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BingoBoingo: Though the Fat Forehead candidate is starting to concede. Apparently for them conceding is a process...

BingoBoingo: And in the second, definitive count of ballots... things so far look a lot more like the decisive advantage the polls gave to Lacalle Pou http://archive.is/2gOYO

jfw: The split existed historically in that they developed as separate projects; gcc works with multiple c libraries as musl works with multiple compilers. Perhaps mircea_popescu is inquiring into a deeper question of whether it's right to maintain the split (presently - I've no idea)

dorion_road: mircea_popescu is that a rational cut of the work in your view ?

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-27 15:33:20 jfw: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-27#1953705 - Could be. There's a decision that will be needed between glibc, dynamic musl, static musl, some mixture or framework with multiple options, or what. This is a part of the server vs. graphics split that bvt mentioned, or work vs. play if that's a fair characterization of

dorion_road: mircea_popescu gcc refers to c compiler, ave1 said he's working on a genesis based on version 4.9.4. By c library I mean the choice essentially between glibc and musl and dynamic and static linking, e.g. http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-27#1953721

BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Well the chorros had been taking guns off of girly gops walking the beat for at least a year. Now the dudes get beat. Interesting to see where this'll lead.

jfw: cool, if we gotta trust a binary anyway, probably no reason to prefer theirs to his.

jfw: My view of musl is that it's substantially smaller and cleaner than glibc, but still has a substantial rate of bugfixes mixed in with feature additions. My sense is that many of these are in the area of threading / concurrency, for which they wrote a new implementation of the userspace part, and also an area I'm less familiar with though wouldn't mind improving on.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-27 15:01:28 dorion_road: jfw I know you've spent a good deal of time with musl in the process of getting Gales statically linked , do you think owning the c library is a good fit for you ?

jfw: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-27#1953705 - Could be. There's a decision that will be needed between glibc, dynamic musl, static musl, some mixture or framework with multiple options, or what. This is a part of the server vs. graphics split that bvt mentioned, or work vs. play if that's a fair characterization of

jfw: BingoBoingp, guessing that's panamaserver.com , panamaservers.com looks like a parked domain. I'm not familiar with them.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-26 21:56:33 BingoBoingo: jfw dorion_road: Do you know anything about an operation calling itself Panamaservers.com? Of particular interest, is Panama a small enough place you maybe ran into their last Customer service and support manager?

dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-26#1953664 << I don't know that datacenter in particular. I can ask around though, Panama is small. I'd offer to pay a visit to their office if I was in town.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-12 16:57:31 jfw: It's a Linux distro I put together, in a couple stages, based on gcc 4.7, musl, busybox userland, exclusively static linking

dorion_road: To expand what I'm thinking re userland, the choice as far as I see is between stage3 via Cuntoo or Busybox a la Gales + whatever addons are not included in Busybox.

dorion_road: jfw I know you've spent a good deal of time with musl in the process of getting Gales statically linked , do you think owning the c library is a good fit for you ?

dorion_road: spyked what area(s) most interest you and you think you're a best fit for ?

ericbot: Logged on 2019-11-26 19:49:58 dorion_road: lobbes the understanding ebuilds self-assignment is a good starting point in the meantime as the strategy clarifies. How about you explain them to yourself in the form of a blog article(s) ?

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-26 19:03:31 lobbes: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-11-26#1953620 << sounds good to me. The mp-wp bot needs to be completed/delivered this week (which I will have some extra time to do so due to upcoming US holidays). Once I get that and the auctionbot work estimation complete, I will propose a deadline for my ebuild 101 homework.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-26 19:03:23 lobbes: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-11-26#1953607 << indeed still outstanding. I'll aim to get a proper estimation in hours for that work out by Saturday

dorion_road: bvt, I've been reading your kernal and tmsr os articles; I must say they are a pleasure. I'm integrating many of the points you've made in the article I'm writing to clarify the plan here.

dorion_road: how about you publish a review of the current status and plan moving forward on you blog ? That'll help us shorten the feedback loop.

dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-17#1951499 << hey ave1, how goes ? has there been a delivery date set on this ?

diana_coman: heh, got back to that due to a need to change direction .

