35900+ entries in 0.26s
mircea_popescu: (one could object, "it's pointless to attempt this, hacked client can just replace magic string", which is true, but nevertheless client can still binary audit his item and see / login with
a special, known-good string-test-only client and see what he should be. ie, client can bootstrap himself out of the fakebox produced by
a hacked binary.
mircea_popescu: the reason for this is that games are eminently
a domain where people share binaries,
a matter of fact established both from general and minigame's own experience. obviously in the sane world of source sharing, v is the correct solution. but if people are going to share binaries, this seems like the only available approach.
mircea_popescu: now here's
a question on which i'd very much like to hear
a lordship oppinion. so, the model currently contemplated for eulora includes
a bit whereby the server has to be told by the client
a magic string, and will report this back to the client on demand, "here's what you told me you are". the idea is that the client can then sha his binary, and see if the strings match.
mircea_popescu: now subsidiary for all this : server should generate
a batch of X keys and send them to the client every time its store of either S or C X keys drops under
a certain value. it's therefore the client responsibility to make sure there's enough keys in store if it doesn't want to pay for key generation. now, what should this threshold be ? 3 ?
mircea_popescu: which then runs into the obvious problem that i had been chasing all this time : client's R key has to come earlier in the flux. how about the rule that all hello items sent to the server are either
a) encrypted to
a pre-existing X key or else b) contain
a R key ? ie, our helo is not correct as specced.
mircea_popescu: so implementations MUST keep at least
a local and
a server X key at all times ; doing otherwise is === deleting the account.
mircea_popescu: if
A fails to respond, S will close the connection, practically meaning that
A can't claim to be
A unless he keeps some X keys about. which is something
A-implementers must be aware of.
mircea_popescu: at this juncture, server knows "someone" claiming to be
A initiated
a connection. it should therefore send X(answer) back, where X uses
a key that S knows
A should have, on the basis of previous comms.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: diana_coman, this is too fluid to fix in
a comment, and i'd rather have it here than in #eulora. so : let's call eucrypt.serpent X and eucrypt.RSA-OAEP R. now, 1. client wants to log in, R(hello) -> S[erver].
spyked: aha, found nothing on hardware and software specs. mircea_popescu, if it's any similar to the calculators I had as
a kid, it might not even have any software (all calculator logic implemented using gates)
mircea_popescu: the confounding factor here is pantsuitist outlook, whereby some retard (the user) regards self as meausre of all things and imagines all vectors start from him, and therefore in his boneheaded approach to the world, "general purpose os" means something about him. it fucking doesn't,
a general purpose os isn't one joe schcmucktoe can put on
a stick and carry around and "it'll work on all computers he encounters".
spyked: mircea_popescu, I don't see
a fundamental problem with special-purpose os (which is why I mentioned "bitcoin node os" as one, though it *could* in principle be implemented as
a particular instance of
a general-purpose os). embedded hardware (e.g. requiring timing constriants) is full of them.
mircea_popescu: spyked, perhaps another useful heuristic is the authority problem. if the specification of
a user program CAN include
a MUST statement, quo warranto ? if "the os", then it is not general purpose.
mircea_popescu: spyked, cleanly ie, simplest bijective. 1. all items in
A are represented in B ; 2. all items in B have an underlying in
A ; 3. there is no simpler relation in any case.
a111: Logged on 2018-04-17 15:05 mircea_popescu: if however that os runs on
a no-op single instruction cpu, then it is absolutely general purpose.
spyked:
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-17#1800949 <-- could also be
a turing-capable cpu that exposes the instructions natively after the program is loaded. the important part was re what the os itself exposes (or not, in this case) and how this relates to "makes no assumptions about P"
☝︎ spyked: anyway, this thread put together should make for
a decent follow-up piece, i'ma get to it tomorrow.
spyked: so, taking anotehr shot at this definition:
a general-purpose os is an os that cleanly exposes hardware to user programs, without making assumptions about the latter. it's still not immediately clear to me what "cleanly" means, but this'll have to do.
ascii_lander: but this is at the cost of 'hey i'ma eat
a video card'
BingoBoingo: I just kinda forgot petrocheese was
a thing with the real stuff here
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> aite. << I have been walking alf quite
a bit here
mircea_popescu: then either phf or someone else can turn that text-only client into
a webservice.
ascii_lander: trinque: out of curiosity -- this is in
a heathen dc ? usa ?
trinque: kind of
a wonder it's working at all under these conditions
mircea_popescu: ped
a "userland package" at all points in its existence, there's no substantial difference between "the office suite" and "windows + the office suite".
mircea_popescu: the jury is still out, as far as i'm concerned, on whether the os that loses control of
a machine is still an os, meaning it's not altogether clear to me the basic-whatever combo they had at the time actually constitutes an os. but the problem FUCKING ISNT the naive perception at the time, "oh, it didn't hjave icons to click like windows 3.1". windows 3.1 was not an os ; nor was any other windows product an os. microsoft ship
mircea_popescu: (fun facts for the recently born : 1. most old zx-80 clone programs were games, whether you count by titles, or by total cpu time, or any other way ; 2. they did not return (mostly because to make
a good one you had to fuck the kernel space, that zx80 shit was tight), you pressed the reset button to load the next item on the tape.
mircea_popescu:
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-17#1800914 <<< how it manages user interfacing is not even
a consideration here. whether it returns control via pushing that specific-sounding button on the back left like the old tim-s ; or whether it has
a software call implemented is irrelevant. not from
a gui/ux perspoective, of course, but this is the fucking point of systems design as
a discipline : that it does NOT consider other discipl
☝︎ mircea_popescu: but instead, it would be
a particular-purpose os, "for those cases when the user wants the machine to not be 3 degrees from freezing".
mircea_popescu: if you modified it so it checked whether the machine temperature is within three degrees of freezing and did not expose the no-op in THAT case, then thereby it would be
a general purpose os no longer
mircea_popescu: if however that os runs on
a no-op single instruction cpu, then it is absolutely general purpose.
☟︎ a111: Logged on 2018-04-17 09:05 spyked:
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-16#1799861 <-- I dun fully grasp this, so bear with me for
a moment. suppose the following (imho no-nonsense) thought experiment: say we have an os, NOP-OS, that works as follows: after initialization, the os loads
a (user-provided) program P; the NOP-OS interface exposes to P exactly one system call, "no-op", which does nothing and returns. is then NOP-OS
a general-purpose OS? say we add another system
mircea_popescu: ascii_lander, to
a large degree who said what in early church history is
a cockularity poontest.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform's sense of wonder here has been good for the moral. Been learning quite
a bit here.
spyked:
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-16#1799861 <-- I dun fully grasp this, so bear with me for
a moment. suppose the following (imho no-nonsense) thought experiment: say we have an os, NOP-OS, that works as follows: after initialization, the os loads
a (user-provided) program P; the NOP-OS interface exposes to P exactly one system call, "no-op", which does nothing and returns. is then NOP-OS
a general-purpose OS? say we add another system
☝︎☟︎ mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-04-16 15:12 mircea_popescu: i suppose at work might be
a confusion between what-some-idiots-might-be-thinking-retroconstructed-on-the-flimsy-basis-of-how-they-behave, where "general purpose os" means "the sprinkle of magic turning the computer from
a computer to anything i want it to be, which is to say
a tool that magicvally works for any purpose i might come up with, especially the nonsensical and self-contradic
a111: Logged on 2018-04-16 15:20 mircea_popescu: the best example i can think of is the code on the old handheld calculators. THAT is
a general purpose os : it makes no assumption about the downstream, merely fully, cleanly and directly exposes the hardware.
trinque shipped
a patch that'll retry fetching the key
ckang: im not
a huge fan of tats, they look bad with time
ckang: if its on your arm however thats
a bit different...
ckang: why would you want to read
a tattoo every time you get out of the shower backwards
ckang: the reason is who sees
a tattoo the most
trinque: kendraB: so when you were getting this tattoo, how it looked in
a mirror took precedence over how it... looked as you stand there?
