260900+ entries in 0.165s
trinque: lets dance around everywhere because we don't understand how actual payments occur in
the world, and are used
to criticizing
the ass-clowns in
the bitcoin space.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 03:20 mircea_popescu:
this is a poor criteria.
there's little relation between fee and sense as it currently stands. i can send
tiny payments with no fee because of coinbase age.
mircea_popescu: deedbot is intended
to have a wallet so i can deposit a whole btc with it and
then pay it a little bit whenever rather
than have
to send multiple
transactions.
THIS particular aspect of "microtransactions" is rather opposite
to
the common conception
thereof.
trinque: what in
the fuck does
that have
to do with how many
transactions
they process
thestringpuller: iirc first data was bought by someone for debt and for many years was used as a
tax writeoff since it delcared 0 profit
trinque: the number of
transactions not
the damned unit
mircea_popescu: the only problem here asciilifeform is
that you have a firm opinion about an item you've not bothered
to understand ; and
the opinion is spit-glued on what may be
the effigy of a live hyena except it;'s a stone gargoyle.
trinque: you realize first data does 2tn/yr in
transactions ?
trinque: you know, *paying for
things* solves a great deal of
the world's got-something-for-showing-up problems
trinque: "below
this amount is not worth it so sez guy on internet"
mircea_popescu: this is a poor criteria.
there's little relation between fee and sense as it currently stands. i can send
tiny payments with no fee because of coinbase age.
☟︎ trinque is still writing response
to earlier question, but who are you
to say what
the price of anything is?
mircea_popescu: mortar is not defined by
that criteria.
there is cannon with narrower ratio
than mortar.
thestringpuller: i see
this as a deframentation problem
than anythin (hence why i also consolidate inputs in an address before
they become dust)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform less
than
the price of a working nuclear submarine with all
the
trims.
thestringpuller: trinque: kind off
target for my point.
throwing change at someone for any purpose
tends
to devolve into spam.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 02:58 mircea_popescu: what
the fuck's one
to do ?
there's a major difference between "all
these people running around blathering about how bitcoin will change
the world of starbucks are idiots" and "micropayments are evil". even
though at
the
time a bunch of idiots run around like
they run
the place,
the difference is negligible.
mircea_popescu: in any case, just
think how cool it'd have been if i could have paid all
these eulora noobs getting bitcents via bot directly.
trinque: one of
the coolest
things here is
that
the wallet can guarantee someone shall be paid
trinque: mircea_popescu knows better
than anyone here
that bitcoin did not cancel derived instruments of value.
mircea_popescu: eulora provides a convenient way
to do
this ; but
there's no rule one gotta use
THAT particular solution.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller
the whole point is
that if i want
to pay deedbot 100 satoshi for whatever, i'd rather have
this as an offchain
txn
than as a blockchain spam
tx
trinque: with a one megabyte block
to serve
the whole world's 10min of
txn, your groceries *are* a fucking micropayment.
mircea_popescu: moreover, nobody said
the deedbot wallet is
to be restricted
to micropayments.
that's obviously
the angle
to solve, from an engineering pov ; but
to
then on
that infer
that it is ONLY for such is silly.
jhvh1: thestringpuller:
The operation succeeded.
thestringpuller: !~later
tell
tell pete_dushenski I have a car dilemma. I can't figure out what model Cadillac
this is. If I send you pics could you decipher?
thestringpuller: ;;later
tell pete_dushenski I have a car dilemma. I can't figure out what model Cadillac
this is. If I send you pics could you decipher?
mircea_popescu: anyway. for one
thing -
transaction fees are micropayments ; like it or not,
that's what
they are, in
the exact sense contemplated for deedbot.
mircea_popescu: but in any case
the same
tongue
that licked
tcp/ip also licked all of washington dc, not
to mention etc.
mircea_popescu: you'd expect he'd be unable
to get out of bed. i guess
there's missing ingredients in
the formula.
mircea_popescu: it's a wonder actually,
that alf's personal antigens of 1.(the usg is in all
things - in his personal flavour of
this) + 2.(if you lick my lunch i will starve
today) don't completely preclude any action whatsoever.
