log☇︎
46100+ entries in 0.026s
bvt: asciilifeform: sure, cpp code won't be instrumented. the 'polled' mode was iirc in the guts of the ancient linux threads implementation. ☟︎
asciilifeform: where you had to explicitly yield a thread, or whole machine ground to halt
asciilifeform: 'polled' mode seems to resemble the 'cooperative multitasking' found on ancient crapple and win9x
asciilifeform: bvt: my reasoning is based on the docs description of how implemented. but certainly worth a test, if anyone can be arsed ( given the 'all loops gotta be doctored' thing, my understanding is that 'polled' proggy would choke if wedges inside a cppism )
bvt: may be. tbh i don't think i can reason on this q based on only the test code.
asciilifeform: bvt: whole point of multithreadism is to spread out the cpu-bulky work over cores, so i expect most cycles would be spend inside where enabled
bvt: you can enable polling per scope/loop, don't have to do it globally. re cpp things - true.
asciilifeform: not to mention, the s.mg folx invoke external cppisms , and these won't have poll markers inside'em no matter what you do
asciilifeform: currently i suspect that polling (even if can be made to work errywhere) will be 9000x moar expensive than longjmpism ( the latter only adds to cost of exceptions, the former -- to ~all~ loops )
bvt: no, they explicitly tell in the docs that you have to rebuild the runtime to use it on other systems
bvt: yes, the only reason i did not switch yet is the convenience of m-c-m for development (i.e. getting i386 and aarch64 builds ready using it took me a few minutes of config time)
asciilifeform: afaik there is exactly 0 win from gcc5+, and plenty of lose.
bvt: built myself, based on ave1s patches and musl-cross-make (https://github.com/richfelker/musl-cross-make/ , i had some experience with it so did the work rather quickly).
bvt: myeah, i will drop gnat2017. did not manage to make ave1's running quickly today, will switch on ~thursday
asciilifeform: i recommend to leave gcc5 entirely alone (unless specifically digging for lulz)
asciilifeform: gcc5 breakage extends into the Ada world << noshit, if yer on a gcc5istic gnat, all bets are off, they fucked the back end
asciilifeform: bvt: re the pragma polling bit : abort aint instantaneous, whereas the if A(I)'Terminated ... item happens immediately
bvt: ^ i got some really weird results here, would appreciate if someone tested the last snippet (constraint_error) on ave1's gnat.
feedbot: http://bvt-trace.net/2019/02/gnat-zero-cost-exceptions-and-asynchronous-task-aborting/ << bvt's backtrace -- GNAT Zero Cost Exceptions and Asynchronous Task Aborting
BingoBoingo: (MAUs), this would make Reddit's average revenue per user (ARPU) about $0.30." From the report: "
BingoBoingo: Meanwhile in the Heathen Studies department: "Reddit's latest funding round values its users at a lower price than any other social network. "The company announced Monday it had raised $300 million in its Series D investment round at a valuation of $3 billion," reports CNBC. "CNBC previously reported the company's annual revenue topped $100 million, according to sources familiar with the matter, and at 330 million monthly active users
BingoBoingo: Well with Trump's increasingly disappointing performance as "best clown in the circus"...
trinque: who says there are men in the femstate anyway
BingoBoingo: trinque: ty, Gotta keep the office of losers connected to Hillarity
feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/02/madame-secretary-mike-pompeo-declares-huawei-deployments-obstacle-to-us-partnership/ << Qntra -- Madame Secretary Mike Pompeo Declares Huawei Deployments "Obstacle To US Partnership"
BingoBoingo: WWW fixes and cleanup are the order of the week.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo if select thing worked you could just put that link in the !!billing
asciilifeform: aa ty BingoBoingo
BingoBoingo: customer codes to customers. Will issue GPgrams.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> BingoBoingo: couldja plox add the billing calendar (with the hash-pseudonymised subscriber names from earlier) to the public www ? so folx dun have to ask why they're being billed at time t and for what << We have customer accounts here on the public www http://pizarroisp.net/pizarro-records/ listed just below the price points. I have been updating it as part of compiling the statements. I don't recall if I pass out
a111: Logged on 2019-02-12 06:29 phf: asciilifeform: there's also sgi machines with their famously well built x11 implementation. i believe there's no source for that one though
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895192 << before this gets lost -- irix has reputation as stable, but porous as all fuck ( sgi never apparently gave half a shit ) ; not that we're at risk of cribbing from it, as you pointed out, 0 src ☝︎
asciilifeform: longer obv. better, tho still need a # of independent runs .
