319700+ entries in 0.188s
adlai adjusts meth-lsd dosage accordingly
to reduce hallucinations
assbot: Logged on 16-03-2016 12:01:30; *: adlai is
talking about "hash bits of old blocks into
the coinbase
txn"
thestringpuller: get
the miners
to execute
themselves willingly - softfork.
adlai: aha, here's
the misunderstanding. my proposal was not a pow switch.
mircea_popescu: adlai you go about deductively showing your proposal from
the shared basis.
adlai shuts up and attends
to private matters
adlai: well what do i go on about? ultimately
the whole hard/soft
thing is a
terrible
terminology, verging on false dichotomy.
assbot: Logged on 20-10-2015 22:10:51; ascii_field: 'we'll make
trucks over five
tonnes switch sides first!'
adlai: as opposed
to "let's make our new blocks incompatible"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i dunno,
the crowning of five years of complete neglect of
the relay network ?
adlai: asciilifeform: it's an idea because it means
that
the "#b-a fork" isn't a hard-fork
that can fail.
mircea_popescu: can't make
this sorta judgements on
the basis of fucking copywriting.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller might just be boilerplate. replace "to
the public" with "on god's own earth".
adlai: thestringpuller: all
the ones
that matter
adlai: asciilifeform: we're
talking about
the same article. read what i just said, it is about
that idea.
thestringpuller: i like how bitcoin mining manufacturers don't even shy away about it: "this is
the most powerful miner available
to ~the public~" what miners are available
to
the private?
assbot: The necessary prerequisite for any change
to
the Bitcoin protocol on
Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... (
http://bit.ly/1UyPaxv )
adlai: which is possible
to launch as a miner-only fork, which nodes can choose
to enforce, but don't have
to; and
then at some later date, all nodes enforce it, and miners know
they must keep enforcing it,
too.
adlai is
talking about "hash bits of old blocks into
the coinbase
txn"
☟︎ adlai: we're probably
talking about different articles.
adlai: ie, only miners ~must~ enforce it; once nodes also do, it hardens, and
then miners can't choose
to reverse
the previously-soft fork.
mircea_popescu: i dunno wtf i shoulda done different so
this happened a week ago rather
than now.
adlai: ok, i also like
that idea, although as you said yourself, it's not fully baked yet. i also like
that it can be initially opt-in, with an ultimatum
that it gets 'hardened' by some date, if it hasn't 'softened' by
then.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform please note
that it was strictly example and not design work ready for implementation.
mircea_popescu: 2) IF miners come out with
their own fork, what do we do ?
mircea_popescu: so again : 1) ~IF~ summer/july becomes
the summer of forks, what do we do ?
adlai: of course,
this is why we have ATC
adlai: asciilifeform: "port" in
the loose sense of
the word. let's rephrase
that as "some poor code monkey should write a keccak vpatch for
trb, but nobody should ever have
to use it"
mircea_popescu: just like we [at least
theoretically/aspirationally] write code
mircea_popescu: the entire
thing was, we should
take stock of
the situation, and make some judgements and plan some plans in a complete and responsible manner.
adlai: but i don't
think
trb should initiate a fork.
adlai: mircea_popescu: hmmm. ok,
this is a valid question, my answer
to which is: port Luke-Jr's keccak reset from "classic"
to
trb, and be ready
to activate it, should a fork occur.
adlai: asciilifeform: partially, although
the market price of forkchains makes consensus crystal clear - but only in retrospect.
kakobrekla: asciilifeform apparently im accused for working for
the dark side now, somehow ?
mircea_popescu: adlai
they believe
the rewaerd havling will kill
them, which it well might ; and
they see
the opportunity with all
the core/bitcoin-xt/blabla. will
they
take it ?
adlai does not control economic consensus, nor
the miners
adlai: fwiw, i sincerely doubt miners would "let core devs decide" if
they believed "economic consensus" were against
the devs; but
this leaves open
the problem of convincing
them of
this.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla and at any point prior
to march 2016 i would have readily believed
that. now however, is simply something i can't discern.
☟︎ kakobrekla: dunno about friendship - i havent been able
to reach bitfury in years
adlai: asciilifeform: i can't find
this article. do you mean
the "necessary prerequisite" one?
mircea_popescu: adlai i'm specifically suggesting we better stop flailing emotionally and fucking
think, because
things are not going well.
mircea_popescu: in
the end, what
they did was
they sparked
through
the dielectric.
mircea_popescu: HOWEVER we didn't, because hey, maybe
they do somethign good
mircea_popescu: should have fucking killed
those derps back when
they were nobody and losing bitbet bets,
mircea_popescu: adlai wouldja
think for a moment ? if miners fork
tomorrow, pre-miner-fork
trb will not be defensible. because bitfury (you know, kakobrekla's friends) have access
to vc capital, and will bridge
the gap between us printing press and chinese mining.
adlai: there is no spoon, nor a fork.
there is a knife, and it lowers kelvin.
adlai: other
than "no fork"?
mircea_popescu: THENNNNNNN we will have no fucking good choices
to make.
adlai: mircea_popescu: you did say we may have
to choose
the lesser of
two evils
mircea_popescu: again. how is
this related
to what was being discussed ?
mircea_popescu: and how does
this relate
to what was being discussed ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well,
this'd be what i mean. capitulation what ?
adlai: yet a precise interferometer is about as feasible as a
trustworthy kyristor
thestringpuller: why open a nice school in
the ghetto, if it'll just get defaced
two weeks later?
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: i guess let
them live in ignorance as long as said ignorance doesn't interfere with
the adults?
thestringpuller: ;;later
tell asciilifeform Finally experienced
the stuck node
thing. Interesting behavior. Wouldn't even accept
the "stop" command. Had
to kill -9 it.
adlai: well if i ever meet
the guy again, i'll be sure
to
tell him mircea_popescu
thanks him for not buying his divestment.
adlai: indeed
the local rabble love
to shout, "BITCOIN ZE BARZEL"
mircea_popescu: adlai i don't see
the problem with
this objection ? "they are.
that's what i'm
telling you. you don't use greek bronze weights, do you ?"
thestringpuller: frighteningly similar
to brave new world. (give em soma and carry on)
adlai tried explaining bitcoin
to a flatmate, seven different ways. each
time explanation was met with "why can't people just use money". known idiot is now a former-flatmate.
thestringpuller: reminds me of conversation I had with CVS cashier. dude was fresh out of high school and I began explaining how banks worked cause I was furious
the ATM fees were 5 bucks in
that store. anyhow after 5 minutes of confusion cause kid didn't pay attention in school states, "I ain't
trynna
think
that hard man. I'm done with school."
adlai: but
thank you for
the blanket permission :P
adlai: meh, i spam enough myself, no need
to facilitate spamming by schroedinger's idiots.
mircea_popescu: what you shouldn't do is up known idiots, but few resist
the
temptation.
mircea_popescu: adlai you can just up unknowns,
they'll resolve it soon enough.
adlai: massiro: cool wall! sorry about
the impoliteness.