log☇︎
136900+ entries in 1.06s
decimation: heh I didn't realize it still existed
asciilifeform: i have considered, for instance, a move to 'minix'
asciilifeform: so, at the risk of repeating myself, i gotta agree with mircea_popescu here and respectfully disagree with mod6
asciilifeform: i am also considering bellard's 'tcc' ( http://bellard.org/tcc )
decimation: and there's no bootstrap scripts as far as I know
decimation: ah I see
decimation: I thought sparc was derived from mips
decimation wishes I had an old mips sun box
asciilifeform: but - i will not. i have other work!
decimation: some bsd supports linux binaries I think
mod6: i'll have to take another crack at rotor after month end.
decimation: I did that a long time ago
asciilifeform: i will repeat that rotor binary ~is expected to work on all linux from 2.6+~
decimation: although I wonder if it will work on any bsd
asciilifeform: i will not support mactardation.
asciilifeform: i will not support soviet pdp-11.
asciilifeform: i will not support vms on vax.
asciilifeform: but ~i personally~ will from now on support ~only~ rotor. and soon after, only rotolinux (buildroot for arbitrary arch that includes therealbitcoin and its deps, and toolchain to reconstruct self and the latter.) ☟︎
asciilifeform: i won't presume to tell other people to use, or not use.
decimation: but I have old crapple laptops that I would like to use
decimation: heh I hear you man
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-07-2015#1217462 << pretty sure i disabled locales... ☝︎
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-07-2015#1217395 << if i have to ship a bootable linux iso, buildrooted for the purpose of building a) self b) bitcoin - i will. in fact, yes, i have this up my sleeve, BUT PEOPLE WOULD HAVE TO USE IT instead of retarduntu etc ☝︎☟︎
decimation: I'm sure the homos at apple support utf8, but apparently it doesn't work with whatever buildroot wants
decimation: I donno
decimation: nobody has offered to buy the thing for $2b as far as I know
punkman: trinque, sure set it up with your choice of OS and I'll write one for you
mircea_popescu: i can appreciate that.
mod6: i agree. i'm just being careful not to create more work for myself/others than necessary.
mircea_popescu: but i'm pretty sure can't simply abandon the entire userland question, it'd be a major strategic mistake.
mircea_popescu: mod6 i'm not entirely sure how the specifics should work out. bit of an open question atm
trinque: punkman: yeah, I was thinking my 4u could be a build/test box
punkman: I'm willing to contribute Ansible scripts to deploy/build/debug instances of bitcoind via ssh to different machines. for automating some of the testing workload.
mod6: so should we still create scripts for people to build without buildroot (i.e. stator.sh/auto.sh) and then host packages for the ability to construct a buildroot with a drop-in of the foundation source?
mod6: yeah I saw that about the eulora thing.
mircea_popescu: this sounds patently insane, i agree, but i just recently discovered in unrelated proejct that it's unavoidable.
mod6: so i guess there is still a bit of a fork in the road; even if we do all of the hard work of ensuring peoples host dependantcies are installed before any compiling is even attempted, do we even want that to be a thing, as stan said, this is now obsolete. And do we now maintain a lot of other things for buildroot?
mod6: yeah totally agree. and i can't help but wonder if it's simply because of things that each persons different host has not installed by default. but it's hard to account for all of that.
mircea_popescu: mod6 so far 90%+ of the problems have been with installation, from what i've seen
mod6: oh no. i wasn't planning on that at all this month anyway.
mircea_popescu: mod6 just don't go to this dark place where "omg it's the 29th and i must have a working final version of bitcoind to announce
trinque: yeah, I mean the thing needs a derpinstaller
mod6: i think he's as tired of our build script problems as I am.
mod6: trinque: he and i discussed this breifly. and I won't speak for him here. but i wouldn't have said what I said earlier without at least a discussion about that.
trinque: I've got a 4u collecting dust, etc etc
trinque: mod6: I've already been testing some of your stuff; if nobody else wants to manage the build script, I'm fine with it
mod6: well, i've been pushin pretty hard as far as work load -- what scares me is taking on buildroot and trying to bundle/test the entire thing.
mod6: we need something that people can utilize to make it work. i totally agree with that. and scripts and other widgets to make it work could even be a separate bundle.
mircea_popescu: more's the point here, i get the impression you're chaffing under too much workload.
mod6: exactly what I'm referring to.
