log☇︎
150500+ entries in 0.093s
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726683 << this figure is correct, but on the high end of the typical price range. ☝︎
asciilifeform: this functionality belongs ~in~ the box, where more difficult for 'guests' to monkey with, not in cords and bottoms of cabinets.
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 04:37 asciilifeform: i'll mass produce switches some time after doing same for ordinary dc power supplies, they rank ahead in seekritude
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 07:09 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726582 << a) this is not factual. you manufacture power chord that only works or doesn't work, through eg http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-12#1724529 ; b) if your power chord came with special rsa analysis and also had a special "flash power when pgp is being used" switch, you'd get into manufacturing your own power chords in very short order.
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 08:05 mircea_popescu: yeah. same principle, but for gas rather than electricity. there's a special button by the main derivation that resets the flow
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726711 << this is unknown in usa: too much high tech! instead, and only in earthquake states, and only in ~some~ towns, they issue... wrenches, with which one is expected to close the valve outside the ruins of your house, as you climb from the rubble ☝︎
asciilifeform: and to know if uninvited guests have been inside the cage.
asciilifeform: i see it as worth something, to be able to immediately distinguish , e.g., a dead hdd, from a stolen hdd .
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 07:18 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726622 << cameras ? what is this, some yahoo's long island pizzeria ?
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726688 < it costs next-to-nothing and trigger when sees motion, which in a locking cage it should never by surprise ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 07:10 mircea_popescu: proper (ie, like power chord, either works or doesn't) switch very much on the republican slate. no extant item satisfy this requirement.,
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726680 << i'd like a republican chair to sit in too!111 switch, however, if you want GB or above -- does require making own silicon if you want it to meaningfully differ from the extant items . fpga won't cut it clockwise. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 07:07 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726566 << nope. all it takes is for one hop to filter out the strange, and the whole usg sigint collapses in a pile of magic dust.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726675 << 'filter out the strange' is the naive usg av 'industry' nonsense. a half decent diddletron neither produces nor consumes any 'strange', and 'magic packet' will consist of , e.g., lubyization of 10,000 ordinary packets' timing ☝︎☟︎
asciilifeform: ( want non public? is what crypto is for, switch is not a trusted piece of equip )
asciilifeform: or alternatively asciilifeform's philosophy -- i.e. packets that leave your nics, are to be considered public
asciilifeform: if you have a pair of racked boxes that gotta talk seeekritly to ~one another~, don't connect them via the switch, connect directly with crossover cable ( this is what the spare nics quality boxen ship with, are for )
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 07:03 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726558 << the expectation is that it will allow nsa comms, such as exfiltration in response to magic packets and the very magic packets in question.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726673 << that was what i didn't and still don't grasp : what exactly can enemy exfiltrate from a boobytrapped ~switch~ ( it ain't a firewall, it's a dumb switch) that he cannot get from his upstream tap ?? ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 06:30 mod6: ok, just ran 2 quick tests on different box. results are very similar. different # of samples on new ones, however old|new: 25%|27.42%, 50%|53.57% respectively
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726670 << looks typical ☝︎
ben_vulpes: vegetarians have terrible internal flora, can confirm ☟︎
mircea_popescu: anyway, it was the lulz of all time
mircea_popescu: well for one thing she had no idea how/where, i never saw the item installed anywhere else in that country.
mircea_popescu: yeah. same principle, but for gas rather than electricity. there's a special button by the main derivation that resets the flow ☟︎
ben_vulpes: ah i see; i was thinking about little glass amp-rated tubes
mircea_popescu: this had the stove and the heater close together and so it made sense, if you got a leak it's there.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes no, see, the super-safe way is to have a detector by the burners that cuts the gas line if stimulated.
mircea_popescu: mortified noob had to endure the humiliation of me having to actually go outside reset the gas line
mircea_popescu: did i recount that event when nude girly at the stove farted and the gas detector immediately blew a fuse ?
ben_vulpes: however new residence has a "whole house fan", and so exhausting all interior gasses was a trivial exercise
ben_vulpes just had an exciting; apparently closed the flue a bit too soon/didn't give the fireplace enough time to self-extinguish and the co detectors went off
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 06:30 mod6: ok, just ran 2 quick tests on different box. results are very similar. different # of samples on new ones, however old|new: 25%|27.42%, 50%|53.57% respectively
ben_vulpes: i think we've had a few threads in re creativity in the eastern empire
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726638 << this is liek, the most creative person i ever encountered. "raven" and "Zero", really ? what's next, "hacker" ? "internet" ? ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 05:01 asciilifeform: this is not unreasonable request, btw, and will filter out bozos
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726622 << cameras ? what is this, some yahoo's long island pizzeria ? ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 04:54 mod6: gens, sure. do you want to share power conditioning equip?
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726608 << yes. it's not practical to put the gen gear next to the box. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 04:52 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i got one like that, it wanted 30bux/mo per amp (220v)
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726602 << 19 cents to the KWh is not really space station price, considering a) electricity is 5 to 10 cents to the KWh pretty much everywhere and b) this price includes HVAC, which is for obvious reasons just about half of the cost of power. ☝︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: proper (ie, like power chord, either works or doesn't) switch very much on the republican slate. no extant item satisfy this requirement., ☟︎
a111: Logged on 2017-10-12 21:35 asciilifeform: trinque: will need, laugh if you must, 2nd inverter
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 04:36 asciilifeform: i don't manufacture switches, BingoBoingo , and i have no intention of starting, it isn't a device that handles seekrits, and very literally either works or does not -- like mains cord.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726582 << a) this is not factual. you manufacture power chord that only works or doesn't work, through eg http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-12#1724529 ; b) if your power chord came with special rsa analysis and also had a special "flash power when pgp is being used" switch, you'd get into manufacturing your own power chords in very short order. ☝︎☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2017-10-19 04:25 davout: you're going to have the same issues upstream anyway neh?
