139200+ entries in 1.04s
mircea_popescu: nd him were worthy of being told about it. for all you know the notions of "progress and science" incumbent in the perspective you propose are so much masturbatory jizz, and in point of fact intelligent people share their thoughts exactly like
a comedian shares his routine : to friends, in
a social environment, for the same reasons in the same ways.
☟︎ assbot: Logged on 09-09-2015 05:17:33; gabriel_laddel: "On the historical evidence I shall be short. Carl Friedrich Gauss, the Prince of Mathematicians but also somewhat of
a coward, was certainly aware of the fate of Galileo —and could probably have predicted the calumniation of Einstein— when he decided to suppress his discovery of non-Euclidean geometry, thus leaving it to Bolyai and Lobatchewsky to receive the flak. It is probably more illuminati
mircea_popescu:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=09-09-2015#1267314 << for the record, ascribing purpose to phenomena is basically animism 2.0, and just as medieval as the other thing. for all you know gauss was not "
a bit of
a coward", and your p[rojection into the future whebn discussing einstein more indicative of an anachronistic mind than some sort of valuable intuition. for all you know gauss just didn't think the idiots arou
☝︎ mircea_popescu: however, it's fun to fish in
a swamp with regexp. when you feel so inclined.
mircea_popescu: occasionally i fish through the mire, as
a curiosity thing. but it's quite different
BingoBoingo: parts for
a single car, and that car would have broken down on the first trip to Giza."
BingoBoingo: Especially relevant for gabriel_laddel: "Babbage, even with remarkably generous support for his time, could not produce his great arithmetical machine. His idea was sound enough, but construction and maintenance costs were then too heavy. Had
a Pharaoh been given detailed and explicit designs of an automobile, and had he understood them completely, it would have taxed the resources of his kingdom to have fashioned the thousands of
☟︎ BingoBoingo: s reading might well shy away from an examination calculated to show how much of the previous month's efforts could be produced on call. Mendel's concept of the laws of genetics was lost to the world for
a generation because his publication did not reach the few who were capable of grasping and extending it; and this sort of catastrophe is undoubtedly being repeated all about us, as truly significant attainments become lost in the
assbot: Logged on 30-07-2015 01:39:10; mircea_popescu:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-07-2015#1217142 << doesn't have to be
a one size fits all. but if your software can't be built, your software doesn't exist. and it is still upon you to explain how you expect users to use your thing - nobody is going to go do the guesswork of "what the author might have meant", and ESPECIALLY no sane person should ever guess what "obvious" means for anyone else
BingoBoingo: How can one even pretend to have
a hypertext spec or its substitute without citing <em>Vannevar Bush</em>
trinque: this whole email thing is
a turd
BingoBoingo: <gabriel_laddel> trinque: I have
a listing of programs associated with my PGP identity, you can make references to them, and people will be able to see them (or not) based on my trust relationship with them... << It is essential for WoT to exist that I can safely point at the enemy's words and bury them in sulfur
gabriel_laddel: trinque: I have
a listing of programs associated with my PGP identity, you can make references to them, and people will be able to see them (or not) based on my trust relationship with them. Your "references" can be any arbitary computation, buut probably some standards will evolve (e.g., we don't check sexprs who pass some test of being
a plist of the structure (:name ... :version ...)).
gabriel_laddel: trinque: you can only make
a reference with 'respect to me'
trinque: gabriel_laddel has
a CLOS object which represents his number of slithey toves
mircea_popescu: 50 times
a day i go for it on random sites and they're too web 0.5 for it
BingoBoingo: <gabriel_laddel> I don't see how you'll be able to reference things on WoTnet further than "the joe I know with this pub key" << Publication. Paper and film only have the problem that they are slow and take too much volume for their information density. Why should machines not offer
a path at least as safe.
trinque: what is the addressing mechanism for
a world of clos objects?
mircea_popescu: (ie, that's the point of
a game in the general sense : to not let you solve problems the obvious way. (which in this context would just be skill++ or something equivalent))
gabriel_laddel: trinque: Right now I can press C-t m, pull up
a "map" of all "research nodes" and "lessons" and right click to get
a menu from which I can run the associated program.
trinque: gabriel_laddel: how do I refer to your CLOS object which represents
a paper you have written? I would like to direct people to it from my CLOS object representing
a blog post.
mircea_popescu: "angela", stop being
a derp, we need chinese speakers for better jobs than mashing hands on keyboards to produce email addresses.
