2300+ entries in 0.002s
mircea_popescu: sure,
the expectation on
the part of
the naive patient
that he may be healed might have
to be disabused now and again ; sure,
the expectation on
the part of
the naive doctor,
that he may practice what he knows without getting killed by chtulhu for no comprehensible reason at arbitrary
times should hold as much as it possibly can.
mircea_popescu: you're
to come up with some way
to deal with
the psychological
tension on your own, and sure, whatever works for you'd better be good enough. however, what he's saying, and correctly, is
that investment in supposed "identity"
to resolve
the matter's a way
to make yourself dumber
than you need
to be.
mircea_popescu: now,
this baseline
truth is psychologically painful
to doctors, so
there's
two classes :
the kind who go into research, and
the kind who put diplomas on
their walls.
these might even overlap, but
the point remains : as far as
the people you can't help are concerned, you're not helping.
there's no way out of
this, and word magic, labes etc won't fix it.
mircea_popescu: this latter bit might even inquire "are you even a hospital
then ?!", and
the only proper answer's
that... no, you aren't. you're a hospital for all
those other people, but not for pancreatic cancer guy.
mircea_popescu: but anyway, from
the perspective of
the patient, he goes in wanting
to be fixed. he's done his part. some of
these patients who've done
their part will hear "ok, do
this, don't do
that" and some will hear "we don't know"
mircea_popescu: as
time goes by,
the first list grows (though
the 2nd list doesn't shorten), and so while any cultivared man of means could be a doctor in 2000, only ~i and such can be de facto "general practitioners"
today... wait, nothing's changed.
mircea_popescu: obviously, people are complicated enough such
that at ANY point (meaning, in
the
times of hipocrates as
today)
there's going
to be a list of very easily remedied dysfunctions and a list of very unremediable dysfiunctions.
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 20:24:16 jfw: AFAIK even
the ol' USA has not quite reached
the point where you're still liable even if you put
the "warning: hot coffee is hot" warning on
the hot coffee
mircea_popescu: the difference between
the subsistence hunter and
the instagram foodie isn't merely
that
the subsistence hunter doesn't have marble countertops or cuisinarts. a point readily verified by giving him some.
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 19:54:12 jfw:
http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2020-01-24#1957173 - regarding
the "because"
there:
there was perhaps a degree of
teaching it because we'd built it, but I see it more
the other way - a
text-only Linux being a good choice for
the job specifically because it doesn't have
the GUI crutch and CLI illiteracy is one of
the bigger barriers
that otherwise intelligent people face
to using serious
mircea_popescu: gales or no gales,
the man who can't cat | grep is closer
to a boy
than any other man.
mircea_popescu: so you know, as far as
the life prospects,
the future evolution, however you will name
the sum-total potential of a person's existence, understanding how
to command line is more important
than meeting
their father. it'll certaily do a lot for
them, and it certainly CAN do way
the fuck more for
them.
mircea_popescu: -people it can
thrive amongst, it's still personally disabling.
mircea_popescu: whole "work-years", entire "departments" could readily be replaced by you know, half hour's worth of sed ;
they aren't because us corporatelandia mostly exists as makework,
to create
the illusion for millions of ambitious derps
that
they're "doing something" lest
they
take
to
the streets and start
throwing rocks. nevertheless, even if
the cutting legs is systematically needed in socialism,
to crate
the sort of helpless vat
mircea_popescu: the fundamental problems are
that cli-iliteracy is a serious, life-changing disability. in
terms of severity, blindness compares, deafness does not. obviously
the afflicted are scarcely aware, but
this doesn't mean
they're not afflicted.
mircea_popescu: obviously
to a large degree you'll have
to support your people, so you'll be working with
their
things
to begin
transitioning
to sane
things as a matter of necessity.
mircea_popescu: i don't
think
there's a mandatory
time where you must irc, anymore
than i
think
there's a mandatory
time when eg people from #ossasepia must
trilema or anything.
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 18:42:14 dorion: One middleground we've looked at pivoting
to is using a server with
tmux session sharing combined with a voice or video call.
That will provide a "classroom" experience for both instructor and student from
the comfort/convenience of
the home office.
mircea_popescu:
http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2020-01-24#1957178 << not like it's forbidden or anything. i'm not saying you should marry all
these people or anything like
that. i
think
the way of looking at it is
the central problem, once
that's well anchored
the specific ways you go about it in a circumstance or another's you know, a matter of circumstance.
mircea_popescu: what will you say ? "sorry, we gales only" ? as opposed
to "yes dood, here,
ten lines of awk. we'll go
through what it does next we meet" ? hm ?
mircea_popescu: ask everyone, from obscure shitholistan small lawyers
to lobbes or nicoleci or anyone you meet,
they can
tell you.
mircea_popescu: look at
the expansion angle : if
ten days after you've sat down, dude says, "um... so my whole business is fucked by
this data conversion problem", as
they ALL FUCKING ARE, you must have lived under a rock somewhere if you believe "western world" "business" in its daily practice at
the office is ANYTHING but
trying
to deal with data formats
mircea_popescu: build it around
the relationship,
their building,
their lifecycle,
their needs. do not build it around
the imaginary "point",
that isn't.