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726566 << nope. all it takes is for one hop to filter out the strange, and the whole usg sigint collapses in a pile of magic dust. ☝︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-19#1726558 << the expectation is that it will allow nsa comms, such as exfiltration in response to magic packets and the very magic packets in question. ☝︎☟︎
mod6: originals were taken with a much older version of ent than the new.
mod6: ok, just ran 2 quick tests on different box. results are very similar. different # of samples on new ones, however old|new: 25%|27.42%, 50%|53.57% respectively ☟︎☟︎☟︎☟︎
mod6: (just to see if I get a different value, or non-round value for X^2)
mod6: ima try using an ent on a different box against some of the runs that I did previously...
mod6: yeah, not too sure. i've also never looked at the `ent` code.
ben_vulpes: statistics being the thing that hoses intuition every time.
ben_vulpes: leaning on intuition here; feels odd to me that the "randomly would exceed" value is so round on so many of your test runs, but it's gotta be weakness in my statistics intuition
mod6: There's a bunch of in-depth information in this book, I highly suggest if examining these results.
ben_vulpes: mod6: yeah i think i'll just have to read this myself
mod6: if (by interpolation in the table) V lies between the 5% and 10% entries, or the 90% and 95% entries, the numbers might be ``almost suspect.''" -- Knuth, The Art of Computer Programming Vol. 2, Seminumerical Algorithms pp. 46,47
mod6: "If V is less than the 1% entry or greater than the 99% entry, we reject the numbers as no sufficiently random. If V lies between the 1% and 5% entries or between the 95% and 99% entries, the numbers are ``suspect'';
mod6: yah, i'll go grab the book, standby.
ben_vulpes: mod6: this is from "the art of computer programming" or... ?
mod6: might be in the logs
mod6: ben_vulpes: seems fine. iirc, and i don't have the book in hand at the moment, but knuth outside certain boundaries is suspect.
ben_vulpes: mine too; what did nickserv tell you when you typed exactly /nick raven_zero
ben_vulpes: Guest29647: once you register the nick, you gotta also set it as your nick like /nick raven_zero
ben_vulpes: mod6: for contrast this first run just came out with 80.89%
ben_vulpes: heck, try raven_zero
ben_vulpes: but that one's also going to be taken, freenode is a very busy place
mod6: i'd have to look at other's results, can't recall off the top of my head.
mod6: ben_vulpes: ah, i seem to remember reading about the X^2 percentiles in knuth. mine in particular came out pretty round ya. or do you mean "your" in the general sense?
Guest29647: let me try that..
ben_vulpes: Guest29647: type /msg nickserv help for details on that
ben_vulpes: mod6: kinda interesting that your `ent` chi-squared "randomly would exceed this value XX percent of the time" always comes out to something nice and round like 25.00 or 50.00
Guest29647: maybe check the instructions in the mail?
ben_vulpes: lol yeah that name has good odds of already being in use
asciilifeform: helps to keep the landlord honest.
asciilifeform: front-facing camera, too, why not
asciilifeform: now ! mains quality ~logger~, with independent power source -- imho deserves a 1u in any tmsr cabinet.
asciilifeform: in even small corporate dc there are several ups that take up small room
asciilifeform: ( and that's if you were to put in 2u of ups per every 1u of serverolade ! )
asciilifeform: don't leak cpu to the mains.
mod6: would figure that would be something you would want in-cage.
asciilifeform: nobody's about to fly out to swap little batteries.
mod6: gens, sure. do you want to share power conditioning equip? ☟︎
mod6: <+BingoBoingo> <ben_vulpes> mhm; estimated as 42*.3kW << Of those 42U, 1 or 2 go to switch. Then you gotta keep a sane heat envelope lest some alf-weird cook everything and piss off the neighbors. 42U ends up turning into something like 20 servers apparently. << minus space for UPSs
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i got one like that, it wanted 30bux/mo per amp (220v) ☟︎
BingoBoingo: But when exploring datacenter options, biggest obstacle is encountering Jolo the Pinoy in all nationalities. From "10 mbps to rack" to "Try this managed colo where we buy you boxes and do everything, it's just like getting 7Kva of dedicated servers but with more upsells"
BingoBoingo: and to street as in old days
BingoBoingo: And today fiber runs to "meet me" room or other nonesuch, then to street or sewer ditch or wherever
asciilifeform: this is how it was in the olden days, in the boxes asciilifeform BOFH'd over long ago.
BingoBoingo: Options for that are either have a hardware on the rack that aggregates ISP links to the DC and handles this shit, OR beat a jolo into sense.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: this is generally set once. and out of band.
BingoBoingo: Maybe customer wants super anal static routing BBQ for their box?
BingoBoingo: Own in the sense I manage the settings on the appliance instead of trusting DC to not assign the task to their jolo. And at desired connection speeds switch handles the routing, unless you wanna go Cisco.
asciilifeform: i'll mass produce switches some time after doing same for ordinary dc power supplies, they rank ahead in seekritude ☟︎
asciilifeform: i don't manufacture switches, BingoBoingo , and i have no intention of starting, it isn't a device that handles seekrits, and very literally either works or does not -- like mains cord. ☟︎
BingoBoingo: Point is not "weed out all annoyances", point is make the one finite mitigation (own switch) which is less mitigation and more practice for scaling later.
ben_vulpes: mind numbing waste of time and energy
asciilifeform: it is actually how usg does business , the anticipate-supposedly-all thing
a111: Logged on 2017-10-18 19:08 asciilifeform: the implication also is that there is a particular kind of mistake, exemplified imho by the zeroasset corp thing in bbet, that is easy to make -- to insist that the energy be conserved at all times