mircea_popescu: shorter experiments not statistically better still, irrespective of that nonsnese.
asciilifeform: makes it quite tricky to get trooly precise timing for anyffing with serious cpu cost
asciilifeform: that sorta thing is maddening on unix pc.
a111: Logged on 2019-01-10 14:08 asciilifeform: aaand to round off : it vanished on the test box also. culprit appears to have been a running raid-verify job...
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: recall the http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-10#1886261 incident ? ☝︎
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: In early february you paid the Janaury invoice issued in Janaury. It's the case you've come into post paying, but on the strength of your being mircea_popescu I have not found reason to be alarmed or fuss.
mircea_popescu: there is that.
asciilifeform: ( 1 moar reason why i'd like that msdos cross-gnat.. on msdos, the wall clock time is invariant )
mircea_popescu: i do not believe larger experiment gets drowned. on the contrary, larger experiment ~drowns the churn~.
asciilifeform: it's perfectly good, but to get decent resolution you end up needing gigantic # of repeats ( and unixism machine churn begins to drown the signal )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you propose the init=clock end=clock method no good ?
asciilifeform: ( so as to get actual ticktimes for this & other empiricals )
asciilifeform: i really gotta genesis my rdtsc asmism thingie for gnat
mircea_popescu: stops probabilistically eventually -- which seems a bad idea until you realise you get counts, can compare those.
asciilifeform: ( would work so long as you take care to return. but i think that is obv )
mircea_popescu: might need some fiddling to get the numbers right, this one might only grow still. but anyways.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: couldja plox add the billing calendar (with the hash-pseudonymised subscriber names from earlier) to the public www ? so folx dun have to ask why they're being billed at time t and for what
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo is the case i am actually postpaying rather than prepaying here and so early feb i actually paid for jan ?
BingoBoingo will add "concrete period" instead of billing cycle to the invoicing worksheet
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: believe or not, there are ancient moldy irons without interrupt controllers.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895478 << iirc that's how zcx even became a thiong on gcc. ☝︎
mircea_popescu: not THAT many
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: good chance to fill the stack
a111: Logged on 2019-02-12 18:27 diana_coman: hence I wanted to actually add some handlers in there and see but atm it's still working on the full run loops-only so will see after that
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895474 << i suppose the next test is a multicall, keep calling two procedures from each other and returning randomly. ☝︎
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo for which month is this ?!
asciilifeform not tested.
diana_coman: both with win32 threads
diana_coman: no, windows supposedly has zcx with win32 threads
asciilifeform: i dun see why you'd care, tho, unless game ~client~ also gotta thread.
BingoBoingo: Pizarro invoices sent based off the auction settled price point of 1 BTC = 3247 USD
deedbot: Invoiced jurov 0.04364028 << TBF colocation monthly
deedbot: Invoiced trinque 0.04364028 << Colocation monthly, shared hosting waived due to January downtim
asciilifeform: not that i aint willing to port to e.g. vax or whatever. for a fee..
asciilifeform: currently i have 0 intention of supporting the thing on sad platforms, folx who insist on crapple or microshit oughta do it with own hands
asciilifeform: diana_coman: gnat on crapple , i am surprised that it worx at all.