mircea_popescu: so my proposal is rather
to look at
the matter not as much as you're in
the business of
TEACHING LINUX (while getting
together), but in
the business of GETTING
TOGETHER (while for instance
teaching linux, or gales, or bitcoin, or whatever is needed)
mircea_popescu: if instead of
taking actual women
to actual cages and stocks i joined
the choir invisible, and "did"
TWICE, whatever,
ten
thousand
times "as many", except you know, "not physically"
to use an euphemism... woudl you be impressed with how much i've progressed ? would i be
ten
thiousand
times better if instead of being real i collapsed into wholly imaginaey ?
mircea_popescu: but if you don't do
that, "we don't know how
to distinguish", "all abstractions are in principle just as good as any others" and so on.
mircea_popescu: so boggle with me at
the sheer insanity of unleashed abstraction :
the moment you put it in human frame,
the moment you
tie it down
to
the sanity engine of
the brain,
the part
that ~actually~ works of it, having been honed into working
through endless millenia of practice, having its capacity
to distinguish right from wrong and correct from dumb evolved into existence, suddenly it's all fucking self-obvious.
mircea_popescu: yet look at it in
the cold, blue light of logic : between
these
three categories, (men and women in an atomic soup), (men jacking off in front of
the computer
to images of women it presents), (women cavorting naked in man's livingroom) and
these
three categories, (noobs and experts in an atomic soup), (noobs wanking on reddit
to images of experts it presents), (experts
teaching noob computers in noob's livingroom)
the rela
mircea_popescu: honestly, i believe
the being
together part is actually more important
than
the "teaching linux" or "sticking it in her" or "playing with stocks and wheels" and whatnot.
mircea_popescu: yet what sort of fucking is
that, ~if she's not even
there~ ?
mircea_popescu: physical presence also limits me wrt
to
the sluts i can fuck, both in regards
to variety (for instance,
the
typical redditard chronical masturbator "has sex" with a much greater variety of women
that never heard of him) and in regards
to whatever
the fuck i can catch from
them. like say
the common cold,
the fewer actual women you physically meet,
the less variety of colds you'll get. obviously
the subway is RIGHT OUT!!!
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 18:41:37 dorion: With
that being said, physical presence limits us, both from clients we can work with and, as we grow, instructors we can onboard, e.g.
spyked.
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 18:42:14 dorion: One middleground we've looked at pivoting
to is using a server with
tmux session sharing combined with a voice or video call.
That will provide a "classroom" experience for both instructor and student from
the comfort/convenience of
the home office.
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 18:39:46 dorion: mircea_popescu I hope I've not waited
too long, but I'm ready
to ask you about
the
face to face structure jfw and I started with for jwrd.
jfw: I liked your description of ownership in
that series
too btw.
trinque: yes, you own it or you don't, and we don't get
to put fig-leaves over our lack of ownership
trinque: you must hear me with
the series pounding on
the fact
that "found object, labelled" is not enough.
trinque: and we with
the OS project must solve more of
the latter.
trinque: it's
that "oh god linux is a fractal hellscape so I will airgap" solves some problems, and by way of cosmic fact not all
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 20:13:36 jfw:
http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955683 -
this is not necessarily
the case
though, no? lock in correspondent addresses up front, or gpg keys
to verify delivery instructions offline, or send address by courier, whatever. Airgap does not solve all problems, obviously. Shooting yourself in
the foot is not
the gunsmith's fault is it?
trinque: and I'd have said "mod6 what
the fuck,
there are already classes for keys" and
then by god, we'd have babby's first culture brewing by lunch
trinque: and ftr my word is not law. if you were sane you'd have said "hey
trinque, I am
thinking of introducing
this class" and arguing with me why it should be introduced.
snsabot: Logged on 2017-10-13 11:32:29
trinque:
the introduction of new classes should be perma-banned
dorion meant
to pm
that
to jfw, but no matter.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-12-19 02:04:30 mp_en_viaje: i mean uh.
the word's
the same, ye olde beran, but
the participle / past
tense of it is "borne" in all cases when you're not
talking of actual birth.
jfw: AFAIK even
the ol' USA has not quite reached
the point where you're still liable even if you put
the "warning: hot coffee is hot" warning on
the hot coffee
jfw:
http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955683 -
this is not necessarily
the case
though, no? lock in correspondent addresses up front, or gpg keys
to verify delivery instructions offline, or send address by courier, whatever. Airgap does not solve all problems, obviously. Shooting yourself in
the foot is not
the gunsmith's fault is it?
jfw acknowledges he's a ways behind here, will
try
to find a balance between underinformed and overdelayed responses...
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 18:39:58 dorion:
To provide context,
the main reason we started with
this is because Gales as an environment is pure
text, so
the command line must be used. For
the most part,
the people we're prospecting don't have command line experience.
jfw:
http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2020-01-24#1957173 - regarding
the "because"
there:
there was perhaps a degree of
teaching it because we'd built it, but I see it more
the other way - a
text-only Linux being a good choice for
the job specifically because it doesn't have
the GUI crutch and CLI illiteracy is one of
the bigger barriers
that otherwise intelligent people face
to using serious
dorion: (I'm not saying one's better
than
the other, just pointing
that it exists.)
