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mircea_popescu: maybe a little bit in there of racial memory. "last time this worked we did it on boats"
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> i wonder why this island/boat/w/e thing is so appelaing. << Because hell is other people, "Get off my lawn", and other sorts of dissatisfaction with the rest of the human race
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> where there is something more to do than dig own grave << Like keep one's coffin afloat
asciilifeform: where there is something more to do than dig own grave
asciilifeform: and likes to imagine that there is a place to go
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: because everybody wants to get the fuck away from the buggers
mircea_popescu: i wonder why this island/boat/w/e thing is so appelaing.
asciilifeform: you can already 'seize' a ship-sized 'island' from... the sea
decimation: perhaps in a few decades when france has collapsed sufficiently, it would be possible to seize an island from french polynesia
decimation: asciilifeform: usg owns all the islands from hawaii to midway
decimation: and you are right, the enviro-nazis who heavily influence usg want to turn it into a forest precisely to suspend all law
decimation: " It is slightly larger than Australia's Great Barrier Reef Marine Park, approximately the size of the country of Germany, and just slightly smaller than Montana."
assbot: Papahānaumokuākea Marine National Monument - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1BwRTLD )
decimation: george bush turned 2000 miles of territory west of hawaii into a forest
mircea_popescu: how to suspend laws ? o i know, turn it into a forest!!1
asciilifeform: (there is a subculture of folks who imagine that going to see somehow rids you of usg)
mircea_popescu: decimation uk fashion, this
asciilifeform: also recall the 'seastead' thread
decimation: in the case of pitcairn, it is 'self-governing' with 60 voters
mircea_popescu: you'd have to buy midway to get the 2k miles you want
asciilifeform: decimation: for all the sovereignty the 'title' of the island gets you.
mircea_popescu: here we go again with this nominalist fallacy.
decimation: how much do you think pitcairn island costs
decimation: that's not obvious to me at all
mircea_popescu: but CHEAPER THAN ISLAND
asciilifeform: could probably come up with a fab. in time...
decimation: even with bribery, it would take a very large dole and a tight organization
mircea_popescu: sorry to disappoint the settlers.
mircea_popescu: we repurpose the extant one.
asciilifeform: or one of them, anyway, where i theorized that the bulk of mining power is produced in exactly this way
asciilifeform: in fact, this is quite like the thread from my first contact with #b-a
mircea_popescu: the word bribe was in there.
asciilifeform: i can see mircea_popescu's scenario playing out -with bribery- rather than elaborate crapware
mircea_popescu: and if they don't presently...
nubbins`: now you gotta own an Iron Mountain franchise too?
mircea_popescu: decimation i'll bet you they subcontract it away
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu might imagine that the fab is a largely automatic affair, but this is not so
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not more than say for your dr. lezzie theory above.
decimation: absolutely they do
mircea_popescu: what, they do the melting down in house ?
asciilifeform: the number of not-entirely-brainless people that would have to be duped simultaneously is large.
decimation: why would they risk revealing their ip by selling dud units
mircea_popescu: decimation so ? they know it failed.
decimation: literally tens of thousands of indians/chinese are employed testing the output of each run
asciilifeform: no need to be a professional artillerist to see the absurdity of 'shoot everything that moves in the sea' hypothetical
mircea_popescu: (just, THIS lolz you're better equipped to appreciate, not being gunnery sgts or w/e)
asciilifeform: just when i didn't think that anyone could conceive of a less plausible scene than the island...
decimation: well for one thing, each and every 'run' of a modern chip requires milllions in setup fees
mircea_popescu: (and ftr, the island thing is laughable too. we're doing lolz here)
nubbins`: asciilifeform it's like a blue jeans factory, they have a "factory seconds" shop out front
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform do tell ?
mircea_popescu: decimation the plant not the boards.
decimation: wait, I thought they were 'dual use'
asciilifeform: this is laughable to anyone who can be bothered to learn even the basics of how such a plant is run.
mircea_popescu: they ARE garbage are they not.
mircea_popescu: decimation buy them for scrap ?
mircea_popescu: most of them, anyway.
decimation: how do you gain title to the 100 units to get one working one?
mircea_popescu: buy the duds, "sell them for scrap"
mircea_popescu: even better than 99% yield.
asciilifeform: and at any rate, it needs to happen N times, not 1.
mircea_popescu: decimation depends on the code.
decimation: except, the fab software in question doesn't 'fail' like a biological thing, it 'fails' like a fragile machine, as in - it doesn't work at all
nubbins`: duod the alien computers obv used compatible tech
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is about as plausible as the virus scene from the infamously bad film 'independence day'
mircea_popescu: did i ever recount the very early "special order" scam romanians got hit with ? in like 91 ?
mircea_popescu: i see it as, "elaborate virus, makes targetted fab shit out our own gear "accidentally", we buy it as tailings for pennies"
asciilifeform: and it isn't 'coders' in the sense of monkeys but actual people, who would be required.
asciilifeform: so who do i 'persuade' to replay 1970-2000 ?
mircea_popescu: the problem is no longer "where to place the fab" but "where to find coders".
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: try to recall the thread where we illustrate that the entire extant ic fab ecosystem sits on two or three winblows-only turdwares that's easily 10,000 man-years each
asciilifeform: how does this 'solve'
mircea_popescu: have them upgrade to archlinux "for their own interest".
mircea_popescu: much like un declared tyrants lose their bank accounts.
mircea_popescu: the price for trying to be "supergovernment" is that you lose your claim to title for anything you might "own"
asciilifeform: and have item fabbed on winblows tools ?
asciilifeform: and trust the product from fraud ?
mircea_popescu: rather than "build his own"
mircea_popescu: decimation the best solution to his problem would seem to me, bribing someone to defraud an existing fab
asciilifeform: objection to a hypothetical 'locale doesn't matter'
decimation: where's ascii gonna locate his fab, to be specific
mircea_popescu: what is this objection ?
asciilifeform: last i checked, there were no teleporters.
mircea_popescu: i wouldn't bother with the island.
mircea_popescu: see, if i had the magical stone that lets you turn time back FOR THE OTHERS
mircea_popescu: right. but you're in the wrong hundred.
mircea_popescu: yeah... that'll work...
mircea_popescu: this entire "i'd get an island" thing is not unlike the strange idea of the british troops to wear red.
asciilifeform: esp. not if said account lives among the folks you intend to blow up
asciilifeform: decimation: wealth as in functioning tame economy and natural resources.
decimation: it's a fair point, one would have to have a large chunk of wealth
asciilifeform: nubbins`: what a cosmographer does is even less tangible, but we owe a good chunk of early physics to them.
asciilifeform: decimation: or do you imagine that even something as basic as 'v1' can be built from dirt
nubbins`: this is hypothetical to the point of absurdity
asciilifeform: decimation: lobbing rockets, etc. is a contest of who has the largest pet economy to milk
decimation: the point is, at 2000 miles it would be infeasible to 'fire on all sides'
mircea_popescu: and what happens once some schmoe makes the 2100 mile tomahawk ? you redeclare ?
decimation: declare the surrounding 2000 miles of sea to be territorial
mircea_popescu: you have to sink the ship befroe it fires.
decimation: well, presumably if they are firing on you from every steradian you have your rights