log☇︎
152800+ entries in 1.077s
decimation: the only 'fix' in that case is a separate box that serves time, under your own control
asciilifeform: you go to war with the pogo you have, not the pogo you wish you had, to borrow a bushism
decimation: well, that's a difficulty
decimation: but apparently setting it with a sextant is also a terrible idea?
asciilifeform: if you set the clock based on what is happening on the bitcoin network in any way, you are then in a state of sin.
decimation: and the node feeding bullshit would be easily identified by a running bitcoind
decimation: I agree but the enemy would have to know that this is a pogo vs. other bitcoin node
asciilifeform: if you allow purported blocks to set your rtc, you are setting yourself up for a rewind attack
decimation: over time, a chain is built which contains timestamps and relative timestamps from the pogo
Adlai: asciilifeform: actually, it also happens to non-crackpot altcoins (if such a thing exists), and multipools need to take care not to mine them too hard and kill their own geese
decimation: yes, connect to a couple of remote nodes, wait for several blocks to verify (while keeping your own clock)
asciilifeform: must understand, time is presently a criterion in whether a block is a block
decimation: asciilifeform: what about waiting for a few hours to observe several blocks upon pogo boot?
punkman: so I use a lot of hashing power for 1 hour and then make you wait 1 month for next block?
asciilifeform: as for why anyone would willingly move the target by solving a harder-than-required one - this ought to be obvious
asciilifeform: so target would move once sufficient work matches a harder target
assbot: 11 results for 'onerng' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=onerng
asciilifeform: say, you get n blocks at a given target, and then the bit slides.
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 11:26:51; punkman: difficulty target is a number
asciilifeform: 'gets its time from the most recent block it accepts' is a logical impossibility given the current algo for 'accept'
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 10:58:01; mircea_popescu: asciilifeform re the entire timing discussion : suppose the pogo gets started always with a realtime switch, -time=14blablabla, and after that gets its time from the most recent block it accepts and checks for next ones being within +-7200 seconds.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1190838 << pogo has to work when plugged into the wall! what 'switch' ?!! and you cannot learn ~anything~ about the current time from a purported block. this is circular logic!1111 block is only valid ~if~ within 2h of current time. any backflow can and will result in enemies 'nudging' the time ☝︎
mats: nobody can take a joke anymore
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla a, right, volatility went up right then
mircea_popescu: in any case i recall f.mpif had an investment with a derivative something for a few months.
mircea_popescu: the names of the places they'll never see. what exactly is the difference between an academitard and a housewife watching discovery channel i shall never know.
mircea_popescu: then stolfi wonders whether i want to be this or that title. as if a title is in any way useful or related to me.
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 07:51:18; punkman: "professional scholars of international relations" "30 percent of American researchers in the field say that they have a working knowledge of no language other than English, and more than half say that they rarely or never cite non-English sources in their work."
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1190800 << which explains why they gotta be both "professionals" and "scholars'. random schmucks not a good enough descriptor, specifically ebcause it fits so well. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 04:26:43; *: asciilifeform confesses that he did not know this proof, and, as a student, wasted a great deal of time trying to devise such a thing
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1190669 << there are so many of these by now, all it takes is a little phuctor scratching to send the hive crazy. ☝︎
mircea_popescu: the "press" is on a repeater mode with that crud
assbot: Bitcoin in Argentina : exactly nothing to do with the derps on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ha9vyF )
Adlai: vanity address of a stressed tester
punkman: shinohai imagines punkman as a Spartan << here have a cretan instead http://gallery.photo.net/photo/4849567-md.jpg
mircea_popescu: lmao decimation ends up putting a dime in the pot ?
mircea_popescu: (yes, there's a smartness of the dumb, like there's a richness of the poor and a cleanliness of the filthy and honesty of politicians and so on and so forth.)
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 02:26:24; asciilifeform: thestringpuller: unless i seriously misunderstand, 50%+ of the hash rate belongs to folks ~who aren't even running bitcoin~ but a toystore version
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1190423 << experimentally, i have a lot more faith in things that barely survive than in Britannia eternal. experimentally, the former do survive, the latter crash on the jagged shores of time. ☝︎
mircea_popescu: for students of the bitcoin protocol actually interested in learning how it works, create a list of all block hashes, calculate implied difficulty on that basis, compare to actual difficulty at the time and calculate variance etc. nice graphs to be had.
punkman: difficulty target is a number ☟︎
mircea_popescu: in that difficulty is a statistical measure and statistics of sets of one is undefined.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/nodes/195.211.154.159-8333/ << lulz mebbe worth a write-up ?
shinohai imagines punkman as a Spartan
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 00:13:16; asciilifeform: unrelated: folks competing for mircea_popescu's 1 btc prize for therealbitcoin callgraph can strike 'egypt' utility off the list. it is a worthless pile of shit, which produces worthless piles of shit (at least for cpp proggy)
mircea_popescu: shinohai unrelated things tho. a tx is a tx, it charges by byte.