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 13:14:56 mod6:
The howto document now requires
that you have Ada on your environment before you build, and
the builder will also need
to build starter_v_2 first, before any other steps are
to be completed.
dorion: mod6 you see yourself managing
to keep yourself free of 9-5 longer
term ?
dorion: Does
this shift make sense
to you ? Or is it still silly in ways I'm not seeing ?
dorion: Panama does have a more old school, meet in person culture, so we see face
to face still as a good option for building long-term relationships, e.g. makes going for a drink after class
that much easier, but cutting
the number in half rather
than
the full 25.
dorion: On
top of
that we plan
to move IRC from around session 20, where it was with
the first batch,
to somewhere between sessions 5-10 and make
that
the primary, or ideally only, communication channel.
dorion: One middleground we've looked at pivoting
to is using a server with
tmux session sharing combined with a voice or video call.
That will provide a "classroom" experience for both instructor and student from
the comfort/convenience of
the home office.
dorion: With
that being said, physical presence limits us, both from clients we can work with and, as we grow, instructors we can onboard, e.g.
spyked.
dorion: We build
them up from an environment
they're used
to, but also heavily stress practice of
the commands and
text editor.
dorion: The lectures and course materials - we provide both digital and hard copy resources - were built around
this structure. We've provided hard copies of lectures/in class exerices and homework, in part because
they've
typically never used a
text editor (though vimtutor is part of
the early homework) and pencil and paper brings
them back
to a more familiar learning modality.
dorion: At
the start, basics like remembering where spaces go in command syntax and
the difference between slashes and dashes can
trip
them up.
Thus, sitting next
to
them a) gives
them some assurance, b) allows
the instructor's feedback loop
to be shortened because he sees exactly where
the mistake is being made and c) makes keeping
the sessions within 90 minutes more feasible.
dorion: To provide context,
the main reason we started with
this is because Gales as an environment is pure
text, so
the command line must be used. For
the most part,
the people we're prospecting don't have command line experience.
dorion: mircea_popescu I hope I've not waited
too long, but I'm ready
to ask you about
the
face to face structure jfw and I started with for jwrd.
mod6: I won't be back around until later
today, but i'll check back in later.
mod6: The howto document now requires
that you have Ada on your environment before you build, and
the builder will also need
to build starter_v_2 first, before any other steps are
to be completed.
mod6: mircea_popescu: Ok, I have published my
trb keccak regrind on
the bitcoin.foundation site. It comes with
the following: 1. Update
to original genesis.vpatch - removes
the UTF charater. 2. Added mod6_privkey_tools.vpatch (unchanged fro
the original ML posting by myself.) 3. A manifest file. 4. I've also updated
the howto document on
thebitcoin.foundation.
mircea_popescu: "waiting
to fo into keccak".
there's no fucking waiting. do it, do it now, and stop with
the infantile bullshit.
the republic isn't optional, nor is it
trying
to persuade
the infant in you.
mircea_popescu: but it's a fact : stop
trying
to put yourself in
the way, it will not stop anything and it will fuck you iup.
mircea_popescu: no fucking clue why your ferrocraneum manages
to conceal from you
the plain obviousness of
this ; no fucking idea what you make of all
the other mangled bodies of like idiots scattered about, nor of
the actual pain you feel and have been feeling.
mircea_popescu: stop putting yourself in
the way of progress,
the only
thing you'll get out of it is your own mangled body.
mircea_popescu: mod6, why are you looking for a lord
to "doubleckeck your work" ~outside~ of
the process
through which
this is done here ?
mod6: thx, for denoting
the offline component in scheme.
ossabot: Logged on 2020-01-24 00:20:48 mod6: I am also aware of
the wallet work
that has been on-going in python by gbw. Maybe
this gets folded into
that?
mod6: Upon resoltion of
the privkey_tools question, will happily add it
to
the current archive of signed Keccak
TRB Vptaches.
mod6: Also, mircea_popescu, I do have
the
the entire
trb
tree (with exception of privkey_tools) signed and ready
to go in Keccak. Has been since last January. I havne't been able
to find a Lord who will double check my work
though.
mod6: I am also aware of
the wallet work
that has been on-going in python by gbw. Maybe
this gets folded into
that?
mod6: Anyway, I'm open
to another discussion around
the privkey
tools vpatch. For what it's worth, I
think
TRB sorely needs it. But again,
the whole discussion about
the wallet.
a111: Logged on 2017-09-14 05:30
trinque been spelunking in
the
trb innards a while, close
to wrapped up on a few little
tools
to go hexstring->privkey->pubkey->addr relying solely on existing
trb innards.
snsabot: Logged on 2017-10-13 11:32:29
trinque:
the introduction of new classes should be perma-banned
mod6: Let me see if I can dig up
trinque's objection here quick.