asciilifeform: ( for what are needed these 'new syntax, ...' -- aside from 'embrace & extinguish'(tm) -- remains a mystery to asciilifeform )
asciilifeform: meanwhile, in 'wildmen attempt to tmsr' strange : 'Tauthon is a backwards-compatible fork of the Python 2.7.16 interpreter with new syntax, builtins, and libraries backported from Python 3.x. Python code and C-extensions targeting Python 2.7 or below are expected to run unmodified on Tauthon and produce the same output.'
asciilifeform: this algo does require a > 0 'the rest' tho.
asciilifeform: fwiw i'm not even convinced that the 'human mushroom' lied in the customary sense -- but instead, fungus, i.e. passed off what his bob becks gave him, as fact.
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-09#1935132 << this logic is appealing on surface, but recall that stalin ended up retrieving half-dead korolev, tupolev, et al, from gulag, when failed to find the imagined 'we dun have any irreplaceables here'(tm)(r) replacements .
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-09#1935124 << dunno re the other folx , but mine is set to 'lotto' atm, it uses fleanode's rotator. which is arguably unseemly, but i dun have a 'list of working fleanodes' atm. would like to obtain one. hence 'let's log ip'
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-09#1935119 << this is a deeper africanism than mircea_popescu suspects , and sadly not even limited to pythonisms. it comes from when hands grow out of arses, and folx write libs where the namespaces cannot be mixed, so yer stuck lib_a.foo lib_b.foo , cuz can't import a + b . seen it in adaisms , cl, elsewhere.
asciilifeform: lobbes et al : another item i neglected to add, but really oughta have, is to log the actual ip of where connects. so can actually get some ~useful data re individual fleanode endpoints.
asciilifeform: ( then in principle dun gotta make new. but oughta test. nao q , how to reproduce wedged sockets, other than by playing fleanode lotto ? )
asciilifeform: oh lobbes , prolly oughta have set SO_REUSEADDR also. loox like i did not
asciilifeform thinks 'at last, somebody finally exposed the horrid fleanode edge cases'
asciilifeform would try, but does not know how to reproduce lobbes's boojum
asciilifeform: seems like all you need is to move ' sock = socket.socket(socket.AF_INET, socket.SOCK_STREAM) ' into 'connect()' .
asciilifeform: wait mircea_popescu , why can't be done ? seems like simple fix ( tho in my simplistic 'run on lappy & yank nic cord' reconnect test, never saw the state that lobbes discovered, so never implemented 'make new socket' )
asciilifeform: + sigs for the patch, incl. asciilifeform's .
asciilifeform: achtung lobbes , diana_coman , et al : logotron www updated, nao includes latest lobbes & diana_coman contrib. errata fix . and link to new cookbook by the former.
asciilifeform: ( in which -- db slows ; requests -- queue ; bot continues to operate )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: thinking about it, it is possible that you 'got lucky' and caught the phuctor backup interval.
asciilifeform: possibly. if anyone else notices similar effect to mircea_popescu's, plox to write in. preferably with 'where/when/duration' .
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: looked for evidence of outages, but on neither dulap or own console , found any yet ( no disconnects of bot ; nor drop of shell from dulap to own chair, it's been standing for month+ )
asciilifeform: i vaguely suspected btw that all the major bugs in bot would be found in disconnect handling. piz pipe is so stable that not seen naturally-occurring disconnect yet...
asciilifeform: lobbes: there's 0 reason to 'wait for $nextpatch'. just turn errata into vpatches, folx
asciilifeform: lobbes: the max dump line limit is configurable. ( and i'ma turn the knob on mine if anyone finds the '500' inconvenient. plox to write in. )
asciilifeform: lobbes: btw dumps from 10.3 eat on 9.x w/out modification, you did not need to comment anything. (it will spit warnings but harmless. tested.)
asciilifeform: lobbes: otherwise a+++ cookbook, ty for writing.