☟︎ trinque: satan
touched
this; it is infected.
trinque: there's another
thing in
there
too, appropriately subtle. idiot
taint, or something.
trinque: people eventually find out
that perhaps
the reasons
they agreed were different!
mircea_popescu: amusingly enough,
this is exactly work hardening for social groups ; and for
that matter how parties are born.
mircea_popescu: seems a significant chunk of disputes arise from misapprehension rather
than a genuine difference of opinion an' what's worse, seems
to me
the
trend is upwards.
mircea_popescu: what
the fuck's one
to do ?
there's a major difference between "all
these people running around blathering about how bitcoin will change
the world of starbucks are idiots" and "micropayments are evil". even
though at
the
time a bunch of idiots run around like
they run
the place,
the difference is negligible.
☟︎ trinque: I even said once "so
then build Visa on bitcoin"
mircea_popescu: sure ; but i don't
think
trinque was proposing
the purpose of bitcoin is micropayments.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 02:41 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform can you explain your problem with micropayments any more articulately
than "i don't understand
this" ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform can you explain your problem with micropayments any more articulately
than "i don't understand
this" ?
☟︎ shinohai: Oh wait,
that's
the guy
that got phished and scammed out of like 1.8 million I
think.
shinohai: I wonder what are
the Bitpay people on schedule for, gonna give a speech on how
to get hacked?
mircea_popescu: anyway. argentina is a fine place for it, more derpy posers per square mile here
than almost anywhere in
the world.
shinohai: I have no interest in
that shit
shinohai snickers,
told covertress
this when she invited him
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-10: [02:06:08] <shinohai> mircea_popescu should go and flip
tables.
mod6: again, don't wanna speak for
the man; however, don't
think he has any at
this point.
mod6: well, i don't wanna speak for ben_vulpes, but iirc he's read most of
them if not all; maybe just didn't get around
to signing for lack of
time because of baby, and running company.
trinque: and
this on airgapped machine
trinque: should be possible
to confirm
that all
transactions were authorized by end user before moving any actual btc
trinque will need
to actually blog about it
trinque: it runs off an address
that has been slowly dwindling 0.1btc
trinque: asciilifeform: how
to do micropayments for deeds and rss notifications without a wallet?
shinohai: mircea_popescu should go and flip
tables.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-09 23:24 mircea_popescu: change a111 's control sequences whatever
they may be currently
to !# only please.
a111: Logged on 2016-09-10 00:06 mircea_popescu: it's supposed
to keep a balance for you and make payments. exactly same mechanics as rating, which is how i dumped on
trinque.
mod6: alright. now we'll begin a
testing cycle. when we're done with
that, will sign and publish vpatch.
mod6: im also going
to use
this vpatch
to
tag
the release and
tie up
the leafs.
trinque: a very brief overview is
that
there is one deposit address, encrypted OTPs are archived elsewhere as
they are sent
to
transactors,
then deeded, and withdrawals involve a human walk over
the account history before dispatching a
txn.
thestringpuller: trinque: store bitcoin like you would nuclear waste.
the
true asciilifeform method!
trinque: could
think of it like bitcoin is a corrosive
that *will* find its way out of
the container if it can
shinohai: no
trinque
that's why I abandoned it, it was just garbage, I
thought I'd be better off
to start from scratch.
mircea_popescu: trinque soonish we'll end up with a sort of space sim, "you dock
to station
trinque, here's what's available"
trinque: that said shinohai pls do not hook a cruddy anything
to your
trb for your own sake.
trinque: more redundancy
the better.
these facilities end up being what's available on a particular gossipd node, as I see it
mircea_popescu: no rule
that
there can only be one, however ; on
the contrary.
mircea_popescu: it's supposed
to keep a balance for you and make payments. exactly same mechanics as rating, which is how i dumped on
trinque.
☟︎