272100+ entries in 2.068s
mircea_popescu: being
a pseudo-ceo of
a pseudo-corp which does
a kickstarter thing, you are
a whatever, etsy service representative.
mircea_popescu: in short, being an actual ceo of an actual corp which does an actual ipo, you are
a professional.
mircea_popescu: an ipo is more like, i am
a carpenter, give me money to carpent. the investor has no recourse as to whether the carpenter buys
a hammer or
a saw,
mircea_popescu: right, but that's more like
a "daddy, gimme some dough to buy beer" sort of venue
mike_c: kickstarter is
a lot like btc bizness. 99:1 bullshit but there are some gems.
mircea_popescu: you're basically proceeding into some sort of glbse/kickfunder extrapolation as if it were
a thing
KRS1: I must be out of my mind for thinking logically here and believing an IPO and
a business plan should work together to do exactly what they fucking say they are going to do.
kakobrekla: KRS1
a bunch of companies have
a bunch of people dealing nothing but with FX risks
mike_c: yes, it doesn't show. but that's the point. you don't necessarily have to spend
a lot to make progress.
ThickAsThieves: like if S.MG has
a fiat expense, what, youre gonna rob shareholders?
mike_c: ThickAsThieves:
a btc-funded op should spend its money to make more bitcoin. like to bankroll just-dice.
ThickAsThieves: what specifically IS your recommendation on how
a bitcoin-funded op spends
mircea_popescu: KRS1 well sure. but in principle, yeah, if you don't trust
a unit of account it's saner for you not to hold it at all
ThickAsThieves: maybe this could be the first charge of the Bitcoin Republik, we make
a 100% Pure Bitcoin badge
KRS1: mice_c: Investment funds are requested using an IPO based on
a business plan. If you never execute it and expecting your capital to fund the business, thats
a big problem.
mike_c: around we go. what is wrong with it is that in
a year that company will be worth $200 and the bitcoins it raised will be worth $2,000
mircea_popescu: KRS1 that you don't want to buy
a house on fire at the list price.
ThickAsThieves: before i found bitcoin that was the plan
a label called Thick As Thieves
KRS1: So if we all invest in
a company that needs $100 dollars, using bitcoin, as long as the $100 dollar investment goal has been reached, what is wrong with executing the rest of the business operations?
mircea_popescu: if people were actually willing to pay for music this may be
a brilliant idea.
mike_c: krs1, wait
a year. the clubhouse will have an enitrely different population.
mike_c: as opposed to the investors in the company that DID keep buying coal and lost
a shitload of money
mircea_popescu: they just open
a new coal mine. this coal mine is larger than any one on earth, and close to your plant.
ThickAsThieves: you might even say that investing in
a specifically bitcoin-industry business exacerbates this problem
mircea_popescu: KRS1 ok, forget bitcoin for
a moment, cause this is perhaps throwing you.
pankkake: "HKCex will also allow customers to use deposit and withdraw funds to credit cards using
a PayPal gateway" interesting. no dogecoins though
KRS1: Right, and thats what I'm having
a problem with.
KRS1: So
a bitcoin IPO is very different than fiat IPO?
mircea_popescu: KRS1 yes. the company, once capitalised, has
a fiduciary duty to deploy capital efficiently.
mircea_popescu: in general
a share placement capitalises the corp. that capital is then deployed.
KRS1: Companies typically launch an IPO to raise funds, along with
a business plan, to bring
a particular product or service to market with the intent on making
a profit. Why shouldn't
a company raise funds for X amount of BTC, cash it in for fiat? According to the business plan, the investment should request $X dollars for Y project. As long as the funds are matched, and everything falls
mircea_popescu: KRS1 but you gotta form
a question/challenge of som sort
pankkake: the guy is
a law student according to his other posts
ozbot: i wiil give cryptsy
a sugestion since withdrawal delay so much
mircea_popescu: no actually it's been quite
a pleasant read, and you have good points well stated.
mircea_popescu: Much of the noise in the liberal American internet revolves around making people feel good by talking about things they think are bad and raising the consciousness in
a futile quest to change the world by talking. There are hugely diminishing returns to raising consciousness (even assuming the ideas you're promulgating aren't of the rankest communist origin). << this.
