log☇︎
267100+ entries in 1.702s
Duffer1: you propose to allow buy/sell a price different than quoted?
mircea_popescu: do you by any chance misrepresent "hft" to mean "a simulacra of amazon's autobid function" ?
deanclkclk: I have a value added propition mircea_popescu nad what I'm bring is like high frequency trading
deanclkclk: especially when you get an account..you also get a bank account
mircea_popescu: exchanges currently seem to have a lot of problems, but if you trust any one you are best served by asking them what they can process
asciilifeform: everyone likes to imagine that there lives a hero.
mircea_popescu: could you have been a one man conspiracy to take it all over ? certainly. did you ? no. why not ? well...because of soft constraints.
mircea_popescu: i was going to go "oh, the blessings of romanian living, i just drained a bottle of tuica out of my barrel in the cellar now i have nicely cold tuica", but i guess i should pass.
benkay: it's a low-rez jpeg and they're small!
mjr_: mircea_popescu: i thought the fee was 10 bitcoins for VIP, not that I am complaining, I just haven't looked in a while
benkay: mircea_popescu: that's a strainer.
mircea_popescu: pankkake it's a fair lay lmao
benkay: although if you foot the bill for travel to romania you can have a go at talking her into your dungeon.
mircea_popescu: speaking of lays : benkay take the girls pic, post it, have her come by i'll give her a bitcoin so she can build her independent wealth.
mircea_popescu: francis_wolke you'll ahve to put that in the form of a question.
mjr_: went public on the pink sheets...as i was recommending bitcoin companies do a year ago
mjr_: but i plan on using it as a private consulting company for btcshares.com
mjr_: its mostly a joke mircea_popescu
mjr_: restarting a brand new LTCM
mircea_popescu: "A group of people associated with multiple world powers." << no. actual internationalisation happened in 2013, was announced on trilema.
mircea_popescu: " Anyone intelligent enough to create Bitcoin will have aligned themselves with some sort of governmental body." << this is a weak assumption.
mircea_popescu: half the time when i select something a final char is omitted
mircea_popescu: in a world where every "idea" is in fact chewed and spit and chewed so many times by so many generations by now all that's left is the spit itself, in which vaguely one can recognise the marks left by the spit of whoever long ago, in the manner new spits mix today because of the presence of that old saliva of yore,
mircea_popescu: pankkake with a tenuous grasp of c practice.
asciilifeform: then you will know what it feels like to be a perfect 'conspiracy' of one man.
mircea_popescu: <francis_wolke> A large scale, important project, developed in secret by USG. << how does bitcoin meet any of your criteria ?
mircea_popescu: if every great painting in history is a manhattan project then venice and the low countries own the us in manhattanness, srsly.
mircea_popescu: a manhattan project is like escavating a tunnel under the nunnery.
mircea_popescu: creating a new currency is like fucking an altar boy. nobody needs to know anything.
mircea_popescu: francis_wolke but a new currency isn't a manhattan project.
asciilifeform: 'glorious secret undertakings like Manhattan p. carry on' is quite similar of a hypothesis to 'god exists'
francis_wolke: mircea_popescu: You simply don't have to tell all that many people when you're creating a new currency - and even if you do, who is going to listen?
asciilifeform: (lifespan of a strong man in B. was reportedly six months.)
francis_wolke: Still not sure why you both think we live in a world devoid of Manhattan projects btw.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what's the lifespan of a redditard ?
asciilifeform: could just as well calculate the life of a somali pirate, or oil driller.
asciilifeform: accident stats. a debatable figure, could be off by as much as 10x.
asciilifeform: immortality is a tricky beast - biology aside! the life expectancy of a daily wash. d.c. beltway driver is maybe 200 years.
asciilifeform: 'i am a controlled munition.'
asciilifeform: any moron can waltz into a russian academic bookstore and buy all he can eat.
mircea_popescu: a "reasonably intelligent observer"
asciilifeform: keeping a secret from the man on the street is trivial. often, you could run his nose in it and it will stay 'secret.'
asciilifeform: but it does not follow that either was a 'perfect secret'
asciilifeform: it is very easy to draw mistaken conclusions from the fact that the 'man on the street' was entirely unaware of manhattan p. (or 'operation gladio', for a more recent example)
mircea_popescu: when the options are a1, an you will not find out of a population of k, k <n, a single person capable of keeping secret X.
mircea_popescu: when the options are a1, a2, you will out of a population of 100mn find 50 people able to keep secret X
francis_wolke: A large scale, important project, developed in secret by USG.
francis_wolke: mircea_popescu: I fail to see how this leads to a USG without Manhattan projects.
asciilifeform: francis_wolke: you want a good read: "The Art of Not Being Governed." (James C. Scott)
mircea_popescu: francis_wolke let's consider a simpler alternative. obama fdr and lincoln all broke the law, grossly. in all cases the courts duly signed off on this.
asciilifeform: it is merely a strong conjecture.
francis_wolke: asciilifeform: Actually, I'd be interested in a reading list irrespective of that.
francis_wolke: asciilifeform: That we're living in a world without Manhattan projects.
francis_wolke: asciilifeform: If you have a reading list to support this claim, I'd be happy to read it.
asciilifeform: i tend to agree with MP and others who conclude that we no longer live in a world where manhattan projects happen.