mircea_popescu: admitting ad absurdum that there's
a large number of nodes only knowing this set of peers.
ascii_lander: ('-connect' doesn't do quite this; it makes own node
a slave-only)
ascii_lander: there is not , in traditional trb,
a 'talk to these N nodes' mode.
ascii_lander: if
a node it tried to connect to, failed to answer, iirc it skips to
a random node from the cache
mircea_popescu: resulting in this situation where if
a large k nodes wnat to talk to the n group, each node in the n group will see k/n inbound connections on average.
mircea_popescu: not what i mean. here it is : if you have n nodes in ip
a.b.c.*, each node from outside will pick ONE
a.b.c.* node to talk to.
trinque will have
a synced node in there before long
lobbes: ascii_lander: agreed on 1) and 2), but still, as
a secondary node may as well have one than not eh?
kendraB: tattoo is such it can be read in
a mirror
esthlos: hanbot et al: my mp-wp seems borked: when trying to make
a new post, the "tab" to switch to raw HTML is greyed out and does nothing, and HTML tags are ignored. Also, the visual editing features aren't showing at all. Any ideas?
ckang: least it wasnt
a coverup
trinque: hers was
a ribbon tied up like
a present, extremely poorly done
trinque was fucking this chick for
a while, real cute, but had same-position chest tattoo
trinque apparently missed
a whole bunch of pretty ones, saw instead trucker whores on parade
ckang: i told her to get
a black marker and face but she had to run off
jaxxie: I can't find
a black one
lobbes: my current trb box I'm planning to run at home is
a mystery box someone gave me; troubleshooting all the hardware issues I keep uncovering are delaying things. Would be nice to have two eventually anyhow
ascii_lander: once i can get hold of
a bootable-sumthing that knows about the raid.
ckang: ill ping him in
a few and see if everything is okay
Melissalmao: she calls herself
a pimp but shes not like most pimps
mircea_popescu: aite, we'll see what trinque says about this when he has
a moment. in the meanwhile Melissalmao Brittt dun fret, your cents are safe.
mircea_popescu: Melissalmao, so it's not really
a pimp, more like the house mother ?
mircea_popescu: so basically it's like an arthouse/halfwayhouse w/e, there's
a bunch of you girls living together and trying to make ends meet ?
Melissalmao: it goes on until the phone stops ringing its
a hell of
a lifestyle
Melissalmao: no not really i have before but i wouldnt call myself
a raver
ascii_lander discovered that some things take
a while in orcistan: hour march to get to cable shop, plodding behind flocks of zombies, then hr back..
ascii_lander: and potentially once moar disks are brought over, can use your 'spare' box as
a staging box
trinque: diana_coman: did you want
a gentoo build?
diana_coman: it's
a pity there isn't really time now to experiment with this machine as the server has been down for long enough already, ugh;
ascii_lander: diana_coman: if you like i can even produce
a straight copy of dulap's gentoo, which you can later customize.
ascii_lander discovered that the rack in fact contains
a remotely-operable power distributor
danielpbarron: also my recipe almost certainly doesn't work anymore, but it's
a good starting point
ascii_lander is on
a battle-weary x60, dun have the bookmarksen
ascii_lander: diana_coman: i published the 'seekrit ingredient' (the use flags for banning crapola) and then danielpbarron turned it into
a proper recipe
ascii_lander: after (3) engentooation can be carried out from
a place where i dun have to sit on the floor and have back of shirt menacingly sucked into the exhaust manifold
ascii_lander: i had
a musltronic selfmade buildrootlinuxoid on pogo, it had this attribute (unsurprisingly)
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, ascii_lander anyway, i expect you'll keep each other entertained for
a spell with mg server, so.
ascii_lander: mircea_popescu: i am to understand that he has
a 100% working musltron
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron, so are you going to become the al soto v2.0 ? historically the guy did
a lot trying to get the thing online, with mixed success.
ascii_lander is on
a pingpong table in BingoBoingo's coworkery, freeloading on
a sp pronounciation lesson by very puurty venezolana chixx