ThickAsThieves: no, Altcoin will be the clear winner because it actually serves
a purpose: to clean up the ridiculous altcoin market so everyone can relax, focus on one, and become rich just like early bitcoin adopters!
kakobrekla: btw if someone wants to do it, primecoin fork with
a finite coinbase should do better than most of alts outthere imho
mircea_popescu: yet the "community" and it's "press" fails to print in two inch letters "Hey! We have
a guy here that's two years smarter than the best of the USG. That's why you're fucked."
ThickAsThieves: incidentally that is one of my ideas for
a blog title "So Meta"
mircea_popescu: "The Ethereum wiki runs Mediawiki,
a tool that seemingly lacks any sort of page indexing, leaving me no choice but to look at all recent changes to all pages for the past thirty days to even get an idea of the scope of writing that's been put into the project." << benkay does this, then complains about forum.
mircea_popescu: "Humans inevitably want to be
a part of
a thing. Mostly they want to be led into glorious battle by strong men, but since men no longer lead and battle is not
a thing, humans now coalesce into writhing, headless balls of worms in the traditional socialist style of leaderless leadership."
mircea_popescu: "Vitalik understands growth hacking, and got himself
a landing page. It's got that modern, professional, single-pagey look the kids all love, and takes in emails. There's even
a countdown to the Revolution beginning, although it's entirely opaque as to what precisely is Revolving other than Satoshi in his grave."
ThickAsThieves: indeed, TSLA did not actually become $20 more valuable in
a few days
mircea_popescu: think about it. you wanna buy
a house. you do dd. that's
a week if you're mercury himself.
mircea_popescu: you can't run corps on
a two week horizon. just getting
a sale throguh is longer than that.
the20year: The only hope that I have looking forward, the reason investors back us is because our company can arbitage low interest rates in fiat to then repay them in
a manner that *hopefully* will outpace bitcoin
mike_c: the20year: you are turning bitcoin into $, which i think is
a bad idea.
benkay: well someday when i'm endowed with
a reasonable amount of capital i'll pay someone to fix it
KRS1: Thats
a great article and really "hit home" with me.
benkay: how is that
a bad bet?
mike_c: KRS1: yeah, that's the point. don't invest in
a company that is going to use the funds for R&D or have fiat-based returns.
mircea_popescu: yeah, until people start doing this, after which there will be
a 5% fucking fee.
KRS1: Because like the article states, "At what point over the last two years would [actually using the money] have been
a good idea?"
kakobrekla: or make
a rejected proposition and fund that
mircea_popescu: let us rejoice we still live in
a time when it's humanly possible, and it doesn't even take
a full year
mircea_popescu: tbh making this list, by hand, would be the qualification for being
a bitcoin financial analyst. this is the certificate, like in the old days of the guilds,
mircea_popescu: anyway, the true value one receives from completing this monstrous task is attaining
a knowledge equal only to the gods themselves.
benkay: that's not
a canonical list though, right? there are other 'security' trading operations not reporting trades in -assets-trades, correct?
kakobrekla: you know, bitcoin means "to be
a horse" in slovene
dub: I've got
a buddy who owns racehorses actually.. hmm
dub: actually not
a bad model
dub: I had
a peice of that
dub: two lasts iirc so it went off to be
a trail^Wglue horse
kakobrekla: i wonder if that horse ever saw
a stable
mike_c: [SATOSHISDAEMON.HORSE] must have been
a winner
mike_c: well if you want
a fiat CD i'm pretty sure those are available..
mike_c: you mean you want
a bitcoin CD?
KRS1: That sucks. I'd rather invest fiat in
a company for non variable returns.
kakobrekla: (mind if he would be
a month late, it would be the month that otc died)
mircea_popescu: "This creation of
a new city, piled on top of the massive tribute owed to the Persians, as well as the necessary donative to the army to secure its acceptance of his accession, meant Philip was desperately short of money. To pay for it, he ruthlessly increased levels of taxation, while at the same time he ceased paying subsidies to the tribes north of the Danube that were vital for keeping the peace on the frontiers."