1024800+ entries in 0.742s
Chaang-Noi: brendio i assume you will not pass anything
to pirate about bond ownership?
Chaang-Noi: night live is okay, but i doubt worth flying
to, lol
brendio: third
time. Might see angkor war, might not. Already been
twice :)
blazing: well i might hold onto it
then
blazing: i have six
tygrrbond-p bond for sale...sell at .8
EB250: no idea, I can not get in
to
the channel
blazing: did pirate make an announcement
today?
EB250: 9th is
the grand finale. Or is it
today?
EB250: blazing: where did you get
that idea?
EB250: no, I got few at 0.9 or close but
this is just play money.
blazing: chaang-noi why would you want
to buy pirate debt...i
thought pirate is done
Chaang-Noi: anyone want
to sell discounted pirate debt?
assbot: BDK [1@0.1BTC] paid: 0.0095545 BTC. Last price: 0.1 BTC. Capital gain: 0 BTC.
Total: 0.0095545 BTC. (9.6%)
assbot: Requesting data from GLBSE (might
take a while).
assbot: BDK [1@0.055BTC] paid: 0.0095545 BTC. Last price: 0.1 BTC. Capital gain: 0.045 BTC.
Total: 0.0545545 BTC. (99.2%)
assbot: Requesting data from GLBSE (might
take a while).
gribble: Best bid: 10.40016, Best ask: 10.45, Bid-ask spread: 0.04984, Last
trade: 10.45, 24 hour volume: 39452, 24 hour low: 10.2, 24 hour high: 10.87563
assbot: BDK [1@1BTC] paid: 0.0095545 BTC. Last price: 0.1 BTC. Capital gain: -0.9 BTC.
Total: -0.8904455 BTC. (-89%)
assbot: Requesting data from GLBSE (might
take a while).
DeaDTerra: If anyone want
to sell BDK, I am buying
then for 0.12 each :)
gribble: Best bid: 10.26, Best ask: 10.3, Bid-ask spread: 0.04000, Last
trade: 10.3, 24 hour volume: 38723, 24 hour low: 10.2, 24 hour high: 10.87699
gribble: Best bid: 10.251, Best ask: 10.3, Bid-ask spread: 0.04900, Last
trade: 10.3, 24 hour volume: 38288, 24 hour low: 10.2, 24 hour high: 10.8785
mircea_popescu: (contracts are written so
the owner can never sell more
than half is shares, i dunno if you read
them)
mircea_popescu: moreover,
the fact
that
the owner retains a majority of shares seems
to make
this plan a losing proposition.
Ignatius-otc: yes,
that is how I have seen it done in
the penny stock world. it's dilution really...but without printing more shares
mircea_popescu: Ignatius-otc
this would require you actually releasing false information or somesuch ? sort of like an insider
trading job ?
Ignatius-otc: You have 20 shares. You sell 10 shares for 1 BTC each. "bad news" hits, and now you offer your remaining 10 shares at 0.5BTC. You buyback shares from paic sellers for a 25-75% discount.
Took in 10 BTC from
the original sale of 10 shares, used less
than 10 BTC
to buy back
those 10 shares when a panic sell occured. Repeat
the process...our price is at 0.5 BTC now, sell 10 shares for 0.5 BTC. "bad news", your remaining 10 shares are
BTC-Mining: nay, I do not know anything about
terms
mircea_popescu: mk. so at some later point in
the future you shall have profited by
the drop last week.
BTC-Mining: that's why I put
them in a list... because
they're not
the same
mircea_popescu: heh. so, if you had a margined acct and shorted ON MPEX you could have made a lot more
there.
mircea_popescu: tho for instance if you made money on
the recent giga move downwards on glbse
mircea_popescu: well obviously
the higher
the volumes
the stabler
the prices.
BTC-Mining: I could hardly do as much on MPEX which only IPOs high rated companies like SatoshiDice.
The price seems
too stable.
mircea_popescu: Ignatius-otc but you would have
to set it
to be something.
mircea_popescu: BTC-Mining it might be
the case
that
the cost of your research in
terms of skill*time exceeds your profits by a significant margin.
BTC-Mining: I stay informed on
the issuers and latest development, I buy when
there's an opportunity, sell back before it's
too late.
Ignatius-otc: that is ebcause you demand
the price is
taken
to arbitrary points. in some markets
the price is whatever you set it
to be
mircea_popescu: i'm not saying it can't happen. im just
talking statistics.
mircea_popescu: Ignatius-otc but looky : my position
to begin with : 900mn worth of shares. my position
to end with : 60mn in cash and 810 mn worth of shares
BTC-Mining: I have yet
to make a loss on any GLBSE asset
Ignatius-otc: roughly yes. I was merely
trying
to say prohibiting
the printing of shares does not mean an issuer can not dilute.