☟︎ BingoBoingo: I have not seen
a graphical WWW browser other than Dillo that does not execute any documents.
trinque: and that I can see is readily built on
a proper lisp system
BingoBoingo: <trinque> anyhow, I have made myself sleepy. I think most here would be satisfied with
a simple hypertext system to replace the JS monstrosity of today. << Gopher is beautiful
trinque: anyhow, I have made myself sleepy. I think most here would be satisfied with
a simple hypertext system to replace the JS monstrosity of today.
BingoBoingo: <trinque> I am trying to make
a point of BingoBoingo's lamentations << I grad school I was in serious discussions where we lamented fiber optic was not used for project film over hundreds of miles.
☟︎ BingoBoingo: <gabriel_laddel> how many LoC is nano? <<
a large portion is what those LOC do
trinque: I am trying to make
a point of BingoBoingo's lamentations
trinque: why should I have to run
a program *of yours* at all to get certain information from you?
trinque: gabriel_laddel: if I don't know you, I may still want to listen to you for
a moment, to see what you're about
pete_dushenski: google mostly creates 'services' for 'free', undermines field, then mothballs and leaves
a competitive void
☟︎ mircea_popescu: and if it is fouind behaving like
a pipe it gets shot in the head.
trinque: various presentations for various kinds of data yes, one of them
a link
pete_dushenski: “Some of them, really, is un-rapeable. I look at them and go, ‘No, you don’t want that.'” “If it was my daughter, then I would have killed Bill Cosby. But sitting back looking at it, I think it’s
a money hustle.”
trinque:
a safe hypertext system could easily be tossing sepxrs over the wire with *no* code, just piles of data
BingoBoingo: For
a while I did girls for money, was
a huge hassel, not worth it, because the girls were huge. Giggolo is
a dead end.
trinque: ^ guy is just more interested in his lisp system than
a particular app on it. I contend the mega-app on any computer now and in the future will be
a hypertext system.
BingoBoingo: Executable things can go in the Lispy read, sign, check signatures, and execute world. Documents need to be in the don't give
a fuck read the derp and laugh universe
mircea_popescu:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=09-09-2015#1267251 << moreover, if gpg messages were code rather than data i'd have gpg rewritten to
a thing that keeps messages strictly as data. BingoBoingo exactly has it : there is no room nor need for every bit of text to be "really code". i want my nano to be UNABLE to do anything whatsoever with the text. which is why i use nano rather than emacs.
☝︎ gabriel_laddel: trinque: the whole lispm is
a "browser" if you go that direction with words.
BingoBoingo: <gabriel_laddel> trinque: I don't see how this is
a problem? << I am
a librarian,
a collector. I want to collect information without collecting
a bunch of executable rat turds
BingoBoingo: For safety though it should not be
a part of that, but merely interpreted through
a progam in that
trinque: and on the other end, gabriel_laddel will tell you that's
a (small) subset of his lispy metaverse
BingoBoingo: <trinque> hypertext you understand is just an extension of what writing already was. << Seriously there is
a specific harmless language or subset of language necessary for playing the presentation role. Something that by it's Phoosis can be presented safely
gabriel_laddel: trinque: so someone could write and distribute
a "~google search" that looks over the CLIM streams of all GUIs it knows about.
assbot: Logged on 09-09-2015 04:35:09; gabriel_laddel: there is
a partially complete js->parenscript transpiler so that you don't have to read js
gabriel_laddel: Sure, I send you
a sexpr containing
a program you can load.
trinque: mabye we're all running the same lisp program, but you have to have
a space within which (distributed CLOS??) the thing we're doing poorly on the www can be done better
trinque: you don't just write in isolation; you write in
a vast context of interrelated concepts
trinque: don't care what you use; give me
a universal reference to *THAT* concept
trinque: has
a very useful meaning.
trinque: gabriel_laddel: hypertext is
a word.
