228600+ entries in 0.131s
davout: the "let program select outputs
to spend" half works half of
the
time, like you said "knapsack problem"
davout: in
the same way a gun is usable "naked", just don't point it
to your face!
mod6: <+davout> mod6: i
think it would actually be
the least painful part
to
test << anyway, i hope so. im sure
there will be more discussion in coming months.
davout: i didn't say it had
to come *with*
trb
davout: script it on
top of
trb, don't integrate it directly in
there is what I
think is
the correct solution
davout: i content
that
these should be
the ~only~ knobs at
trb level
davout: asciilifeform: my opinion is
that
the system doesn't even have any business *attempting*
to select which outputs should be spent, let
the user plug whichever system he wants on
top of
the low level "raw
tx from arbitrary inputs"
tool set
mod6: i read 'errors are
tolerated'. and freaked.
davout: asciilifeform: i'm simply after
the functionality of crafting raw
txes from an arbitrary of outputs
that *I* select, not wallet functionality in
the sense of letting
the system work out
the details of "send X bitcoin
to Y address"
mod6: <+asciilifeform> mod6: error can be
tolerated in ~autopilot
that user can disable at all
times~, i.e. it ~recommends~ a
tx, user can review before firing << umm, i dunno about
this.
mod6: anyway, im just working
through
the beginning stages here. so im certainly not an expert on rawtxns
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: he's still digesting "how
to cut
the wallet", let him ask for
the
things for which he's going
to ask
mod6: and some other
tools like 'listunspent' etc.
mod6: im not fixing
the wallet, in
this case, ftr. i'm just putting in
the ability
to create and send a raw
tx.
mod6: we'll be discussing more in
the near future i do suspect, Sir.
mod6: anyway! glad
to have
the help, and
the experience from someone who uses
this end of bitcoin quite a bit.
mod6: no room for error here, lest someone sends all
their coins out as a large fee, or some crazyness.
ben_vulpes: davout's a rubyist, don't expect rigor in
terminology from him mod6 :P
mod6: i
think over all it's a decent approach. have some pre-crafted
transactions, and see how it goes.
this is minimum. i wanna make sure we don't just capture "happy-path" but, all edge cases
too.
mod6: those are not really unit
tests,
those are functional
tests. but yeah.
davout: yeah,
that's something
that seems
to me pretty easily
testable in a "isolated unit
tests" way
ben_vulpes: create and sign at least may be
testable via
the boost
testing framework
that's already in place
davout: try
to craft a bunch of
transactions, sign
them, it either works or doesn't work,
testing
this functionality doesn't seem
to depend on a lot of external, hard
to reproduce, state
ben_vulpes: mod6: "test[ing]
this" is actually how i got on
the alpha centauri miner quest
mod6: really? why do you
think so?
davout: mod6: i
think it would actually be
the least painful part
to
test
mod6: and am going
to
try
to build
tools, if needed,
to help
test
this.
mod6: well, ... feel free. but i
think
the coding part aside, which isn't going
to be horribru, since a lot of it is backport anyway. but
the
testing is gonna be gnarly.
davout: pretty much
the only
thing i personally need
to be able
to rm -rf all
traces of prb from my boxen
davout: yeah, ben_vulpes
told me in your very chan, if i can help it i'd be happy
to, it does sound like a pretty good starting point for me
to hack on
trb
mod6: well, was, anyway. once
the new changes for V are complete/tested/released, will be back on it.
davout: hence my previous questions about
the state of
this particular functionality in
trb
davout: what do you mean? i create
transactions from arbitrary unspent outputs, sign
them, and broadcast
them
davout: ok, ~/blox/ass_to_mouth.rb is working, we'll see how
that goes
davout: asciilifeform: you mean it files rough edges off every single
time?
a111: Logged on 2016-12-30 19:04 davout: asciilifeform: why is
there a specific -caneat flag? is
there something specifically dangerous about eating blocks?
ben_vulpes: because it has
to keep
track of
the inputs for all of
the addresses it made
ten minutes ago
davout: also i'm getting a "Flushing wallet.dat" after each eatblock, eats ~50ms each
time
mod6: jurov: in
that howto, you'll find a series of both offline steps, and online steps. you can choose your own adventure.
ben_vulpes: jurov: have you run msft updater
today? :P
davout: asciilifeform: why is
there a specific -caneat flag? is
there something specifically dangerous about eating blocks?
☟︎ jurov: ok, i'll rather start again from
the beginning. what's
the newest v.pl version?
jurov: ben_vulpes et al.: how you want
to present
this in lxr? or are
there more steps?
a111: Logged on 2016-12-29 22:54 ben_vulpes: jurov: would you be so kind as
to update
the lxr with makefiles.vpatch ?
mircea_popescu: well, dunno about "than anyone else" in
that very general form, but certainly more
than you'd expect or he'd have hoped.
phf: for
the republic, not for hitler. he lacks
that certain "good german" spirit, ja
mircea_popescu: he's written more webfacing stuff
than ~everyone else. he has
teh red army spirit.
phf: true, but alf also "won't
touch
the web"
trinque: and forgo
the
transactional write of
the form
mircea_popescu: of course random dorks go on about how no such labs will go out of business
through
the unlikely avenue of delivering what is clearing 1mn/year worth of services out of <1k/month, but hey.
trinque: then from
there you can optimize and say "I don't care if one guy gets stale form, need moar speed"
mircea_popescu: phf yes, but a fine approach
to answering "what is
the basis of alf's value as an engineer" is pointing out
that he runs phuctor on
the phuctor box, which fails
to cost 5k/mo.
trinque: consider
the case where a form is generated based on db state, and
the validity of
that form depends on db state
trinque: the reason I flip
the process and say
that db writes static www, rather
than www reads db, is
that
the write of www matter can be
transactional with db state update.
mircea_popescu: jurov
trilema db never crashed, in 9+ years and however many quintillion queries.
phf: well, it's also reason why
the kind of stuff you could run on a beefy dreamhost now requires $5k/mo amazon rds instance
mircea_popescu: to go into
trinque 's mullings about
the meaning of
things and items.
mircea_popescu: which is just about what
the web MEANS. www = "that data exploration mechanism which ocasionally puts out old data, of an unspecified age but younger
than x".
a111: Logged on 2016-12-30 17:56 mircea_popescu: jurov no ; but i am fine with wwwtron ocasionally reading a field
that has meanwhile been updated, and giving old, of an unspecified age but less
than x
time.
phf: dirty read would definitely solve me a lot of headache now,
though not enough motivation
to switch
to mysql. not so much when i worked on oracle for a g-sib where you want acid, so instead "avoid bad writes"
mircea_popescu: anyway.
this has been, at least
to me, an informative excursion.
trinque: sure, but
the
tool for vast piles of relational
time series data looks very much like relational database, but not for idiots.
mircea_popescu: this point has some merit, but we're reading "arbitrary" stuff not arbitrary stuff, it's addressed
to
the db abstraction which is allowed
to handle it, not directly
to pointers.
jurov: my point is, if you want
to read arbitrary stuff at arbitrary
time, you must *carefully design* for it. you don;t get it for free on c machine
jurov: because
the db was in
the middle of balancing some datastructure?
mircea_popescu: dude
the fact
that every other girl in your class is a slut isn't going
to feed you or your baby.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-30 17:49 jurov: mircea_popescu: you would
trade speed for occassionally getting garbage when you call read()?