asciilifeform: 'flee,' said the fly; 'fly,' said the flea...

asciilifeform presently lightly occupied with a couplea unrelated things

asciilifeform: <jurov> s.qntr arrived << my broadcast also coming soonish

asciilifeform: haha aha.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu> but i never put any serious effort into electrical engineering! << said the chap with his own bitcoind running on soviet trinary comp

asciilifeform: there breatheth a man who has not heard of 'qemu' ?

asciilifeform: l0l

asciilifeform: 'hey hey, ho, ho,' dns in bitcoind 'has got to go!!'

asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=1181853joe_sacco_buffoons_tale.png << l33t w4r3z scan. this comic was probably not intentionally about the collapse of fiat world, but is a good parable for it regardless.

asciilifeform: and ahahaha we know, it was because it lacked a 'big daddy' to cry to

asciilifeform: wonder if the muppet ever wondered why his pissant kingdom was ever occupied by ru.

asciilifeform: http://cryptome.org/2015-info/dragoon/pict21.jpg << very special l0lsauce

asciilifeform: commodore, for instance, had the out

asciilifeform: anyway it was usually the tv which lacked rca in

asciilifeform never had 'nes' but had 'commodore 64'

asciilifeform: i remember those.

asciilifeform: aha those.

asciilifeform: ^ eu welcomes reich IV as it welcomed III

asciilifeform: http://cryptome.org/2015-info/dragoon/dragoon-ride.htm << wtf

asciilifeform: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/urbit-dev/zhMRI9hn4KI/bMYtcr9o5QkJ << unrelated mega-l0l

asciilifeform: how else would it output

asciilifeform: nubbins`: why ?

asciilifeform has not been to a tv store in a very long time

asciilifeform: last i checked

asciilifeform: nubbins`: most tv sets still come with ntsc jacks

asciilifeform: jurov: dotnet!

asciilifeform: i wouldn't. fucking hate ntsc and 60hz flicker

asciilifeform: and what the serious tradeoffs are.

asciilifeform: i think everyone here knows what an emulator is

asciilifeform: adjustable by buying faster physical cpu, lol

asciilifeform: or it would be a joke

asciilifeform: and before anyone asks, the ram is adjustable!

asciilifeform: (it supports other, more realistic archs too, which i actually forgot because never tried)

asciilifeform: if using gxemul, i was speaking specifically of http://gxemul.sourceforge.net/gxemul-stable/doc/machines/machine_testmips.html

asciilifeform: jurov: i can't say i'm creaming my pants with excitement over the idea of doing this. but so far the alternatives have been disappointing

asciilifeform: jurov: openbsd is solving a rather different problem, 'waltzing' it on variety of archs

asciilifeform: is deedbot dead ?

asciilifeform: jurov: the good thing about an emulator is that you can emulate machine of any size, providing you have one 20x or so that size.

asciilifeform: i am also open to using a bsd of one kind or another

asciilifeform: or cannot be used.

asciilifeform: jurov: clearly this is part of the spec, it must build for a) self b) other archs

asciilifeform: or add packages

asciilifeform: we don't need to upgrade it ever

asciilifeform: buildroot

asciilifeform: nubbins`: not gentoo for the (so far, hypothetical) emulated machine

asciilifeform: deedbot...?

asciilifeform: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/11V97ED

asciilifeform: dated feb. 14 2010

asciilifeform: ^ my snapshot

asciilifeform: 38108c7e4f1332bf80046a63e4a7c5e0fbce7f83a62fdeaa4518ef02947d7de83aac20b0307d286b7eb5d9c721b8400d449d4f244b2bc9358a2502fa21f56b73 /usr/portage/distfiles/gxemul-0.6.0.tar.gz

asciilifeform: nubbins`: yes, that's the whole point.

asciilifeform: fourth then.

asciilifeform: aha lol

asciilifeform: of trying to get to the bottom of why the thing built for some folks

asciilifeform: and carry on with our old approach.

asciilifeform: the third choice, included for completeness, is that we do none of this

asciilifeform: but is a more complex beast

asciilifeform: which you can physically get.

asciilifeform: including i386 and x86_64

asciilifeform: qemu on the other hand emulates many physical machines

asciilifeform: and mips is a very simple and well-defined cpu arch.

asciilifeform: it has simplified hardware, not copied from any physical machine sold. quite like many similar emulators used in schools

asciilifeform: http://gxemul.sourceforge.net

asciilifeform: but eliminates several holes-through-which-the-night-walks-in

asciilifeform: does not make the code smarter, no

asciilifeform: thinkaboutit

asciilifeform: why? -- because you know it cannot be using the system's libs

asciilifeform: if the cross-compile is failing because it's a cross-compile << cross-compile is the gold standard for correctness

asciilifeform: like we now do for 'pogo'

asciilifeform: mod6: cross compile

asciilifeform: you can still take the code and build elsewhere - if you know how

asciilifeform: not stuck. just gives a golden reference

asciilifeform: all compilation is cross-compilation, really

asciilifeform: (gcc doesn't care what it runs on)

asciilifeform: but we're cross-compiling anyway

asciilifeform: only a textbook 'ideal' mips cpu that never existed

asciilifeform: <nubbins`> uh does gxemul emulate x86? << very much not!

asciilifeform: if you have physical hardware, you do not control all of the variables

asciilifeform: mod6: again, iso for what box

asciilifeform: i use gxemul in cardano work

asciilifeform: but a 'textbook' mips plus bitmap graphics

asciilifeform: these do not focus on any -physical- machine that existed in life

asciilifeform: like gxemul

asciilifeform: there -are- even simpler emulators

asciilifeform: it is a simple enough beast

asciilifeform: nubbins`: i have used it for dev work for many years.

asciilifeform: jurov: 'supported' means what ?

asciilifeform: because we -would- have to eventually audit the binaries.

asciilifeform: the other non-negotiable requirement is that it be -small-

asciilifeform: c

asciilifeform: with, yes, maximally detailed instructions made publi

asciilifeform: given that i do not especially feel like publishing the entire contents of my disk, nor could you replicate my machine easily (most of the components are no longer produced) - the next best thing is to somehow create an equivalent

asciilifeform: the only -canonical- parent of a given build on my box is my particular hardware plus my particular disk contents

asciilifeform: let's rephrase a bit

asciilifeform: mod6: i want a script that will build all of the "accepted"/"blessed" versions << notice that this is where we were with bitcoind ?

asciilifeform: what then.

asciilifeform: mod6: say i publish a recipe for constructing said image (runs on, e.g., qemu-system-mipsel). and then you do it, and we learn that your disk image differs from mine which differs from nubbins` which differs from mircea_popescu's etc

asciilifeform: try to understand why i am hesitant to put out a binary image for folks to run

asciilifeform: virtualization of pc arch only works on pc arch.

asciilifeform: nubbins`: i'd rather have something that isn't as dependent on pc