BingoBoingo: To put the contrast differently. As a trade, datacenter tech is portable. A datacenter tech does his work and follows opportunities like an oilfield roughneck. A customer service manager enters a carrera in the Latino sense of it being a race. It's a race to either move up in the organization of move from organization to organization while staying in front of rot that accumulates in other aspects of the business.

BingoBoingo understands that datacenter tech is a sorta trade while customer service manager is in many cases is a sort of fall guy.

BingoBoingo: Apartment rents in their neighborhood appear to be ~150% to 175% of similarly situated Montevideo rents, and they opened the conversation with a request for my salary expectations. I appreciated they replied, even with an opportunity other than what I approached them about... but I'd like to avoid the situation where I end up in the wrong job *and* underpaid for taking on the extra risk.

BingoBoingo: jfw dorion_road: Do you know anything about an operation calling itself Panamaservers.com? Of particular interest, is Panama a small enough place you maybe ran into their last Customer service and support manager?

mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo, sounds like a plan. also don't get oneitis.

BingoBoingo: Anyways, they aren't paricularly looking to get more hands in Uruguay, but they are interested enough to have a get to know you sit down. I'm emphasizing my readiness to locate while moderating my expectations.

BingoBoingo: Actually owning, provisioning the Datacenter more of a Burlington sorta industry.

BingoBoingo: Asia's delivered some fast, but dumb. I am beginning to suspect folks with heads in the DC space may have moved to doing the POP in a bunch of other people's buildings thing Pizarro was intended to grow into.

BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'm trying to get that number up to 500. Sticking with the small got a lot of the same dumb silence I met in 2017.

BingoBoingo: In new developments, next week will be meeting with someone from a datacenter firm that keeps POPs all all over South America when he hits Montevideo.

lobbes: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-11-26#1953620 << sounds good to me. The mp-wp bot needs to be completed/delivered this week (which I will have some extra time to do so due to upcoming US holidays). Once I get that and the auctionbot work estimation complete, I will propose a deadline for my ebuild 101 homework.

lobbes: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-11-26#1953607 << indeed still outstanding. I'll aim to get a proper estimation in hours for that work out by Saturday

ericbot: Logged on 2019-11-26 13:29:01 mircea_popescu: conversation, at least among well spoken & intelligent people and in the context of organizing work, very well resembles well written programs for well built machines for the exactly obvious reason : that's what the machine aims to be, a well spoken intelligent person.

mircea_popescu: a project's in some trouble when management's technically above the actual engineers for chrissakes. and yes, the whole point of even having a republic is fine high escalation, so as to be able to deal well with insanely difficult rare problems.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-12 17:07:58 jfw: I expect that'd be quite difficult, its libGL is a glibc-based .so

dorion_road: lobbes the understanding ebuilds self-assignment is a good starting point in the meantime as the strategy clarifies. How about you explain them to yourself in the form of a blog article(s) ?

dorion_road: jfw wallet is top priority this week. can you get a start on your Gales writing as part of the time you have allocated for writing.

jfw: dorion_road, diana_coman: we're in clear agreement that I should write it up then; think I should make that a priority for this week?

ericbot: Logged on 2019-11-13 03:01:41 lobbes: I'm aiming to get remainder of mp-wp logger complete in under two weeks. Then rest of Nov I want to tidy up auctionbot. So Dec 1st should be a good starting point for me

ericbot: Logged on 2019-11-13 01:54:04 trinque: k, so this is little else than creating a signed tarball of the cuntoo bootstrapper's output, and building a livecd/usb that can unpack that item onto a fresh system, bundled with some driver firmware and a try-all-modules kernel.

dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953543 << Thank you for the luck wishes. What pace of engagement do you see yourself able to maintain over say, a 30-60 day stretch ?

