - in
the current form have intrinsic value? cute question
mircea_popescu: i won't buy something high
tech
today
that has no use, because guess what ?
time flows against it.
mircea_popescu: nubbins` imo all
this "tech" stuff is a waste of
time. i might buy a computer
today because i want
to use it.
mircea_popescu: "A requirement
that all
transactions go
through regulated and
transparent administrators subject
to supervision by Australia authorities (rather
than just
the current block chain process);"
mircea_popescu: "As we have learned from
the experiences emanating from
the Mt. Gox Bitcoin exchange collapse,
the existence of a "block chain" does nothing
to allow law enforcement, other government authorities or
the public
to identify
the real identity of
the parties
to a digital currency
transaction."
nubbins`: the whole spacetime
thing finally clicked with me like,
two weeks ago, hey?
mircea_popescu: nubbins` did you kick out violent
times out of clocks by suggesting
they space out,
too ?
nubbins`: what, you don't have
to hold
time?
Naphex: so
that kinda ruins it
Naphex: but you have
to hold it
mircea_popescu: Naphex yes,
time does have intrinsic value, but backwards.
badon: mircea_popescu: You're also
too sophisticated for
that kind of
thinking (you're in bitcoin chans, afterall...)
nubbins`: badon, maybe so. i've got a handful of x-for-x coins, mostly just
the nice ones
mircea_popescu: badon im not into metals anyway, but i'd definitely buy metal rather
than you know, fashion, hype, whatever. "the sizzle"
badon: nubbins`: You're
too sophisticated for
that kind of
thinking.
Naphex: probably
the only
thing
that has intrisic value is
time :))
nubbins`: but i'd rather my $50 coin have a half-ounce of silver
than not
badon: nubbins`: Yeah, but
they aren't all
there is.
The lunars are
the original flagship series of
the China mint.
The pandas were minted for foreigners.
nubbins`: badon i do know
that chinese silver pandas are
the cream
badon: nubbins`:
The collectors are fleeing
the West. Everybody wants Chinese. Even
the Anglosphere has reduced itself
to imitating Chinese lunar coins.
nubbins`: altho
the whole "$50 for $50"
thing is neat.
badon: The coin in
the link had a metal value of over $14k. It sold for $9k.
nubbins`: it's like
the sculptors have never worked in relief before.
badon: mircea_popescu: Not
true.
mircea_popescu: nothwithstanding anecdotal success getting retarded kids
to give you
their lunch,
Naphex: is
there such a
thing as intrisic value?
badon: mircea_popescu: It's difficult
to predict which coins will be valuable, but I'm literally writing
the book on
the subject.
mircea_popescu: badon as long as you never pay more for a coin
than
the metal value you're safe enough.
nubbins`: now in
the mint's defense,
they really push
the envelope feature-wise
badon: nubbins`:
That's one reason why I like
the Chinese coins so much.
They're still producing rare coins each year, and Chinese collectors are mostly unaware of
them. Canada is not populous enough
to make a coin with a mintage of 25'000 extraordinarily valuable, but China is populous enough
to make a coin with a mintage of 100 extraordinarily valuable. Make sense?
nubbins`: if a wildlife officer came across something
that looked like
that, he'd shoot it in
the head
mircea_popescu: i don't pay for krugerands, and
those at least are historically relevant.
mircea_popescu: i wouldn't pay above
the metal for any of
them either.
nubbins`: mircea_popescu look at
the royal canadian mint for a perfect example. dozens of new designs per year, almost all of
them would be "tales from
the crypt volume 34" if
they were books
mircea_popescu: it's not unlike calling "literature"
the huge pile of us produced pulp.
badon: The CC is intended
to serve as a historical record. Much of what we know about many coins would be completely lost eventually without
the CC.
mircea_popescu: nubbins`
that's at least in my disinterested and ignorant view,
the bane of "numismatics" applied
to
things made after ww2.
badon: CC can record
them all - or at least all of
them
that are worth
the bother of recording.
nubbins`: those kialara bars are
the only mildly interesting development since 2011
nubbins`: these days, everyone and
their dog is making "physical cryptos" and
they're all
the goddamn same.
badon: nubbins`: CC data has led
to recognition by NGC and PCGS.
nubbins`: casascius coins, sure. first of
their sort.
badon: I
think physical bitcoins ought
to be collectible like any other coin.
They're historically important, despite not being "official" in any way.
badon: nubbins`: Ah, so you've had a
taste of
the nectar of numismatics :)
nubbins`: i single-handedly raised
the market price for one specimen from 1.5btc
to 15btc
badon: nubbins`: Start with a CC forum account, can you do
that?
nubbins`: badon, i've already made some progress on
that front
badon: So, if you want
to make your bitcoin collection more valuable, let's start recording data.
badon: It's actually a fundamental market principle
that information increases
the value of
the commerce.
badon: nubbins`: By
the way,
the CC (and me in general)
tends
to make coins more valuable when comprehensive information is made available about
them.
That gives you an edge.
nubbins`: badon i can't promise anything (very busy month) but if it's
there, i'm more likely
to poke at it
nubbins`: mircea_popescu i have more
than once kicked a violent drunk out of a bar by suggesting
that he leave 8)
badon: nubbins`: If you want, I can create
the project for you in
the forum, and we can do some experimenting
to get it rolling.
nubbins`: my friend, day-to-day living makes me seem
that way
badon: nubbins`:
The CC will make you seem like a genius :)
badon: The CC already has over 5000
types.
nubbins`: i'm
the closest you'll find
to an expert around here
badon: I know next
to nothing about physical Bitcoins, and honestly, I don't have
the
time
to become an expert in
them.
badon: nubbins`: Only your expertise is needed.
The CC project as a whole is led by me, and we have a professional data entry
team
to do
the grunt work.
nubbins`: there's also a guy "elianite" on
the forums who updates a casascius coin PDF with some rare specimens
nubbins`: badon i don't have much
time
to lead projects, but like i said, spotcoins is pretty much
the definitive resource
badon: nubbins`: Oooh, you're a physical bitcoin collector. People here suggested
that
the CC should
track
those, but
the CC would need someone
to lead a project
to do
that.
mircea_popescu: gernika: What aggravates me more and more recently is
the claim
that mac products are well designed, when in fact
they will destroy your hands. << mactardism is a very visual field. it doesn't account much for function.
badon: nubbins`: I'll repaste
them, one sec. I started keeping a list of examples based on mircea_popescu questions.
nubbins`: badon
they might've been lost in
the convo
badon: nubbins`: Did you see
the examples
that I pasted here earlier?
badon: It
takes lots of data, and lets you connect
the dots.