BTC-Mining: then
that he started
to
trade assets for shares
mircea_popescu: BTC-Mining so you earnestly believe you can pick
them. more power
to you. in my experience neither
timers nor pickers make money irl, but you're welcome
to it.
BTC-Mining: The first being
that he needed a 1 million BTC IPO
mircea_popescu: i got 70mn for
the shares i sold, i bought
them back for 60 mn, hence 10 mhn profit, is
this
the system Ignatius-otc ?
mircea_popescu: i rebuy 10 million of my shares, price goes all
the way
to 9.
BTC-Mining: Diablo had lots of
telltale signs
that it was nonsense
mircea_popescu: now, i dump 10mn of my shares, price goes all
the way
to 5
mircea_popescu: burt anyway, let's see
this
thing. company has 1mn shares, i own 90mn of
them, it
trades at 10 currently.
BTC-Mining: of course
there fucking is a way
to pick
them up, you can just look up
the issuer
mircea_popescu: Ignatius-otc i might be either
thick skulled or missing something here.
Ignatius-otc: both were highly successful so I wondered why you called
the one method unsuccessful
mircea_popescu: BTC-Mining it just means
there's no rational way of pickingthem.
Ignatius-otc: no, I mean I ahve witnessed 2
types of penny stock scams. One, where
they dilute by continually printing enw shares and selling off until
the price per share is some small fraction of a cent.
then,
they restructure and repeat
the process. another
type, doesn't dilute by printing shares, but by
the method i have
tried
to desciribe
to you.
BTC-Mining: "anyone can make a stock and anyone can
then dillute it
to hell"
BTC-Mining: and people were
trying
to do a P2P stock exchange, unregulated
too of course
mircea_popescu: well
that's
the exact sense in which glbse is unregulated : anyone can make a stock and anyone can
then dillute it
to hell
BTC-Mining: Unregulated as no one decides of what is and is not appropriate in
transactions
Ignatius-otc: mp if you can please elaborate on why you said "things don't work out
that way.
this particular attack would made everyone rich irl if it really worked.".
this attack does work at
times, i have seen penny stock scams use it
BTC-Mining: Not unregulated in
that sense god dammit
mircea_popescu: bitcoin is
the paragon of closeness, hence it's value.
BTC-Mining: Well bitcoin is
technically an open, unregulated currency
too...
BTC-Mining: What do you not understand in
the fact GLBSE is a open market where anyone can issue?
mircea_popescu: i always said, i'd rather not list anything at all
than list dubious offerings.
BTC-Mining: That's exactly why
there was no default,
the market allows only few companies
mircea_popescu: just because
they're better
they will necessarily be fewer.
mircea_popescu: BTC-Mining
the
total market value of mpex listed assets is > 10x
total mkt value of glbse listed assets.
BTC-Mining: MPEX has almost no assets, it's an options
trading. As for assets,
there's S.DICE, Mpex itself, giga.etf and I
think brendio's funds?
mircea_popescu: things don't work out
that way.
this particular attack would made everyone rich irl if it really worked.
mircea_popescu: this
theory about force price down etc is (possibly) what pirate
thought he might accomplish
Ignatius-otc: sell shares, drop price, buyback panic sell, repeat. you never diluted in a
traditional sense, but
the result would be a fleecing of investors and a chart with a similar appearance...always
trending down. So mp you are saying no mpex asset has ever defaulted? wow
BTC-Mining: There's ways
to pick good stocks from
the bad ones
BTC-Mining: I went, over
the past month, from a 1200 portfolio value
to a 1500 portfolio value, on GLBSE...
mircea_popescu: there's very good reasons why pretty much everyone switched ship
this month, you see ?
mircea_popescu: read a little
the forum,
the people are quite frustrated.
mircea_popescu: BTC-Mining im just saying you have no rational way
to pick. and one flower
that made 20% is scarce compensation for all
the duds.
mircea_popescu: Ignatius-otc let's run a scenario. i own 90% of
the float, share
trades at 10. now i do what, sell 5% of
the float, share goes
to 5 ?
Ignatius-otc: but im no expert, if you say its impossible
to dilute in any way ill believe ya;)
Ignatius-otc: the market price of low liquidity assets can be manipulated by simply buying out asks and filling bids sufficiently
to where ones own orders are all
that remain. if
the issuer did
this instead of dilution i believe he could continually "flip"
the shares in a way similar
to if he had just kept printing shares with a plummeting share price