punkman: "I run the restaurant from 1996, its a family business. I work here with my father and my mother. We only cook traditional Greek food. We accept Bitcoin for payments. They have come 6-8 people pay with Bitcoin from Spain, France, Italy, Ireland, Luxembourg but i hope for more people with Bitcoins"
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1190265 << a very stupid system incidentally. mirroring the unixtime idiocy. just take the cesium, base everytrhing on that. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 00:09:17; decimation: unfortunately blockheight is only a solid concept in retrospect
mircea_popescu: which is a sort of macaque.
mircea_popescu: i think we should have a network vote.
mircea_popescu: obviously, a kludge.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform re the entire timing discussion : suppose the pogo gets started always with a realtime switch, -time=14blablabla, and after that gets its time from the most recent block it accepts and checks for next ones being within +-7200 seconds. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-07-2015#1190161 << roflmao. "oh hello we are a cutting edge bleedin' tech company. what we do is we put tickets in cloudflare." ☝︎
jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1190768 therealaltcoin *does* have a mechanism to scale down difficulty. plenty good does it do. ☝︎
assbot: Modern Art Was Used As a Torture Technique in Prison Cells During the Spanish Civil War | Open Culture ... ( http://bit.ly/1dJi6kp )
punkman: "professional scholars of international relations" "30 percent of American researchers in the field say that they have a working knowledge of no language other than English, and more than half say that they rarely or never cite non-English sources in their work." ☟︎
trinque: a couple nasty ones in there https://security.gentoo.org/
Vexual: i got in on that private guam pipe, that was a winner
cazalla: prob only because it was a joint 4corners/fairfax story
cazalla: so i hear, took a shot gun to the face and walked away unscatched, prob bullshit story
cazalla: both of em were a bit beat up
Vexual: to have been a fly on the wall
cazalla: yeah, that lee guy uses it as proof he has a solid reputation in the bitcoin community.. hai guyz i run a bitcoin meetup so pls gief me 20 mirrion dorrah
trinque: might take a swing at it
asciilifeform: possibly ben_vulpes or trinque might give it a shot
decimation: asciilifeform: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5373714/generate-calling-graph-for-c-code < might be a working candidate
mats: have a good one
mats: i was under the impression 'diff' implements a variation on 'needleman-wunsch'
asciilifeform confesses that he did not know this proof, and, as a student, wasted a great deal of time trying to devise such a thing ☟︎
asciilifeform: e.g., my current colleagues were very surprised when i told them about needleman-wunsch and how one can make a non-retarded binary 'diff'
asciilifeform: some smirking 'plum book' stuffed shirt who thinks that his ph.d. makes him a god
decimation: how do you maintain such a dht without giving enemy a dictionary of ips to attack
asciilifeform: decimation: for a successful example of this, see 'kademlia'
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah 'snow' seems to try to maintain a dht across the peers
asciilifeform: i have no wish to be a coolie.
asciilifeform: because they are expressions of surrender, of 'willing to live with' a pit of liquid shit
asciilifeform: mats: as a rule, i am entirely uninterested in 'mitigations' ☟︎
asciilifeform: decimation: looks like a cheap clone of tor-onion
decimation: "snow is a layer 3 virtual network that abstracts the underlying network and allows public keys to be used in place of IP addresses. "
asciilifeform: decimation: thing is, we don't have a network where you connect by key instead of by ip
decimation: as in, a symmetric pair for time transmission?
decimation: or a large collection of them run by enthusiastic hobbyists
Vexual: i cant see a solution mut mp's
decimation: the point about occultations is that you can get tables of when they are supposed to occur for your area. you don't need a fancy telescope, usually cheap bionoculars would suffice for observation
decimation: plus you need a static ip
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: thread was about how bitcoin as it exists is very much designed around 'political time' being a knowable and generally agreed-on thing
ben_vulpes: leastaways without a wholesale replacement of sync mechanism plus god only knows what else eventually.
Vexual: 3 months became a heady meatwot?
gribble: brendafdez was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 14 weeks, 5 days, 4 hours, 33 minutes, and 8 seconds ago: <brendafdez> mircea_popescu it works now. Anyway the IP I'm on now is one of a public AP, it shouldnt be whitelisted. I'll later give you my home IP, and BingoBoingo has my VPS IP already. I didn't know you were filtering.
bagels7: well I was into IT then I got a sign from god and went a different path, physical, mental and spiritual fitness. body/mind/spirit all well
decimation: one wonders how shitty lisp machine that emacs is emulating gets into such a sad state
decimation: 00:01:03 mircea_popescu: because yes, we're fucktarded enough to not notice what's proposed here is a closed f2pool - antpool loop. they're over there in their own
decimation: 00:00:40 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-07-2015#1187182 << add lying schmucks to a degree not experienced since kindergarten on pirate island. the ☝︎
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: unless i seriously misunderstand, 50%+ of the hash rate belongs to folks ~who aren't even running bitcoin~ but a toystore version ☟︎
trinque: mats: could write a view that generates your stats, then a materialized view which is refreshed at an interval with "refresh materialized view" or w/e it is
asciilifeform: (from, say, a smoke detector)
asciilifeform: incidentally, today i invented (hypothetical) very cheap 'clock': an sram with a beta source glued on top
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: this makes next block work a non obtainable resource tho?
trinque: mats: depending on the situation, maybe a materialized view is called for