asciilifeform: will be interesting to see what comes of this. if cost remains small , it hardly makes sense to bother with 'zcx' then
diana_coman: perhaps that's just because too few loops; I'll report back when I have the numbers though it might take a while
diana_coman: hence I wanted to actually add some handlers in there and see but atm it's still working on the full run loops-only so will see after that ☟︎
asciilifeform: hm. would seem that the cost delta is very small, then.
diana_coman: according to ref manual, of handlers (i.e. regardless of whether exceptions are raised or not)
asciilifeform: i.e. only affects cpu cost of exceptions, rather than all jmp.
a111: Logged on 2019-02-12 14:13 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895234 << ffa uses exceptions strictly as 'fucking stop whole program (and if it's running on a micro, whole machine, and flash 'dead!' lamp) right nao!' , so won't impact. my understanding is that it'd impact only speed of the ~exceptions~, longjump is slower cuz it crosses pages -- cachaistically.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: i suspect then , that i was right re http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895287 ☝︎
diana_coman: asciilifeform, that was just the 3 loops (a,b,c); over 1000 runs, the avg were similar with and without longjmp i.e. 0.46744 without and 0.46754 with longjmp; atm running the full version aka a-v and that hasn't yet finished
asciilifeform: diana_coman: when that thing is done running, plox to tar it up, i'ma replicate on other irons ( if effect is cache-sensitive, may show diff b/w irons )
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895366 << hm what was the runtime ~with~ longjmp ? (or still going ? ) ☝︎
asciilifeform: ( fwiw i (and other ru warez folk) like ancient at&t 'djvu' format, it is moar or less jpeg with optional ocr searchable track. a 300MB pdf turd becomes a 2-3MB djvu. )
a111: Logged on 2019-02-12 08:00 diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895120 -> yep, that was precisely my ref when looking at Ada multi-threading and what support it offers; it actually reads a bit better than the barnes' progr in 2012 but it's more focused, obv
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895198 << btw diana_coman , if you know of other readables , plox to post (or at least the titles, i can dig up with own hands ) ; i oughta have posted burnes et al earlier, but seems like errybody is allergic to scans , so didn't hurry . and lemme know if you end up wanting others, i have the 'spark' text for instance. ☝︎
BingoBoingo: Buenas tardes asciilifeform
asciilifeform: guten tag BingoBoingo
BingoBoingo: ^ Thank you jurov
asciilifeform: in e.g. airplane, 'exception' should mean that the entire comp shuts down and transfers control to 1 of the hot spare duplicates. ☟︎
asciilifeform: ( at which point, the job of the proggy is to 1) tell operator ~which~ iron smoked 2) come to full stop, failing 'deadly' or 'safe' depending on design context )
asciilifeform: ( and in the FG reader -- again cuz the underlying i/o routines produce'em )
asciilifeform: ( ffacalc ~does~ have a handler, strictly for trapping invalid cmdline args, ln. 75. )
asciilifeform: ( invoking coad ~can~ use handling, if it wants, the lib itself duncare about this )
asciilifeform: the part i dun use is 'handling', they dun get handled, they go to the last-chance trap where proggy stops.
asciilifeform: ( and since nobody asked 'where exactly does ffa use exceptions? i dun see any throws' -- answr is, ~all~ ada coad where bounds checks are enabled, theoretically 'uses' exception, if you break a bounds check what do you suppose happens.)
asciilifeform: btw, if you use exceptions, erry thread needs own last-chance exception eater (they dun cross thread boundaries)
mircea_popescu: tedious or tardious ?
asciilifeform: i usedta have a collection of these, threw out, got trdious
a111: Logged on 2015-06-22 21:22 mircea_popescu: ascii_field this goes right into our discussion about how the only reason lisp is ok where c is shot is that the hordes haven't sat on lisp but on c, would have been the other way around if they had sat the other way.
asciilifeform: 'my thesis advisor ate my pet fish'
asciilifeform: 'my thesis advisor heils hitler, wat do'
asciilifeform: where was this?