BingoBoingo: Zool is not
a container, it is another devil.
trinque: BingoBoingo: I would much rather download someone's signed lisp program and run that locally than have this horrible half-creature that grabs code from everywhere, tries to "sandbox" it, and runs without so much as
a gpg fart in the wind
☟︎ trinque: now that's
a place to begin talking.
BingoBoingo: trinque: I may be drunk so I may not have started my objections at the right place. Whatever code you privately jizz onto servers is yours. Code you try to make other people execute is
a crime.
punkman: trinque: the web still exists; gotta deal with that monstrosity somehow << need
a sane browser first, without JS. then we can start writing custom handlers for heathen websites that we are unable to view.
☟︎☟︎ assbot:
A white guy named Michael couldn’t get his poem published. Then he became Yi-Fen Chou. - The Washington Post ... (
http://bit.ly/1L0tS81 )
trinque: I would agree that where the written word is concerned, please do not give me
a single-page JS app
BingoBoingo: But even in LISP people there is
a divide between machine language and "people" language. One can not adequately enjoy the lamentations of enemy women in machine language
BingoBoingo: <trinque> XML syntax is
a heinous misstep that affords little, demands much << It is, and When gabriel_laddel talks massamune unfortunately I read XML or XML with paren
gabriel_laddel: e bit further back, to the Middle Ages. One of its characteristics was that 'reasoning by analogy' was rampant; another characteristic was almost total intellectual stagnation, and we now see why the two go together.
A reason for mentioning this is to point out that, by developing
a keen ear for unwarranted analogies, one can detect
a lot of medieval thinking today." --
https://www.cs.utexas.edu/~EWD/transcriptions/ gabriel_laddel: "On the historical evidence I shall be short. Carl Friedrich Gauss, the Prince of Mathematicians but also somewhat of
a coward, was certainly aware of the fate of Galileo —and could probably have predicted the calumniation of Einstein— when he decided to suppress his discovery of non-Euclidean geometry, thus leaving it to Bolyai and Lobatchewsky to receive the flak. It is probably more illuminating to go
a littl
☟︎ trinque: supposing your syntax has
a "here be dragons" token
trinque: in my opinion one is
a subset of the other
trinque: XML syntax is
a heinous misstep that affords little, demands much
trinque: and that was more or less looking for
a reason
trinque: never found
a use for them in my own code to date
gabriel_laddel: Partially through translating the imaxima LaTeX stuff such that you can take
a maxima AST, view it as LaTeX, maxima syntax or lisp all at the CLIM listener.
trinque: I taught someone
a bit of scheme recently (alongside SICP) and used roughly that approach.
gabriel_laddel: trinque: at the beginning of (I'd assume "
A Realistic Solution to the Education Problem" but don't see it there)?
gabriel_laddel: punkman: so when you create
a new format or something in ALGOL you have to create
a new parser right?
gabriel_laddel: punkman: the whole DSL thing doesn't have
a name in lisp because it isn't needed
BingoBoingo: <gabriel_laddel> punkman: you lose the full power of the programming language. << In nearly every case
a 3rd part gives you code you don't want
a full language. You want
a plainly crippled language.
BingoBoingo: I'm just wondering who at all should have to eat javascript asbestos to become
a Great Red Dragon of the Information age.
gabriel_laddel: Want to launch
a 3D visualization from
a button press in the back of the settings menu? Sure, why not.
gabriel_laddel: the correct model is that you never have
a DSL or "mini-language"