asciilifeform: i recall when 1st time picked up a 30kg sledge hammer. 'uhh how do people work with this.' after day or 2 of driving in stakes, felt entirely ordinary.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: i can't speak for erryone, but found that ~whole of education consists in swallowing 'not likes' and ~then~ thinking. rather than how kid comes from cradle, 'i dun like, won't think'
asciilifeform: if tomorrow mircea_popescu orders 'boot me up pc in asm into sumthing i can send packets from' it'll be in a forth.
asciilifeform: possibly i did an epicly inept job in this thread. but was trying to say 'i dun like forth -- but may be condemned to it by The Essences(tm)(r)'
asciilifeform: as mircea_popescu knows full well, nuffin is 'simple' on pc. but there's degrees of bulk.
asciilifeform: sometimes the 'dun like' item is the only working tool known, to the point that if you try to redesign it from scratch, will end up with ~same thing but moar inept.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i spent ~decade e.g. knowing about ada but avoiding cuz 'dun like'. it was stupid.
asciilifeform: but 'if wishes were horses...'(tm)(r)
asciilifeform: what i wish i could do, is to catch moor and hang him upside down and connect to 220v, and get him to confess how he got vlsi fabbed w/out the 'mandatory' winblows mask liquishit.
asciilifeform: ( may in fact be the only non-winblows vlsi system currently in use , even. )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i aint about to try to persuade mircea_popescu to buy 1e6 'greenarray' or moor's cad etc. but i'm ~satisfied that it ~exists~ and worx as described, atm.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: primarily -- the intrinsic difficulty of reading. reader is stuck parsing out the ast using bare hands. it is possible to make the work easier, and i tried e.g. here . but remains painful for most folx.
asciilifeform: pact possible programming system on von neumann iron'
asciilifeform: diana_coman: asciilifeform is originally a lisp crackpot, rather than forth crackpot. forth is arguably 'polar opposite' , there is no gc, or 'raw ast' syntax, in fact no syntax in the familiar sense ( since you've studied 'peh' this summary oughta make sense. ) so best summary would be, i dun ~like~ forth, simply keep coming back to it because it appears to be the only known solution point in the domain space of 'most physically-com
asciilifeform: diana_coman: my only current use is 'peh', which is based on it. in previous times used hand-sewn forths in embedded boxen.
asciilifeform: iirc 1 of the meanwhile vanished folx ( mats? ) actually bought a 'greenarrays' board. hey mats, are you alive ? what happened to this?
asciilifeform: ^ item appears to boot as own os, on pc.
asciilifeform: poor chuck moor, apparently too sclerotic to link from own www...
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-07#1934857 << why do you suppose piz pipe, 200Mb/s costs ~1k$/mo , while in timis 1Gb/s advertised at 10 $ ? the industrial pipe can, and in fact does (lately) run at ~100% capacity for weeks on end. which is not to say that there aint scam providers which will try to throttle a customer to less than he paid. simply, piz did not suffer the misfortune of sitting under any such.
asciilifeform: fwiw i suspect the fella would be here if he weren't 90 y.o.
asciilifeform: as described'. but cannot put the src in mircea_popescu's nose to prove point.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: half of this is fair cut. moor does in fact sell chip ( and incidentally comes, unlike ~errything else on market, with full datashit ). but afaik the full src of the cad system was not published, to date. ( it's how he eats. ) so comes down to matter of heuristic, 'does exist, or is charlatan ?' based on d00d's work to date, and the published material re 'greenarray' product on sale, i'm inclined to say 'exists, worx
asciilifeform: ( 'peh', fwiw, is NOT a standard-compliant forth, i committed quite deliberately war crimes against the classical standard in order to make the parser as simple as physically possible, to make all operators weigh 1 or 2 chars )
asciilifeform: re forth -- it's cemented in ANSI X3.215 (1994--current) (1st in 1980!), ISO/IEC 15145 (1997--current) . rather like ada, dead tree standard. and quite unlike e.g. python, php. ( and unlike cl , is actually possible to program in the lang as specified in the standard. )