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-25 18:02:15 jfw: mircea_popescu: a Linux distro, yes, though my understanding was that what we built there was too narrow in hardware and application support to be of more general interest

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-25 17:18:41 mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953458 << nothing new or different, same old thing management always was. write a plan, get people to ~commit~ to parts, chase the commitments, reschedule as needed and so on.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-25 16:03:55 jfw: To update on http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-12#1950766 , I would be more comfortable with 10 hours a week, at least if it's an "intangibles and goodwill" sort of deal. dorion_road was in accord if I recall. And as discussed with spyked, the limited time could provide a good pressure to keep it productive.

dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953471 << yeah, to start. let's see how productive 10 hours a week can be made and re-evaluate after we gather feedback.

BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Asia just seems a lot more alien than anywhere else.

spyked: mircea_popescu, that inflation isn't limited just to version numbers tho. those numbers are just the tip of the iceberg hiding underneath a whole lot of stupid changes. e.g. gcc 4.7 to 4.9 had quite a few changes (among others) to default flags, admittedly. but 4.9 to 6, ffs that broke compilation for a lot of projects.

mircea_popescu: but anyways, a lot of this "it's just numbers" attitude since the innumerate have been "no kid left behind"'d into everyone's processes. then once cats finally join the fray as fully franchised theirdemocracy voters &c, it'll be "whatever, it's just calendars" and so on.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-09 05:40:35 mircea_popescu: all sorta chuck moores, "famous" and apparently ever so good and useful, just WAITING for you to give them a chance to strangle you.

mircea_popescu: "your two hours worth of nothing in particular still make you just as good as say that cuck derp dad's age -- think, he never made a major version revision, but you did! you're so cool...!!!"

mircea_popescu: whereas for the generation ingoing with the sept that never ended, their exactly just as deeply rooted precisely equal fear of its own inconsequence and inadequacy manifested as version number inflation, with which printing press to pay off on the hopes&dreams of a team of retards. simple monetization of the sacred cows of the previous generation, really, which is how neoprotestantism ever works.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-26 04:52:14 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953525 <-- way I see it, this version numbering scheme comes as a consequence of the adoption of a "move fast and break things" ideology. it's just numbers, the guys leading those projects don't try to make any distinction between "major" and "minor" changes anymore

mircea_popescu: ore over two decades and nobody was ever gonna make a 3 again.

mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-26#1953553 << countervailingly, the way i see it is that insecurity flipped once the generations changed ; the generation outgoing with the sept that never ended had a deeply rooted fear of its own inconsequence and inadequacy that manifested in a version of neoprotestant modesty whereby by the time a program reached version 2 something it had passed through three hands or m

mircea_popescu: conversation, at least among well spoken & intelligent people and in the context of organizing work, very well resembles well written programs for well built machines for the exactly obvious reason : that's what the machine aims to be, a well spoken intelligent person.

mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-26#1953547 << the thing you're quoting doesn't match the structure of a thing that may be quoted as the basis for "i understood" in this context, because it's the innard of a loop rather than the return of the level-adequate conditional block.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-26 00:45:11 lobbes: anyways, why not have dorion come in as the day-to-day manager, with trinque in a more advisory/consultant role? I thought this was more or less the original plan to begin with tbh

mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo, that sounds pretty great, actually. what's wrong with asia after all, they have tiny weird looking chicks but i guess one can always rubberband a coupla together and fuck in between the bellies. vaseline conquers all!

bvt: spyked: ftr, this is just a brain dump, i'm trying to evolve my own understanding of the problem

spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953543 <-- actually I've been getting some more intimate knowledge of cuntoo in the last coupla weeks, now I have a write-up I need to do on that... a couple of them even.

ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-25 18:40:23 BingoBoingo: also has no idea what justified version jumping from 4 to 9 in under a decade either.

spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953525 <-- way I see it, this version numbering scheme comes as a consequence of the adoption of a "move fast and break things" ideology. it's just numbers, the guys leading those projects don't try to make any distinction between "major" and "minor" changes anymore

lobbes: anyways, why not have dorion come in as the day-to-day manager, with trinque in a more advisory/consultant role? I thought this was more or less the original plan to begin with tbh

BingoBoingo: 16 minutes from my solicitation to: "Let's schedule a conference call. What time works for you?"

BingoBoingo: It's looking like I probably should have started the search with Asia... Fastest non-autoresponder response yet (notably faster than when I approached the place for a quote)

mircea_popescu: nfi what you're doing fucking with this, seeing how you're supposed to LOOK FOR A JOB

BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Gentoo's problem is it doesn't have a "Gentoo X" where X is a set of reasonably standard tools amenable to documentation.

BingoBoingo also has no idea what justified version jumping from 4 to 9 in under a decade either.

jfw: BingoBoingo: 4.7, the last series to not require a c++ compiler to bootstrap

BingoBoingo: jfw: Is the Gales thing a GCC4 toolchain?

BingoBoingo: diana_coman: Apparently the Chinese are doing on of their "ban, but not a ban" price manipulation ops

jfw: mircea_popescu: a Linux distro, yes, though my understanding was that what we built there was too narrow in hardware and application support to be of more general interest

mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953458 << nothing new or different, same old thing management always was. write a plan, get people to ~commit~ to parts, chase the commitments, reschedule as needed and so on.

jfw: To update on http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-12#1950766 , I would be more comfortable with 10 hours a week, at least if it's an "intangibles and goodwill" sort of deal. dorion_road was in accord if I recall. And as discussed with spyked, the limited time could provide a good pressure to keep it productive.

dorion_road has a meeting at 21:30 UTC , will keep an eye out until then and check back later this evening.

dorion_road: 5) clarify infrastructure and processes for code and documentation distribution ; 6) write a plan and execute raising the quality and growing the quantity of people to get into the WoT and participate/contribute to tmsr(-os).

BingoBoingo: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953427 << I will say, the big advantage this seems to have is diana_coman's pages are getting schooled on communication and organization. If the trend continues and this works out, could be a great demonstration on how to bootstrap people in addition to delivering an OS.

mircea_popescu: now that was a pleasant walk!

feedbot: http://thewhet.net/2019/11/a-little-bit-of-tinyscheme-a-lot-of-cozonac/ << The Whet -- A Little Bit of TinyScheme, a Lot of Cozonac

diana_coman: a meta-pa&ptCrhuR

mircea_popescu: it was a metaphor!

mircea_popescu: actually, i guess ima take the bitchez out for a walk. bbl.

mircea_popescu: anyway, i really can't complain, the weather here's a very solid late march, though it be almost december. sunny warm and pretty.

mircea_popescu: diana_coman, lmao, the mythical being of gijbig would say that, "now just put it all in a pot and bring me a big spoon!"

diana_coman: they are atm under some pressure to finish a working version of a wallet too but I'd say that is currently at a more tech stage really so the os-planning could start anyway.

mircea_popescu: time fucking flies, dude, what the fuck can i say. it's been a month! how long am i gonna sit in this warehouse.

mircea_popescu: what's left is the one remainder in the hands of this yet-another ex-republic (ex, through its failure, conscious even if disavowed, an' in any case vehehehery carefully constructed out of vehehehehery carefully curated [http://trilema.com/2

mircea_popescu: i shall be leaving for istanbul / isfahan / lebanon / cairo / tipoli / tunis etc (unless i decide to go luxor and so on from there) in another week or two. i wanted, like a sane fucking person, to have things arranged and in working order by then, and indeed -- removing logging from the inept if stupid hands of "the community" looks like it'll be done, as per above. removing coding from the inept if stupid hands of the

mircea_popescu: now in sadder news : the problem i have here is that i am traveling. i very carefully introduced stationary windows to be able to look after affairs, but we're just about four weeks into the current one, which is thereby drawing to a close.