asciilifeform: reflash with probes.

asciilifeform: 'ASUS are co-working with developers such as Merlin and DDWRT to make sure 3rd party firmwares power are the same as ASUS firmware and obey the regulations. ' << lel.

asciilifeform puts on list.

asciilifeform: plenty of mockable nonsolutions to choose from.

asciilifeform: shinohai: why not orbitlab. probably cheaper.

asciilifeform: nope

asciilifeform: $s Der Giftpilz

asciilifeform: $s der giftpilz

asciilifeform: trinque: i played the game, it had about the same relationship to rand as 'Der Giftpilz' has to judaism.

asciilifeform: there may be other solution. ☟︎

asciilifeform: there is 1 historic solution, as mircea_popescu like to point out, 'be chingis khan', 10,001 slaves, armies, castles.

asciilifeform: the problem i was futilely stabbing away at is 'how to be independent of homo homini lupus est' ☟︎

asciilifeform: trinque: a city is, by definition, what i'd like to avoid.

asciilifeform: definitionally.

asciilifeform: a city is quite the opposite of subj, no ?

asciilifeform: waiwut

asciilifeform: phf: aha!

asciilifeform: i will add that my interest in subj is not limited to the sea, but to all other environments which are hostile to 'normalpeoplewithfamilies' (as depicted in mircea_popescu's articles) yet have plenty of room to be 'lost' inside, and quite habitable with some amount of technological help

asciilifeform: (i suppose they do, if you're chingis khan, or mircea_popescu , etc. but not for the contemplated poorfag use case.)

asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: land fortresses ~dunwork.

asciilifeform: fwiw.

asciilifeform: thestringpuller: gavin has not yet showed up at my house with kalash

asciilifeform: or what, old maintainer will carbomb you ?

asciilifeform: ...sure ?

asciilifeform: ergo the thread.

asciilifeform: trinque: you will find that the machines are not designed for permanent life aboard, or to survive winters. ☟︎

asciilifeform: how big of a crew does mats's house have ?

asciilifeform: wholly different domains.

asciilifeform: but don't conflate the war machine and the survival capsule from thread.

asciilifeform: ideally ~= 2.

asciilifeform: (turning valves, etc.)

asciilifeform: mats: i never determined a hard minimum. but will note that most of the folk on a ww2 sub did things that would be mechanical/reasonably automatic today.

asciilifeform: ( did mircea_popescu ever build that mega-toilet ??) ☟︎

asciilifeform: have fun mircea_popescu

asciilifeform: lel

asciilifeform: mats: in last thread, we did 'how much of a crew is needed with modern mechanisms'

asciilifeform: well, more that i am willing to ask 'how ~much~ piss would i need to drink so that...'

asciilifeform: pet - fit.

asciilifeform: i am not a tall fella but i did not fit in the cot in that museum-sub (it was largely unguarded and you could play with the contents)

asciilifeform: if it's any consolation, likely none of us would qualify as submariners, most blokes alive today are too tall for ww2 sub

asciilifeform: submariners - drank.

asciilifeform: how long photo panel lives for, how many fit on deck, what can you get from windmills, etc.

asciilifeform: the ultimate constraint is energy, aha

asciilifeform: even the sub didn't CARRY fresh water, srsly

asciilifeform: water is distilled, wtf.

asciilifeform: would look quite like that museum sub.

asciilifeform: i did the arithmetic.

asciilifeform: about size of 2 refrigerator trucks.

asciilifeform: for a year.

asciilifeform: ergo it is simply a small flat that happens to - temporarily - float. not a machine for surviving 2000km from nearest man.

asciilifeform: the recurring costs, and recurring dependencies on shore, are idiotically high

asciilifeform: i can spell out the missing piece (thought it was obvious)

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: expand ?

asciilifeform: incidentally i've learned that many folks in american east coast live in boats, but do it 100% in the marina. as a kind of enforced-whiteness trailer park.

asciilifeform: in port, it is an expensive kind of camper truck, yes.

asciilifeform: if you don't live at sea.

asciilifeform: at any rate, a machine-for-being-comfortably-poor that costs 2mil, if it were to exist, would be a solid answer to my equation. but the diesel pleasure boat is pointedly not it.

asciilifeform: so - either investment, or fly. pick.

asciilifeform: you wouldn't FIRE a 17th c. musket.

asciilifeform: ~flying~ the investatron would be nuts.

asciilifeform: then - yes.

asciilifeform: ah as museum piece.

asciilifeform: after that, thrown out.

asciilifeform: sov engines were good for ~200 hours.

asciilifeform: on what planet is it ~investment~ ?

asciilifeform: nor will it be repairable at sea, or survive north atlantic storms.

asciilifeform: it isn't 'coupla mil', it is 'coupla mil' plus 'own 100 slaves' plus 'lifetime of diesel and $1000 plumbing fittings'

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is like that fella ( mthreat ?) who bought a mig

asciilifeform: not esp. interesting from pov of solutions.

asciilifeform: it isn't 'scares', but more of the british admiral's answer to 'what shall we do about uboats?' -- 'boil the ocean'

asciilifeform: *park

asciilifeform: picture mircea_popescu were asked to design a bridge. 'just part 50% of the moon's mass right ~here~...'

asciilifeform: iirc he was a social butterfly, just a somewhat loose cannon while at it

asciilifeform: who chopped off his nose, then ?

asciilifeform: because pearls,swine.etc

asciilifeform: many folks dun even lift a finger to publish the goodz.

asciilifeform: ^ aha. see the 'coffin notebook' thread.

asciilifeform: lolk

asciilifeform: imho we can skip the menschkeit 'everett's device is the only working device' mega-thread, subj is amply worked in the l0gz...

asciilifeform: who charged into meat grinder to 0 result.

asciilifeform: but it makes generous use of everett's device. outside of a few 'sexy' cases, we don't get to hear from the dead armies.

asciilifeform: hey, worked for stalin, later.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: hm ?

asciilifeform: ( http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/sphere.htm is all i could find, but the meat of the discussion was in a now-lost usenet post... )

asciilifeform: hmm

asciilifeform: the 'extremist solutions' essay

asciilifeform: al schwartz's proof that n-dimensional sphere has more and more of its volume closer and closer to the surface as N approaches infinity

asciilifeform: hey, recall the sphere thread ?

asciilifeform pictures remembering this thread one day as the decks are awash and the end nears

asciilifeform: but do not see it demonstrated here that problem i posed has 0 roots.

asciilifeform: i agree.

asciilifeform: no man, no problem (tm) (r)

asciilifeform: all problems are ultimately psychogenic.

asciilifeform: far away.

asciilifeform: possibly answer is, be small king.

asciilifeform: great king attracts great usurpers.

asciilifeform: so it is not clear that 'be a great king' is optimal solution to 'be left alone'

asciilifeform: and so on until you're entirely hosed.

asciilifeform: thing is a sail. wind pushes it off course, and also down (crash.) and fuel is exhausted. can try to counter this by building larger engines, but then need bigger lifting envelope, and you get... moar sail.

asciilifeform: actually this is reminiscent of the aerodynamic problem which nailed dirigibles: