log☇︎
110200+ entries in 0.848s
asciilifeform: it does not bother me. if i need to create or receive such a thing, i buy moar disk. or tell the other fella 'make smaller files'
mircea_popescu: so you're going to bake in a magic number which is the largest number of groups that may ever exist in anyone's view
mircea_popescu: i dunno about your or anyone else's experience, but i personally have spent my entire life to date in the company of people whose takes were fundamentally irreconcilable. ever since a wee tyke doing double time between the upper crups exclusive school and the criminal underworld.
asciilifeform: rather than a scalar.
asciilifeform: well, if we're going full-bore, the transaction takes two matrices and yields a third.
mircea_popescu: because B mined on the basis of the chain that it saw ; and A idem. there's no guarantee these would stay coherent, and so they didn';t.
asciilifeform: well, gotta cut into detail. why, in this universe, does b see the 5 as valid, and a as invalid ?
mircea_popescu: not being a superposition of eigenstates myself, but a resolved one, i can't both credit and not credit the 5btc. would seem i have to choose one.
mircea_popescu: now - person X comes to me with a 5 BTC which he wants to spend on milk. B sees the 5 as valid ; A, as invalid. i know both A and B. does this mean i have to choose ?
mircea_popescu: ok, take the nonsense practically : there's A, as illustrated yesterday, the group of six nude ladies ; there's B, b-a. i hope you folks aren't nude atm ?
mircea_popescu: so the option is "either create a money that drives a government, or else create a money that drives a crazy" ?
asciilifeform: fortunately the 'pure reason' folks are yet only a subset.
mircea_popescu: from a "critique of pure reason" standpoint, it is.
mircea_popescu: you're supposed to be a stabilizing influence in my life, world! wtf is this!
asciilifeform: and money, as i stole from another mircea_popescu article, 'is a function of the forum'
mircea_popescu: the [fundamentally centralzising] question of "tell me the one and only god-given truth as to ownership" dissolves in a cloud of acceptances.
asciilifeform: not only is it not a problem, but it is not escapable
asciilifeform: or we can lift from a mircea_popescu article, 'Another aspect is that new blocks are mined by one group (miners) but have to be stored in perpetuity by another group (nodes). This creates a situation where X (users) pay Y (miners) to inconvenience Z (nodes), which is unsustainable not to mention sheer nonsense.' ☟︎
mircea_popescu: ie, humans have a very lengthy, selected ability to centralize against the possibility of a nice world.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it is a 'solution' in the sense that there is no exact pill against it, but is -ev for the player.
assbot: 7 results for 'prisoner's dilemma' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=prisoner%27s+dilemma
assbot: 5 results for 'axelrod' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=axelrod
asciilifeform: if had detail, we would be testing a proggy.
mircea_popescu: well you'll have to be a lot more detailed then
mircea_popescu: and i'm telling you, the solution to a broken knee is not to break an elbow.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not 'bug somewhere else', but a payoff matrix that doesn't equilibrate at 'herd'
mircea_popescu: trust me, unlike you that doesn't play, i ~created~ a homeostatic game world.
asciilifeform: picture that you were newcomen and built a cruddy steam engine.
asciilifeform: in that there was no built-in incentive for defecting from a miner cartel.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: my notion was that bitcoin suffered from a ~game-theoretically~ poor design.
thestringpuller: a coin which requires nuclear power plants worth of energy to mine single blocks
assbot: 0 results for 'chiral miners' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=chiral+miners
asciilifeform: did we ever do a thread on chiral miners ?
mircea_popescu: this is not a problem of scaling, even if it is a problem made apparent by scaling
mircea_popescu: i'll put some boxes to it as a seed, whosoever wants to do the same can do the same and it can take it from there.
asciilifeform: but afaik there is not a plausible alternative.
asciilifeform: the one problem that i was not able to solve, now just as a decade ago when i started thinking about it, is 'initial allocation.' satoshi's solution, as can be seen now, was retarded.
mircea_popescu: was a very instructive experiment.
mircea_popescu: and there is a very good vp on the table. gossip + proper hashes and ciphers + correct pow + proper relay/mine design + + +
asciilifeform: afaik there was not yet, to date, a from-scratch thing
mircea_popescu: we needed a 2nd for a long time anyway, wtf is this ripple eth ltc doge bs.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform for your own peace of mind : i would ~definitely~ support a beedog coin, irrespective of how cartel mining impasse is resolved or the eventual fate of current-bitcoin.
asciilifeform: nubbins` packs well, it was a mondo crate last time
mircea_popescu: if you get them in one package, should prolly be "all of them", ie a crate. esp if no hurry.
nubbins`: anyone else wants NSA tees for cost of shipping, send me a line
mircea_popescu: so you want to have a proper meld here, gossipd-bitcoin
asciilifeform: we don't even have a currently.
