342300+ entries in 0.209s
ascii_rear: the nice
thing about scheme vs. some random bozo half-lisp is
that it is an actual STANDARD
mod6: sure,
there seems
to be a bunch of power here in
this
tool - would be nice
to harness
that and make some useful stuff.
ascii_rear: but eventually we ought
to be able
to do spiffy
things like writing my memory usage grapher ~entirely in shiva~, etc
mod6: anyway, yeah, i feel like if we bring
this
thing into
the fold, i aught
to know what
the back end is doing.
ascii_rear: there is much
to be done
there, incl. reimplementing
the classical rpc hooks
mod6: rahter
than
the reverse.
mod6: i
think i wanna
try
to work from
tinyscheme/shiva -> C++ interface with bitcoind -- seems a more sane way
to figure
this
thing out.
ascii_rear: tinyscheme is
the smallest (loc and complexity-wise) schematron
that has
these necessaries.
ascii_rear: we can't actually use a scheme
that lacks
these.
mod6: was
tinyscheme a beter alt
than minischeme simply because of its size and ability
to fit in head?
ascii_rear: but reading
the code has filled me with disgust
mod6: oh, ok. was
that ever repaired? or isn't updated? i
thought I saw
the guys comment on his website
that said "until i'm dead" or something?
ascii_rear: but, 1)
there is a skull on
the patch for a reason 2)
there is not actually an alternative
to
tinyscheme.
mod6: ah. right, with
the debugging parts enabled. yeah, danger lurks.
ascii_rear: it is intended
to be a more dangerous version of existing rpc, eventually you will be able
to flip arbitrary bits in
the data structures with it
mod6: for sure, just like you wouldn't want
to expose your rpc port
to 0.0.0.0
ascii_rear: the important message here is something else,
the shiva console is not
to be considered publicly exposable in any sense
mod6: the
thing
thats a bit backwards is
trying
to learn how scheme works
through
the lens of C/C++
ascii_rear: mod6: it
took me ages
to fully grasp how
tinyscheme works. actually had
to finish sicp for
the basic mechanics of schematron
to fully fall into place in my mind.
mod6: thanks for
the pointers.
mod6: i gotta digest all of
this a bit. heheh.
mod6: i guess
that was all in scheme.h
mod6: unless im wrong about what
that was doing.
mod6: saw a lot of func pointers
that seem
to expose an interface into
the
thing
tho
ascii_rear: there is also an 'example.c' floating around on
the net
that has moar examples
mod6: i did dig
through all of
the src/shiva code
too - but since im not super cluded on scheme yet, dont quite know everything
thats going on
there.
ascii_rear: mod6:
the hacking.txt
that comes with classical
tinyscheme is helpful
mod6: <+ascii_rear> mod6: see anything
that doesn't make sense ? << not yet. was just poking
through how you load
this
thing up (in src/shiva.h|.cpp) - also looking at how
to define more operations
mircea_popescu: incidentally, speaking of config setups : 1. pick a list of
TRB nodes ; 2. add
to ifconfig, deny all others ; 3. plug eth cable, congrats, you now have a secure box. go ahead install all
the
toolbar spyware you care
to, won't matter.
assbot: Successfully updated
the rating for gernika from 1
to 1 with note: Managed
to press 99996
ascii_rear: mod6: see anything
that doesn't make sense ?
assbot: You rated user gernika on 04-Jul-2015, with a rating of 1, and supplied
these additional notes: New blood..
mod6: im digging
through
the shiva code :]
gernika: np. one of
these days I'm gonna find a bug or somethin :)
mod6: i need
to update my wot one of
these days.
mod6: congrats gernika.
thanks for
testing & reporting
mircea_popescu: and generally - for bringing internet water into
teh deserts.
mod6: ben_vulpes:
the buildroot hash is in deps/Manifest.sha512
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: cd's aren't magic, but a cd press might serve a useful purpose for distributing samizdat
that lasts.
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i'm using
trinque's experimental makefiles.
mircea_popescu: mod6 what's
the scriopt called ?
the one
that makes rotor.sh ?
ben_vulpes: ;;later
tell
trinque i may be exceptionally retarded
today, but is
there a reason why shit/Manifest.sha256 doesn't contain a hash for buildroot?
mircea_popescu: even if it usually
turns out
to have been a stupid idea/whatever, still whining in here is
the right way
to approach
teh knot.
ben_vulpes: i'm struggling
to build a cohesive mental model for
the right way
to approach
this gordian knot
mod6: i
think his 'p' or whatever
the name is, is going
to do away with
that -- least iirc.
assbot: Logged on 31-01-2016 01:03:51; BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> cd laughs at magnetic field, at electrostatic discharge, has nothing
that self-oxidates if in inert atmosphere. << Been doing cleaning and have
taken
to playing pressed cd's
that by many rights out not be playing. (not a single cd-r from mess has played yet, including a few 5+ year old "archival"
turds)
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform likes
to scream about how dumb
the keyring is
mircea_popescu: not like if
trb.buildroot pops up
tomorrow i wouldn't at least consider it.
mircea_popescu: logcially, if you're not willing
to import a guy's key, why
the fuck are you pulling his code. write your own or w/e.
mod6: i guess
that may not be horribru. ask users
to gather up pub keys, place in a separate dir other
than .wot, import
them into
temp keyring, use
them, and
then remove
the
temp keyring when finished.
mircea_popescu: i honestly dun see what
the problem is here. what is
the problem here ?
mod6: now, we could have automated
this into a
temp keyring
mod6: <+ben_vulpes> mod6: do you expect me
to have korsgaard's key in my personal keyring when running build-bitcoind-V99996K.sh? << yup,
this is how it works if we want
to verify
the buildroot package cryptographically.
mircea_popescu: for
that matter you know, bdb is also a piece of shit. and openshitmypants and so on.
mircea_popescu: and
the avenue
to fix it is also well known. wget is open source. rebase.
mircea_popescu: it's a sore spot, but it's
treated properly imo : quite clearly in
the open.
mod6: the only real way around
this is for me
to write all of
that stuff by hand.
mod6: i might regret
the notion of using wget someday, but I figured it possibly better
than writing some native code in perl
that would most likely utilize some module, or even importation of
the module directly.
mircea_popescu: museum nodes can be created as a derivative work at any
time,
they'll be as funky as pornography is. not real sex.
mircea_popescu: nodes are internet machines,
they stay on
the internet and are expected
to work safely and securely online. end of story.
mircea_popescu: well i am unaware of
this "cd based security paradigm" as anything other
than a chewing-gum and ductape concoction of no practical consequence.
assbot: Logged on 30-01-2016 18:36:47; mod6: ok, well i did just rip out all
the sync/init/mirrors parts of V
mod6: <+mircea_popescu>
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-01-2016#1390077 <<
this is a bad idea inasmuch as it leaves my build process stranded, so i'll be stuck forever using current v and i suppose forever pressing 9996
then ? << yeah, i read your comments earlier on
this. part of "battle-ready"
to me means not only
that it has lordship blessing, but it doesn't break any security paradigms
that we m
☝︎ mircea_popescu: anyway, in fairness : we had a little bit of excited & explosive growth here past coupla months, will
take a little
to digest it into proper form.
mircea_popescu: yeah. and, of course,
the code is
the standard, so just read
the script as a guide :D
mod6: yeah, cause if you don't run
the script,
then you need
to set up everything, including
the rotor, buildroot & copying around
the config, and
tons of other stuff.
mircea_popescu: mod6 well on
the
theory he didn't want
to run
the script.
ben_vulpes: ;;later
tell
trinque hey buddy looks like your makefiles depend on keys in
the personal keyring
mod6: same as
the makefiles will do.
mod6: i actually
think if you follow
the steps in
the wiki, jurov is incorrect, you don't need
to know anything about V. or download it seperately, or anything.
the script does it all for you.
mircea_popescu: and
this is generally
the way it goes. anyone wants
to "take wget out" - fine.
the path
to
this is you write your own wget, sign it and use
that.
ben_vulpes: mod6: do you expect me
to have korsgaard's key in my personal keyring when running build-bitcoind-V99996K.sh?
mircea_popescu: ideally, you go read
the whole fucking
thing, rebase and sign as your own.
☟︎☟︎ ben_vulpes: so what is
the
thing
to be done with korsgaard's key?
assbot: Logged on 30-01-2016 18:43:48; mod6: i'd like
to get
this into "battle-ready" shape once and for all.
assbot: Logged on 30-01-2016 18:36:47; mod6: ok, well i did just rip out all
the sync/init/mirrors parts of V
mod6: ofc. we'll wanna put our newb hats on and
try
the steps anyway
tho
mod6: <+danielpbarron> what needs
to be changed? just
the url
to
the .sh ? or are some of
the steps different now? << yeah, i
think
the steps are going
to be fine, other
than
the URL
to
the new script (when we finally get it deedbotted) and
the name of
the script.
BingoBoingo: Has anyone yet
tried making an alibaba shopping list for necessary equipment
to start a cd replication line?
☟︎ danielpbarron: what needs
to be changed? just
the url
to
the .sh ? or are some of
the steps different now?
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> cd laughs at magnetic field, at electrostatic discharge, has nothing
that self-oxidates if in inert atmosphere. << Been doing cleaning and have
taken
to playing pressed cd's
that by many rights out not be playing. (not a single cd-r from mess has played yet, including a few 5+ year old "archival"
turds)
☟︎