asciilifeform: it's rather like, say you were permitted to squeeze off one shot from a small arm at your enemy. does this amount to 'kill switch'? what if you miss? what if he's got a tough hide.
asciilifeform: there is a 'fuck things up quite a bit' switch, possibly. (as described in my old piece)
mircea_popescu: *that* is a figment of your imagination, like the tits on the goddesses.
mircea_popescu: there is no nor can there ever be such a "kill switch".
francis_wolke: asciilifeform: Control, with respect to bitcoin, would be whoever has their hand on the 'kill switch'. Assuming that the guy with a nuke is stable.
asciilifeform: if the only things you can 'own' are those that fit in your coffin, then: stalin owned only an overcoat. and a few coin in his pocket.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform incidentally : http://trilema.com/2014/democracy-and-finance-dont-mix-the-math-involved/#comment-98112 we're having a little dispute there.
asciilifeform: this goes back to the 'what is control' question from earlier, as well as MP's recent discussion of 'owning a cow'
asciilifeform: stalin. owned: a coat.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform fun anecdote : romania's ruler for the 90s decade owner... a house.
asciilifeform: in what magic book is it written that '1%' (of what...) is a useful proxy for 'those who rule'
asciilifeform: 'it's not a bug, it's a feature' (TM)
asciilifeform: Duffer1: one can easily picture a set of aims that these things, which you aren't particularly fond of, help to advance.
asciilifeform: re: imagination: gedankenexperiment time. let's imagine that i imagine there's a cleaner way to solve sha(Y)=X than brute force. i pursue this line of inquiry, and the imagined turns into the actual.
francis_wolke: asciilifeform: A while back you mentioned that the rulers of today are only good at misleading the public. I agree that the *visible* rulers are good at this - but can't imagine someone like Ben Bernanke caring so little about his future that the stupid are allowed to rule.
asciilifeform: and there is never any question of turning them loose (that'd be the end of organized civilization as a concept) but change of masters.
asciilifeform: modern 'debt politics' is simply a maintenance of the historic norm (most humans being formally enslaved to someone or other) by other means.
mircea_popescu: not everybody needs a college degree, even if they're white, and even if their parents have "expectations".
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i suspect the problem is more like this : if i give you a debt package, there will be a cost to evaluate its value. if that cost likely exceeds its value, you may opt to just throw the whole thing away.
mircea_popescu: but this is in no way time based, and in no way a festival.
mircea_popescu: this requires an economy built by people who see more than a year into the future.
francis_wolke: mircea_popescu: If the USD went to 0 btc - it would be a 'breaking of the tablets', regardless.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the basic point that stands, supposing there is one, is that caging monkeys has a certain cost
mircea_popescu: yes well. back in those days a one year interval was far outside the mental abilities of even "specialist" "bankers" to plan.
mircea_popescu: francis_wolke you realise the entire breaking tablets thing is strictly a function of man's early monkey-like state and has no practical importance today. do you ?
asciilifeform: a more interesting question for 'political' aficionados could be 'who has the power to kill while making the death look like bad luck?' and 'who can silently bend the system towards some desired end'
asciilifeform: i.e. the six or so global telecoms with de-facto control over the net could switch it off like a lamp. (provisions against this scenario are quite feasible, but no one has cared to consider much less make them.)
Duffer1: there are innumerable external factors, but for purposes dissecting the statement: "Given that a handful of parties control Bitcoin..." is the answer not miners? (or the mining network)
asciilifeform: once again 'controls' is a meaningless question
asciilifeform: describing 'power' as a scalar is naive. there is power to destroy, for example, which is arguably held by whoever controls the satoshi mega-hoard
asciilifeform: MisterE: if you were the hypothetical king of the miners, you have every incentive to engineer a ruse like this.
Duffer1: a fair point
Duffer1: start with the first assertion "..a handful of parties control bitcoin.." miners control bitcoin, anyone can edit/audit the code, but it's miners that vote with their hashpower to run updated versions or not
asciilifeform: francis_wolke: and so, when a government pumps out propaganda by the truckload re: how it maintains a stable of uniquely-capable cryptologic janissaries, what can you conclude?
francis_wolke: Duffer1: I transcribed it from a piece of paper I found lying on the ground.
asciilifeform: francis_wolke: if you ruled over a 'center of cryptography and mathematics,' would you wish this to be known to your enemies?
jurov: many of people with extended lifespans will seek such a position, official or unofficial
francis_wolke: asciilifeform: I'm not aware of any others, but if you've got a reading list...
francis_wolke: jurov: RLE is still a while off, and millitary power dosn't cease to exist b/c Bitcoin. I'm sure that neither Peter Theil, or MP have any particular love for their respective governments. But they're not stupid and recognize that if some elite is going to extend their lifespans, they may need protection.
francis_wolke: jurov: ... MP is a billionaire?
francis_wolke: jurov: Government is the formalization of power. Anyone doing anything interesting with radical life extension will have spooks on their doorstep momentarily. There are a number of powerful / rich people who don't want to die.
pankkake: "too fragmented to act as a cohesive whole" it doesn't have to
benkay: but hey you're a lisper so i likely won't get downright mean
benkay: and RLE is a symptom of the too much money problem
benkay: in that frame, why would anyone smart enough to read the implications of a non-state ultimately fungible currency align themselves with a state that's doomed?