mod6: mircea_popescu: wouldn't it be just fine if we don't ship a "stator.sh" or an "auto.sh" in the source and simply just maintain a cookbook and preferred steps like I was saying here: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-07-2015#1217135 ☝︎
trinque: I only live that my thoughts may be less encumbered by morons by the day
trinque: controlling an idea requires an immensely more repressed society than I would prefer to live in
trinque: I'm speaking about the cultural vulgarity of "I own that idea"
trinque: yet I will use the concept any way that benefits me
trinque: to the extent that someone thinks they own a concept, I may lie and let him think so
hanbot: for as long as they stay there i doubt anyone cares.
trinque: I'm responding to decimation re: IP
trinque: I will revise to: no one can prevent me from making use of a concept; they live in the mind
trinque: I dun geddit, yet lol
hanbot: i suppose this works ok up until one morning you wake up to find we've all changed nicks to trinque and there's just no way to make any sort of further sense of b-a
trinque: I reject entirely the notion that concepts can be owned. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-07-2015#1217206 << from what i'm seeing this is actually slowly emerging. ☝︎
mircea_popescu: blergh, fucktarded sales copy, i guess i'm the dumbass for not noticing it's washitpo again
mircea_popescu: in any case in the triangle "monthly releases" "mod6 does all teh work" "bitcoind is usable" i'm not going to pick the first two for fucks sake.
assbot: Logged on 29-07-2015 23:05:49; mod6: Trying to create a one-size-fits-all script for everyone to use to build this thing is not going to work. And how does one bundle up something such as 'rotor' and end up not maintaining buildroot and everything else? That's a game that I'm not interested in playing. And it's dangerous for us to go that direction.
trinque: I'm thinking of heading a bit north to WA
trinque: I loathe these people.
trinque: unimpressed, and he wrote the bot I based deedbot- on
trinque: punkman: I said to him that the guy who was run out of some ruby project for being catholic was wronged.
trinque: I'm gonna eventually write one that works in CL
trinque: guy that wrote tenyks told me I hate trannies, fucking cunt
williamdunne: I'll fix it in a mo
williamdunne: Ah I know what it will have been
williamdunne: Oh, scoop is disconnected from IRC but not the internet. I'll look into it
trinque: I'll check it out when I leave
assbot: I Can't Believe They Let You Do That! - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1MuAtba )
trinque: ag3nt_zer0: I have a half-baked theory that america was merely running on the fumes of the hierarchical beliefs of people that immigrated here
trinque: and I know the answer to my own question but... damn.
trinque: maybe I'm naive, but I'm certain this was not always the case
ag3nt_zer0: maybe it was the drugs, but I remember the 90s being quite different
ag3nt_zer0: I noticed a huge spike in this shit post 911/patriot act fear + smartphone... seems these events combined to cinch the asshole up to inpenetrable proportion
trinque: oh, I've lamented the lack of eye contact on the street in Portland in the hallowed logs
ag3nt_zer0: I hear that people actually have the strnegth to acknowledge eachothers presence if, you know, colliding on the street
trinque: (I am the latter)
ag3nt_zer0: oh austin... both places are on my list as possibilities to reside if I make it back from my trip
trinque: I hail from portland, or
trinque: phf: yeah, I can see that
trinque: I'd like to do the backpack thing at some point too
ag3nt_zer0: which means it hasnt been that great haha but I am looking forward to getting the fuck out of here so there is a light on the horizon
phf: trinque: linux seems to support everything and with some effort you could strip it down somewhat. i think linux also has a policy of never breaking abi, so if you're into static compilation, like ascii said sometime ago "if stator binary breaks on your other linux something's very very wrong"
ag3nt_zer0: s'ok man... i started a countdown that clicks away until I plan to embark on a two year backpack around the world
trinque: my C++ is middling to poor, but I can bash it up all day
shinohai: Hell, I even got it to build on Ubuntu, the dumbest of Linux systems I know of.
trinque: that I could probably help with.
trinque: alright so I'm seeing something
trinque: I tried it for the hell of it a while back
mod6: <+trinque> asciilifeform: I don't think he's saying that, merely that aside from the makefile, perhaps the larger build system should be a separate concern << exactly this. Makefile stays ofc.
trinque: though I suppose in terms of hardware support (pogo, so on) it does better.
trinque: I'm about ready to give linux the permaboot