asciilifeform: or pick a number each hour.
asciilifeform: all you have is a box spewing 512b packets at 100/sec.
mircea_popescu: you can break bitcoin w/o breaking the internet, which is a problem.
nubbins`: do a 180 and see the park where nubs plays frisbee and smokes dope
assbot: Logged on 06-03-2016 13:56:16; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2016#1423491 << hashing whole block significantly weakens the protocol against attacks from non-bitcoin actors however. think your conn rst sufferences on a large scale.
thestringpuller: you are a unique snowflake asciilifeform
thestringpuller: you can launder up to $1200 at a time no questions asked
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: we have, but I think you overestimate the facilities required to execute such a plan...
assbot: Logged on 06-03-2016 14:01:07; nubbins`: alf is simultaneously saying he can't afford to get a box of shirts shipped to him, AND that he can't find anything to spend $10k bezzlars worth of btc on?
asciilifeform: srsly could've sworn nubbins` paid off a house...
nubbins`: a temporary situation, no longer required
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: it's better to be a light skinned house-boy than to work the fields...
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: the very poverty consists in the sort of things i do to ~not~ live 'in the projects', with roommates a la nubbins`, or eat recycled food, etc.
asciilifeform: nubbins`: being a slave, it would be stepping outside of my competence to attempt the use of any other kind of definition.
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: you should move to projects for a year an live like the actual slave negros.
nubbins`: that's a slave's definition
nubbins`: that's a function of how much you spend, not how much you make.
asciilifeform: nubbins`: as poor as any wretch. work-a-day-eat-a-day poor.
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: reminds me of affluent guy who ends up in witness protection washing rental cars for a living
assbot: Logged on 06-03-2016 13:44:29; nubbins`: he can't just move out of DC, he has to do it on a carrier fleet
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2016#1423702 << i'm not interested in becoming an even poorer and lower peon in a shittier country. it's living-off-capital or death plox. ☝︎
mircea_popescu: will the thing be buildable by others on a v process.
asciilifeform: so it's, at least without laboratory instruments, a once-per-device thing.
thestringpuller has a feeling he will be depressed when reading upcoming s.bbet statement
nubbins`: node warfare sort of is a thing already
thestringpuller: i figured node warfare would become a thing.
mircea_popescu: you could airdrop them from orbit on alf's house. seeing how he lives next door to obama's rural cousin #5460580, prolly give norad a good wake-up.
mircea_popescu: alf lives in a complicated world.
nubbins`: alf is simultaneously saying he can't afford to get a box of shirts shipped to him, AND that he can't find anything to spend $10k bezzlars worth of btc on? ☟︎
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2016#1423491 << hashing whole block significantly weakens the protocol against attacks from non-bitcoin actors however. think your conn rst sufferences on a large scale. ☝︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2016#1423469 << this is a while out yet. ☝︎
assbot: The necessary prerequisite for any change to the Bitcoin protocol on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1oZOJjK )
assbot: Tibanne comments on So it was a Fee Event? And everyone was screaming and I was still confused. ... ( http://bit.ly/1oZOJQT )
nubbins`: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/496v30/so_it_was_a_fee_event_and_everyone_was_screaming/d0pk4vm
assbot: No Such lAbs (S.NSA), January - February 2016 Joint Statement on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1oZOwNp )
nubbins`: but this may be a failing on my part ☟︎
nubbins` can't imagine the sort of mindset required to believe that the only two viable options for one's future are stasis or a $10mn windfall
nubbins`: he can't just move out of DC, he has to do it on a carrier fleet ☟︎
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: BTC just failed, now what? << It seems business as usual tho...or is #b-a closing shop?
nubbins`: in a perfect world where the transfer of such goods or the provision of such services was able to take place in absolute secrect
nubbins` sent a $17,000 package via fedex last year
thestringpuller: going to 0 as in game over? or going to 0 for a minute then we'll be back to $X price.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: it's a good place to store money when it's not in use...
nubbins`: "what can i buy" as a process of elimination isn't something i'm interested in participating in
nubbins`: shit, sorry, "what odds" is a newfy-ism
mircea_popescu: bitcoin, after night on a decade of empty posturing, has exactly no sort of useful anything on offer.
nubbins` can't imagine alf in a department store
nubbins`: she has a piece in book linked above
nubbins`: danielpbarron PM with mailing addy and i'll get a shipping quote
thestringpuller: it has a cloud on one side and scissors in in the desert on another side
danielpbarron: nubbins`, how much to send me a couple of those shirts :)
assbot: A Whale and Other Disorders #4 / PINK EYE PRINT COMPANY ... ( http://bit.ly/1QCStii )
nubbins`: http://www.pinkeyeprints.com/product/a-whale-and-other-disorders-4