275600+ entries in 0.162s
diana_coman: mircea_popescu, absolutely; I can't compute it atm at all, not even enough
to spit out something meaningful on it
BingoBoingo: Cultural obesity is a
thing. If one gorges on Disney without exercising
their culture in
the real world,
they become morbidly something.
phf: i
think it's
the "computers for professionals"
thread all over again.
diana_coman: well, as long as it "makes"
them, it's
the same
thing
diana_coman: now you are basically in
the camp of hysterical wives with "violence in video games makes kids murderers"
diana_coman: other
than
that I don't see any link
to either immersive universes or Gandalf or
Tolkien or whatever else
diana_coman: BingoBoingo, I
think
that
teens who want
to wait for someone
to make
them special will find something
to justify it
BingoBoingo: <diana_coman> exactly because
they are not special << And
then
they
take a shit on national borders et al. Reading
this sort of immersive universe is exactly how awkward
teens become bornies/aspies/et al because
they can wait for Gandalf
to make
them different and interesting.
mircea_popescu: diana_coman you know
that medieval "for lack of a nail"
thing ?
☟︎ mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo wouldjha stop
trolling
them
this is 101 class go
to 205 and bother
the
twentysomethings!
BingoBoingo: Why did
the midgets alternately love/despise gandalf with no middle ground if he wasn't special.
diana_coman: what point?
that hobbits were special?
they are meant
to be exactly not-special,
that's why I suspect BingoBoingo perceives
them as boring in
the first place
mircea_popescu: if you don't, it may seem neutral. it isn't neutral, not anymore
than
the glass fish on
the milieu.
mircea_popescu: maybe you do or maybe you don't knbow
the kitsch victorian xtianity
that yielded
the special midgets.
BingoBoingo: Sauron seems like
Tolkien wrote him pretty special.
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: What, wizards don't get
to count?
diana_coman: uhm, what worlds where people are special BingoBoingo ? as far as I know
Tolkien's point was quite
the opposite of
this really
BingoBoingo: Seriously fucking midgets with hairy feet are special, because
their boring makes
then determined?
mircea_popescu: if you disbelieve
this, go, bring
the prime number
that's even.
mircea_popescu: believe it or not,
there's nothing substantially wrong with
the statement "no prime number is even"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it is upon you
to bring
the exception, rather
than complain of
the form of
the universal.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> nothing wrong with
this, EXCEPT it comes with instructions, and
the instructions include "how
to castrate yourself with your new lego set" <<
This does seem like
Tolkien/Lewis/Rowling et al. Pretty much made
to
turn people into apies with "worlds where people are special but fucking doesn't exist"
mircea_popescu: phf allow me
to quote
to you from modern
tolkien : "The heir apparent, Crown Prince Maha Vajiralongkorn, is poorly regarded in
Thailand and
the succession has clouded
the brows of not only
the
Thai political elite, but
the
Thai people, who believe a period of substantial instability will follow
the King's death"
☟︎ mircea_popescu: diana_coman was mostly directed at
teh boys, who never read literary criticism in
their lyf.
mircea_popescu: nothing wrong with
this, EXCEPT it comes with instructions, and
the instructions include "how
to castrate yourself with your new lego set"
phf: well,
tolkien ~is~ a construction set, but
that's its whole point, it's just a very elaborate construction set.
diana_coman: I don't follow where
the magical artefact came from; fwiw I fully agree
that a book's a mechanism,
true; I still can't fully grasp where you say
this particular mechanism is broken/not even one ; I'll go
through
the old
threads again, maybe I get it
mircea_popescu: how
the fuck is it
that english doesn't EVEN HAVE
the word
that describes its literature, ie, a rata, ratare ?
mircea_popescu: if it's famous it gets "famous"
translator, who's a writer ratee, who
then fills
the corpse with his own crabs. gives appearance of life, movement at least.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform
this is generally indicative of subject matter without object point.
mircea_popescu: granted
the attendance is not much
trained in
this weird arcana, so we'll not dispose
the matter on
the spot. but still, worth
thinking of. a book's a mechanism, like any other, not some sort of magical artefact.
mircea_popescu: and phf did
the mnost
that can earnestly be done, above.
mircea_popescu: i said, actually, bring out a class, a function, a fucking data
type, ANYTHING,
that'd show
this kid can program.
diana_coman: so basically
that's what you are asking for:
translate
tolkien for me so
that I can see what is worth in
there for in
the current language I can't see it
mircea_popescu: ~obviously~ you could
translate, if
that were
the matter, "oh
they brought him
tolkien in islandic and he doesn't read
that"
mircea_popescu: that's where
the simile breaks down, i even read arabic.
diana_coman: thing is: if you give gcc some python code, it won't be bothered
to read it
mircea_popescu: you
think what gcc can and can't be bothered
to read has
to do with bugs in gcc ?
mircea_popescu: diana_coman
this is not
true, for i am not people. i am a scholar, and when i spit an error
the problem's
the code not
the compiler.
mircea_popescu: phf no argument
there. he can be
the president of
the oxford medieval reenaction society and organise medieval faires. i'd go, with
the chicks
topless,
they'd kick me out, all nice and good.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu,
thing is
that what people can or cannot be bothered
to read has
to do with
them, not with what is written really; so it's kind of circular: he writes "crud" because I can't be bothered
to read it
phf: tolkien is not literature
though, it's more like an oxford style set of artifacts (epics, linguistic analysis, chronicles, etc.).
the interesting part of
tolkien is
that he invented a universe and described it
through same set of
tools he would describe historical past.
the sex part is on point, because stodgy british professor, he views his imaginary world
through same dodgy prism he views historical past.
mircea_popescu: hey, it was a meal. a man without a meal is liable
to do shocking
things for
the $50.
BingoBoingo: I remember
the 10 BTC at
the
time which
traded for ~$50
mircea_popescu: someone shjould ask him what ever happened
to
those 10 btc he broke blockchain.info
to
trace
mircea_popescu: one doesn't get out of literary criticism just by writing A LOT of crud people can't be bothered
to read
through.
phf: i
thought
the objection was, not enough fucking
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not what was said ; also review
the compiler point above.
mircea_popescu: adlai does it sound
to you more alike "democratic" or more alike "national socialistiche" ?
mircea_popescu: otherwise
this position is much like "but
teach, you can't score me on my program UNTIL IT FINISHES COMPILING!!1"
mircea_popescu: i have read
the book.
to my standard of reading a book, which does include
throw it away on its own merits.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform (the french point, for ease of following : at
the
time james was king.
the king of scotland. scotland was,
throughout, and recognised at
the
time, a french outpost in
the islands. shakespeare's own henry says as much.)
mircea_popescu: diana_coman not merely. but
that he never
tackled any problems.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-02 15:30 mircea_popescu: iirc
the army
training is more along
the lines of "if your mate looks like he's going
to become a prisoner, shoot
them"
diana_coman: asciilifeform was faster
than me on
tolkien; it sounds
to me
that mircea_popescu's objection
to
Tolkien is
that he did not
tackle
the right problem(s)
mircea_popescu: in any case -
this should prove it's not ETHNIC allergy.
mircea_popescu: eventually
they decided
to go with
the dutch, and it
turns out
the dutch weren't anything but hayfire.
mircea_popescu: was a brief
time in english history
they were owned by
the french, and it showed.
mircea_popescu: so i say "this man never amounted
to anything" and you say "but he is rich" and i say "and it doesn't matter"
mircea_popescu: his characters don't fuck properly. read it side
to side with, say,
the decameron. ALSO an archeologist and whatnot. but one with
things
to say.
mircea_popescu: that's english culture, always was, will stay
that way.
mircea_popescu: he is, if you wish a metaphor, in
the position of
the old scottish lord with a nice big castle and ample fields, sitting alone without offspring, without
the possibility of offspring, disinterested in
the world, waiting
to die.
mircea_popescu: he comes from a dead culture. a culture which was never interesting
to begin with.
mircea_popescu: yes, but i specifically disclaimed
the argument as
to craft. yes,
the man is a crafty writer, archeologist, etc. put in
the work. hard work. intelligently. yes.
mircea_popescu also can't normally remember people's names.
the people in question flatter
themselves with
the idea
this is a fault of mine.
mircea_popescu: i for
the life of me can't distinguish
them, and
this is never a good sign.
diana_coman: don't know where he is on
that, but harry potter is a shit from what I saw and no way
to compare it
to
tolkien
diana_coman: I'm with asciilifeform on
this one re
Tolkien
mircea_popescu: i can't help it, for all my patience i can't read ANYTHING integrally. some
things annoy.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform
their characters don't fuck properly. yes, good, as in crafty writer. still has nothing
to say besides "god save
the queen"